Non-Americans, would you prefer U.S. style Healthcare?

[Sand Dancer]

And yet millions come to America as illegal immigrants in part because they want our health care. Then there are the thousands that come to the U.S. as medical tourists because we have some of the world's best doctors and clinics.

No, millions don't. To those south of us, we are the closest developed nation. Of course, those from developing nations would like it better in any developed nation, even if it's not as good as most other ones.

 

[England my lionheart]

Also, why or why not?

I voted no because if you don’t have healthcare insurance you can’t afford to pay,the UK NHS despite all of its problems is much better imo.

 

[Shaul]

No, millions don't. To those south of us, we are the closest developed nation. Of course, those from developing nations would like it better in any developed nation, even if it's not as good as most other ones.

There have been millions of illegal immigrants arrested trying to enter the U.S. since his administration began. That number is only those we know about and doesn't include those who entered undetected.
"Federal authorities are on pace to make more than 2.3 million arrests during the 2022 fiscal year, which ends Sept. 30. That will far exceed last year’s record of more than 1.7 million arrests."
Arrests along U.S.-Mexico border top 2 million a year for the first time

 

[Erebus]

And yet millions come to America as illegal immigrants in part because they want our health care. Then there are the thousands that come to the U.S. as medical tourists because we have some of the world's best doctors and clinics.

Medical tourists are far more likely to come from the US rather than go to it.

Over the last few years, medical tourism has gained popularity among highly industrialized countries such as the United States. The number of medical tourists from the United has increased from about 750,000 in 2007, to over 1.4 million a decade later in 2017.

A lack of health insurance is the most common factor for medical travel, but the report recognised a patient need for accessibility, experience focused offerings and an increasing desire for high quality care.

Americans prefer Mexico, Thailand, Costa Rica, Philippines or Panama for dental services or cosmetic surgeries due to their proximity. Southeast Asia and India are the choice destinations for orthopedic and cardiovascular cases due to the high quality of healthcare, and a significant number of U.S accredited hospitals and physicians.

Satisfied American patients reported gaining savings from 25% to 75% depending on the type of services required and can reach as high as 90%. Savings vary per country and depend on the type of procedure required.

Medical Tourism Statistics and Facts | Health-Tourism.com

Funny that Mexico is a favourite destination for Americans to visit for healthcare. Sort of flips the common narrative doesn't it?

 

[Father Heathen]

And yet millions come to America as illegal immigrants in part because they want our health care. Then there are the thousands that come to the U.S. as medical tourists because we have some of the world's best doctors and clinics.

Your example is people from third world nations, and they obviously aren't insured nor are they paying out of pocket for the healthcare offered in the U.S.
We may have some of the best doctors and clinics, but only for the wealthy. We're the only first world nation where medical debt is even a thing, and where people go without needed care because they can't afford it. People are either driven into poverty or into the grave, and that's ghoulish.
I think I'll trust the words of those who actually have universal healthcare, vs. dopey swill from the right-wing propaganda trough. The poll has spoken.

 

[Father Heathen]

Does that mean they can finally shut up every single election cycle about the dire need for funding roads and bridges, paying for schools, and healthcare?

Not until the things that need fixed and taken care of actually are. If we're the best nation I'm the world, let's act like it and address our problems.

 

[Father Heathen]

It's embarrassing how people double down on garbage even after it's been exposed for what it is.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Oh no the horror: taxes actually helping the community it's supposed to! How will we ever live?!/sarcasm

Right?! Plus, that ignores amount we pay for insurance and the healthcare itself.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

Does that mean they can finally shut up every single election cycle about the dire need for funding roads and bridges, paying for schools, and healthcare?

It's a far more practical need than adding to our nuclear arsenal and keeping the space aliens at Area 51 alive.

 

[Shaul]

Medical tourists are far more likely to come from the US rather than go to it.









Medical Tourism Statistics and Facts | Health-Tourism.com

Funny that Mexico is a favourite destination for Americans to visit for healthcare. Sort of flips the common narrative doesn't it?

By number, not by severity of procedure. So what?

 

[Shaul]

Your example is people from third world nations, and they obviously aren't insured nor are they paying out of pocket for the healthcare offered in the U.S.
We may have some of the best doctors and clinics, but only for the wealthy. We're the only first world nation where medical debt is even a thing, and where people go without needed care because they can't afford it. People are either driven into poverty or into the grave, and that's ghoulish.
I think I'll trust the words of those who actually have universal healthcare, vs. dopey swill from the right-wing propaganda trough. The poll has spoken.

People come to the United States for health care from all over the world, not just third world countries. The fact that so many come to the United States for health care is the real poll. And it has spoken.

 

[Erebus]

By number, not by severity of procedure. So what?

While cost is the main driver for medical tourism, in America gaps in or a complete lack of health insurance cause people to seek medical attention elsewhere. Procedures surrounding cosmetics, dentistry, fertility or even weight loss are commonly not viewed upon kindly by insurance companies. The following list of the top American foreign medical procedures will not surprise you as it is populated by these very procedures that have restricted access.

• Dentistry
• Cosmetic surgery
• In vitro fertilization (IVF)
• Weight loss
• Cardiovascular health
• Dermatology
• Liver & kidney transplants
• Spinal surgery

Emphasis mine. I would say that organ transplants and spinal surgery constitute severe procedures.

You're right though that most people who need immediate, emergency medical attention probably aren't going to travel abroad... obviously.

Also you've contradicted yourself:

By number, not by severity of procedure. So what?

People come to the United States for health care from all over the world, not just third world countries. The fact that so many come to the United States for health care is the real poll. And it has spoken.

Pick one.

 

[Father Heathen]

People come to the United States for health care from all over the world, not just third world countries. The fact that so many come to the United States for health care is the real poll. And it has spoken.

I'm going with our fellow RFers on this one. Their first hand accounts are far more trustworthy than some slanted, 3rd hand anecdote.

 

[Alien826]

I didn't answer the poll because I don't fit any one option. I do have experience of several of options though. Up to just over 30 years ago I lived in England. Since then, I have lived in the USA. I have a good friend that keeps me in touch with things in the UK. My sister lives in Denmark with her Danish husband.

England as I experienced it:

I never had to worry about getting medical care, or paying for it, if I needed it. Minor conditions, like my hemorrhoids, very uncomfortable but not life threatening, were subject to a very long wait (I was told 18 months). I had BUPA (private insurance) through my employer and the surgery was done in two weeks.

England as it is now:

Apparently FUBAR. Long waits and no regular check ups. The basic system is still in place, but time is running out. That makes it a neglected system not a bad one.

USA as an employee with benefits:

Good and prompt service, but with co-pays that didn't bother me but could be onerous for some. Worrying that some stuff was not covered, and the ever present fear of losing coverage if I got fired or left voluntarily to pursue uninsured employment.

USA as an employee with no benefits, someone on Medicaid, etc:

No direct experience, but based on some friends in that position, pretty rough. For example, although Medicaid is there for the poor, try finding a doctor that accepts it. I don't know a lot about Obamacare, I believe it has improved things somewhat.

USA under Medicare with a Medicare Advantage plan (now):

Excellent care, prompt treatment, built in yearly health checks, free tier 1 and 2 drugs. Undoubtedly the best healthcare I have received in my life. Co-pays are high and could be difficult for some. Example, I was prescribed PT for my arthritic shoulder and I was having two appointments a week until I discovered that each appointment was costing me $40. The pain wasn't too bad so I quit. Last year I was diagnosed with bladder cancer. It was caught very early and surgery followed immediately, cost about $700. No recurrence since. I get a check up where they look into my bladder every three months. It costs $295 each time.

USA generally:

No system that leaves any single person uncovered can be described as "good". It's great for those who are covered, but not so much for everyone else. Drug prices are ridiculous for those that don't have insurance, and not much fun for those insured and on the more expensive levels of drugs. The uninsured are charged ridiculous prices to make up for people that don't (can't) pay their bills. If you are caught between being poor enough for Medicaid and being covered at work, God help you.

Denmark:

Both my sister and her husband have MS. They have people come in to look after them three times a day. She is often taken into hospital for a few days with bladder infections (she has a permanent catheter). They pay nothing for any of this.

 

[Sand Dancer]

There have been millions of illegal immigrants arrested trying to enter the U.S. since his administration began. That number is only those we know about and doesn't include those who entered undetected.
"Federal authorities are on pace to make more than 2.3 million arrests during the 2022 fiscal year, which ends Sept. 30. That will far exceed last year’s record of more than 1.7 million arrests."
Arrests along U.S.-Mexico border top 2 million a year for the first time

I am in no way disputing that millions have come across the border, just the motive you give to them.

 

[Sand Dancer]

USA as an employee with benefits:

Good and prompt service, but with co-pays that didn't bother me but could be onerous for some. Worrying that some stuff was not covered, and the ever present fear of losing coverage if I got fired or left voluntarily to pursue uninsured employment.

So many people stay with a job they hate so they can keep their health insurance. Sad.

USA under Medicare with a Medicare Advantage plan (now):

Excellent care, prompt treatment, built in yearly health checks, free tier 1 and 2 drugs. Undoubtedly the best healthcare I have received in my life. Co-pays are high and could be difficult for some. Example, I was prescribed PT for my arthritic shoulder and I was having two appointments a week until I discovered that each appointment was costing me $40. The pain wasn't too bad so I quit. Last year I was diagnosed with bladder cancer. It was caught very early and surgery followed immediately, cost about $700. No recurrence since. I get a check up where they look into my bladder every three months. It costs $295 each time.

Adding to the sad fact that many doctors won't take any Medicaid products, some now won't take Medicare products.

 

[Shaul]

I'm going with our fellow RFers on this one. Their first hand accounts are far more trustworthy than some slanted, 3rd hand anecdote.

On the one hand are millions of people that have risked their very lives to come to the United States who presumably find its health care acceptable. On the other hand there are a tiny number of people who pushed a few buttons on their computer to answer a poll on RF. And you think the latter is more significant than the former. Bully for you.

 

[Father Heathen]

On the one hand are millions of people that have risked their very lives to come to the United States who presumably find its health care acceptable. On the other hand there are a tiny number of people who pushed a few buttons on their computer to answer a poll on RF. And you think the latter is more significant than the former. Bully for you.

Yeah, from the third world. Is that the benchmark you want to use for the U.S.?

 

[Shaul]

I am in no way disputing that millions have come across the border, just the motive you give to them.

Whatever other motives they have, their coming shows they find the United States health care no obstacle at the least. And it is entirely credible that they find the health care a draw. Either way that says the Unites States health care is good.

 

[Shaul]

Yeah, from the third world. Is that the benchmark you want to use for the U.S.?

I guess you haven't read my posts. If you had you would see that people have come from all over the world.