No interest in converting but reading the Qran

[Aamer]

It can't be answered so easily in SIkhi because, depending on a Sikh's understanding, the person will either be reincarnated into a lower form, or he will simply die having never known the sublime connection to the Creator. Our best chance is for justice on this earth. I don't think he's been brought to justice but who am I to judge another culture's values and justice system.

The Creative Force in Sikhi doesn't judge, and there isn't a heaven or hell. So you see it's comparing apples and oranges.

Somebody needs to judge. I know God will judge him in the end and there is no escaping Gods justice. But this piece of s*** raped and kilted his own five year old daughter. A beautiful little girl who needed the PROTECTION of her father. Not this!! How can you say "Who am I to judge?" Burn him, torture him, castrate him. Let justice be done. We can't let him walk out and do this to even one more girl. Take a stand. Don't hide behind "Who am I to judge?" Hippy logic. Let the pig suffer while still on Earth. And then let God take over after we kill him. I think that's fair. You disagree?

 

[Treks]

I'm not hiding behind hippy logic. I meant 'who am I to judge the country's laws'. I disagree with their laws - I think his penalty does not fit the crime. People will say 'how can you judge, you're looking at a totally separate culture, you're just looking at it through your western feminist eyes blahblahblah'. I didn't want to engage in that discussion. And if the laws are based on Sharia it gets even more complicated. And it was NOT the question.

Justice should be pursued here on earth to the best of our ability. Personally I agree with your decription of justice. I don't believe in hell, I don't believe in a God who judges. You asked for a Sikh perspective on the issue and I gave you one.

 

[FearGod]

Thank you Gharib. I'm guessing you have been to Saudi Arabia and witnessed this superiority complex they have. Let me make it clear that I am no more racist than anyone else here. I think we should all hate each other on an individual basis. Not because of nationality or because the color of our skin. I have met amazing people in Saudi. In Medina, an old man forced me to come have dinner at his house because he claimed I was of his tribe. Amazingly, all of his sons and nephews looked exactly like me. Amazing people. I felt like I was part of the family (maybe I was). I met a family on the road from Jeddah to Makkah, when our car got a flat tire, who made his sons change the tire, and yelled at one of his sons for looking in our car, because we had women in the car. But I've also seen Saudis grab private parts of my female relatives while on motor cycles. I've had to fight six Saudis at once because they were trying to molest my female relatives against their will. I've had Saudi police officers push me out of the line to use the restroom at Hajj just because they thought I was Pakistani. I've had Saudis try to push me out of the way I'm the line to get food at Hajj saying not to serve the Pakistani before the Saudi. They treat us like animals until I pull out my USA passport. Then they suddenly apologize and kiss my a**. I try to stay humble whenever I visit another country. But when being harassed beyond toleration in Makkah, I blew smoke in a Saudi police officers face and pulled out my US passport and put it against his face. He immediately apologized and left. I am fortunate to have that US passport. But what about all the good hearted Indian, Pakistani, African, Persian, Asian Muslims who don't. Is it right to treat them like animals? Is it right to molest and rape immigrant women because they have no rights? Is this justice? Is this Islam?

Keep in mind that my best friend is Saudi. I have many other Saudi friends too. But they are the few with a conscience, who fight for the rights of the poor, the immigrants and the pure hearted pilgrims. They are in the 10%. The other 90% are ignorant, disgusting, oppressive cave men of low intelligence. If Prophet Muhammad never came to these ignorant people, they'd still be burying their daughters. May Allah put the Kaaba back in the hands of Muslims. Peace!

Sorry that i can't believe your story about Hajj because i know tens who have visited Saudi Arabia for Hajj,no distinguish between who is Pakistani or American and try to show An American passport showing that you are a christian,do you think you'll be also allowed to enter Mecca just because of your passport is an American..

i don't think so.

 

[F0uad]

Thank you Gharib. I'm guessing you have been to Saudi Arabia and witnessed this superiority complex they have. Let me make it clear that I am no more racist than anyone else here. I think we should all hate each other on an individual basis. Not because of nationality or because the color of our skin. I have met amazing people in Saudi. In Medina, an old man forced me to come have dinner at his house because he claimed I was of his tribe. Amazingly, all of his sons and nephews looked exactly like me. Amazing people. I felt like I was part of the family (maybe I was). I met a family on the road from Jeddah to Makkah, when our car got a flat tire, who made his sons change the tire, and yelled at one of his sons for looking in our car, because we had women in the car. But I've also seen Saudis grab private parts of my female relatives while on motor cycles. I've had to fight six Saudis at once because they were trying to molest my female relatives against their will. I've had Saudi police officers push me out of the line to use the restroom at Hajj just because they thought I was Pakistani. I've had Saudis try to push me out of the way I'm the line to get food at Hajj saying not to serve the Pakistani before the Saudi. They treat us like animals until I pull out my USA passport. Then they suddenly apologize and kiss my a**. I try to stay humble whenever I visit another country. But when being harassed beyond toleration in Makkah, I blew smoke in a Saudi police officers face and pulled out my US passport and put it against his face. He immediately apologized and left. I am fortunate to have that US passport. But what about all the good hearted Indian, Pakistani, African, Persian, Asian Muslims who don't. Is it right to treat them like animals? Is it right to molest and rape immigrant women because they have no rights? Is this justice? Is this Islam?

Keep in mind that my best friend is Saudi. I have many other Saudi friends too. But they are the few with a conscience, who fight for the rights of the poor, the immigrants and the pure hearted pilgrims. They are in the 10%. The other 90% are ignorant, disgusting, oppressive cave men of low intelligence. If Prophet Muhammad never came to these ignorant people, they'd still be burying their daughters. May Allah put the Kaaba back in the hands of Muslims. Peace!

Then maybe rephrase your original statement i really doubt about the 90% but ok.

 

[Aamer]

Sorry that i can't believe your story about Hajj because i know tens who have visited Saudi Arabia for Hajj,no distinguish between who is Pakistani or American and try to show An American passport showing that you are a christian,do you think you'll be also allowed to enter Mecca just because of your passport is an American..

i don't think so.

Go to Hajj. See how the police behave. See how they treat the poor. I'm guessing the people you know stayed in the air conditioned tents with gourmet meals. I have seen countless injustices there and am only telling you what I saw. You can believe it or not. Go for yourself and leave your air conditioned tent looking like a non-Khaleej and then tell me what you see. Peace!

 

[Aamer]

Then maybe rephrase your original statement i really doubt about the 90% but ok.

Fouad,
Of course I don't have official statistics. I'm just guessing. Perhaps I'm off but I saw more evil than good in my time spent in that country. God bless.

 

[loverOfTruth]

Thank you Gharib. I'm guessing you have been to Saudi Arabia and witnessed this superiority complex they have. Let me make it clear that I am no more racist than anyone else here. I think we should all hate each other on an individual basis. Not because of nationality or because the color of our skin. I have met amazing people in Saudi. In Medina, an old man forced me to come have dinner at his house because he claimed I was of his tribe. Amazingly, all of his sons and nephews looked exactly like me. Amazing people. I felt like I was part of the family (maybe I was). I met a family on the road from Jeddah to Makkah, when our car got a flat tire, who made his sons change the tire, and yelled at one of his sons for looking in our car, because we had women in the car. But I've also seen Saudis grab private parts of my female relatives while on motor cycles. I've had to fight six Saudis at once because they were trying to molest my female relatives against their will. I've had Saudi police officers push me out of the line to use the restroom at Hajj just because they thought I was Pakistani. I've had Saudis try to push me out of the way I'm the line to get food at Hajj saying not to serve the Pakistani before the Saudi. They treat us like animals until I pull out my USA passport. Then they suddenly apologize and kiss my a**. I try to stay humble whenever I visit another country. But when being harassed beyond toleration in Makkah, I blew smoke in a Saudi police officers face and pulled out my US passport and put it against his face. He immediately apologized and left. I am fortunate to have that US passport. But what about all the good hearted Indian, Pakistani, African, Persian, Asian Muslims who don't. Is it right to treat them like animals? Is it right to molest and rape immigrant women because they have no rights? Is this justice? Is this Islam?

Keep in mind that my best friend is Saudi. I have many other Saudi friends too. But they are the few with a conscience, who fight for the rights of the poor, the immigrants and the pure hearted pilgrims. They are in the 10%. The other 90% are ignorant, disgusting, oppressive cave men of low intelligence. If Prophet Muhammad never came to these ignorant people, they'd still be burying their daughters. May Allah put the Kaaba back in the hands of Muslims. Peace!

Salaam...I can totally believe you. I have heard of first hand account stories of desis(people from India/Pakistan/Bangladesh) getting kicked out of a plane from Jeddah to Madinah (even after boarding) because a Saudi needed a seat - even though the desi guy had a confirmed ticket. Good Saudi brothers/sisters need to realize that these things happen and try to change the mentality of those people as much as possible.