Non-existence vs an unknown afterlife

[Twilight Hue]

Number two for 200 Alex.

 

[SigurdReginson]

I'll step into the unknown... because I'm more curious than afraid.

A million times, this.

 

[YoursTrue]

Option 2. Dead ends are boring, and I’m kicking the bucket anyways.

I’ll take the red pill and find out how deep the rabbit hole goes.

I'd rather ask God to help me.

 

[Hockeycowboy]

Non-existence. I believe that’s what happens, anyways. (At least for a while [eons, maybe], until Jehovah God’s time comes & He ‘remembers’ us. — Job 14 10,13,14)

Take care.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I can only pick option 1. Although the thought experiment says that I can't know what the purported "afterlife" may be like, the one thing that I must presume about it is that it ought to be eternal. And eternity, without ever being able to let go, is not attractive to me.

 

[ChristineM]

This is just something I've been pondering lately. Imagine that on your deathbed, the Grim Reaper appears to you and offers you a choice:

Option 1. is that your death will result in the complete cessation of your consciousness. You may have left a mark on the world and be remembered by your loved ones but you effectively cease to exist.

Option 2. is that you pass on into the afterlife. However, the Reaper won't tell you what the afterlife entails. You're stepping into the unknown if you take this option.


Which would you choose and why?


Just as a note, I know that some people will be tempted to say something along the lines of, "Well I know what's going to happen after I die." For the sake of this thread please play along and assume that your choice is between non-existence and an entirely unknown afterlife.

I would be happy to have my time and let consciousness go at the end.

Why? There is no why, its just how it is

Who needs consciousness when my atoms will exist as long as the universe, they may help to create new life her on earth or eventually become part of a sun that shines life giving energy onto a new planet.

 

[bobhikes]

It will depend on how tired I am. If I am tired with life I 'll go with option 1. If there is a spark left I will ho with option 2. My bet would be that I'll be tired.

 

[YoursTrue]

I can only pick option 1. Although the thought experiment says that I can't know what the purported "afterlife" may be like, the one thing that I must presume about it is that it ought to be eternal. And eternity, without ever being able to let go, is not attractive to me.

Interesting, since I see life so differently. Although this life is a far cry from what God has in store for eventual life. I know Einstein wasn't looking forward to everlasting life -- I am. I hope to meet him some day and I believe he will enjoy living forever in a better world. I hope so.

 

[YoursTrue]

It will depend on how tired I am. If I am tired with life I 'll go with option 1. If there is a spark left I will ho with option 2. My bet would be that I'll be tired.

You may not be. Anyway, our bodies were meant to rest on a regular basis. Sleep is necessary. When I wake up and feel refreshed I am happier than if I am groggy.

 

[YoursTrue]

I would be happy to have my time and let consciousness go at the end.

Why? There is no why, its just how it is

Who needs consciousness when my atoms will exist as long as the universe, they may help to create new life her on earth or eventually become part of a sun that shines life giving energy onto a new planet.

I like thinking. And learning.

 

[YoursTrue]

I can only pick option 1. Although the thought experiment says that I can't know what the purported "afterlife" may be like, the one thing that I must presume about it is that it ought to be eternal. And eternity, without ever being able to let go, is not attractive to me.

I am pretty sure you can opt out if you want to. But maybe you won't want to.

 

[It Aint Necessarily So]

This is just something I've been pondering lately. Imagine that on your deathbed, the Grim Reaper appears to you and offers you a choice:

Option 1. is that your death will result in the complete cessation of your consciousness. You may have left a mark on the world and be remembered by your loved ones but you effectively cease to exist.

Option 2. is that you pass on into the afterlife. However, the Reaper won't tell you what the afterlife entails. You're stepping into the unknown if you take this option.


Which would you choose and why?

That depends on whether the decision was irreversible or not. If the choice was binding for eternity, I choose unconsciousness. It's simple risk management - comparing the cost of being in error with choice A to the cost of opting for choice B if it turns out to be an error. That is, the cost of missing out on eternal bliss is acceptable, but the cost of eternal regret is not. This is not a gamble one should take, so opt for unconsciousness and refuse the bet.

 

[Trailblazer]

Option 1. is that your death will result in the complete cessation of your consciousness. You may have left a mark on the world and be remembered by your loved ones but you effectively cease to exist.

Option 2. is that you pass on into the afterlife. However, the Reaper won't tell you what the afterlife entails. You're stepping into the unknown if you take this option.

Which would you choose and why?

I would choose Option 2, since (a) I would not want to cease to exist, and (b) this life has been hell so the afterlife could not be much worse, (c) I kinda sorta trust God that it will be much better than this world, and (d) I don't have problem with unknowns.

As a side note, in my religion we have been told why we have not been told more about the afterlife.

 

[Trailblazer]

I am pretty sure you can opt out if you want to. But maybe you won't want to.

Since the soul is immortal and everyone had one, how could anyone opt out?

 

[Scott C.]

This is just something I've been pondering lately. Imagine that on your deathbed, the Grim Reaper appears to you and offers you a choice:

Option 1. is that your death will result in the complete cessation of your consciousness. You may have left a mark on the world and be remembered by your loved ones but you effectively cease to exist.

Option 2. is that you pass on into the afterlife. However, the Reaper won't tell you what the afterlife entails. You're stepping into the unknown if you take this option.


Which would you choose and why?


Just as a note, I know that some people will be tempted to say something along the lines of, "Well I know what's going to happen after I die." For the sake of this thread please play along and assume that your choice is between non-existence and an entirely unknown afterlife.

Interesting question. Yes, I'm one who believes in an afterlife. Since you said the afterlife will be "entirely unknown", I'll assume this means that it will NOT be what I expect based on my religion, nor it will be what anyone expects, based on their religion. If I don't make this assumption, then I would have to respond that I would choose an afterlife with the hope that my religious views are correct or that someone else's religious views are correct. So with this assumption, I would have to guess on the afterlife based on this life. I would have no reason to believe it would be significantly worse or better than life as I know it. I think I would choose the afterlife, but that would be a bit nerve-racking as if it turns out to be really bad, there is no way out.

 

[Trailblazer]

I can only pick option 1. Although the thought experiment says that I can't know what the purported "afterlife" may be like, the one thing that I must presume about it is that it ought to be eternal. And eternity, without ever being able to let go, is not attractive to me.

In spite of the promises of Baha'u,llah -- that the the followers of the one true God shall, the moment they depart out of this life, experience such joy and gladness as would be impossible to describe, which I truly believe -- I still have the same sentiments as you do about living forever, as forever is a long time, and what if we don't like it? There is no return ticket from the afterlife.

But since there is no time as we know it in this world, when we die and go to the spiritual world we won't be thinking '"Sheesh, when is this going to end?" as we sometimes think in this world.

 

[Trailblazer]

That is, the cost of missing out on eternal bliss is acceptable, but the cost of eternal regret is not. This is not a gamble one should take, so opt for unconsciousness and refuse the bet.

If only there was such a choice , but if there is an afterlife there is and we will not have a choice whether we continue to exist or not.

I believe some will have eternal bliss and some will have eternal regret, although there might be some mitigation of the regret, by God's mercy. I also believe there might be shades of gray in between bliss and regret.

 

[Trailblazer]

I would be happy to have my time and let consciousness go at the end.

Why? There is no why, its just how it is

However, you could change your mind later.

 

[YoursTrue]

Since the soul is immortal and everyone had one, how could anyone opt out?

That's interesting. I do not believe the soul is necessarily immortal. If you'd like to know why, that could be a long discussion. Based on scripture and definitions. But -- consider this: when God blew into Adam's nostrils, He gave him the breath of life. Before that, Adam was simply probably a very nice looking body. Formed from the ground. Since God is God, I figure he can cause life to start when he completed Adam's body. But I don't really know more than that. I just figure from the scriptures now that's what happened. There are not many physical details given.
Genesis 2:7 - Then the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground. He breathed the breath of life into the man’s nostrils, and the man became a living person. (New Living Translation)
So before Adam became a living person, he was not a living person. How do you feel about that?

 

[Trailblazer]

That's interesting. I do not believe the soul is necessarily immortal. If you'd like to know why, that could be a long discussion. Based on scripture and definitions. But -- consider this: when God blew into Adam's nostrils, He gave him the breath of life. Before that, Adam was simply probably a very nice looking body. Formed from the ground. Since God is God, I figure he can cause life to start when he completed Adam's body. But I don't really know more than that. I just figure from the scriptures now that's what happened. There are not many physical details given.
Genesis 2:7 - Then the LORD God formed the man from the dust of the ground. He breathed the breath of life into the man’s nostrils, and the man became a living person. (New Living Translation)
So before Adam became a living person, he was not a living person. How do you feel about that?

The soul is the breath of life in the sense that without the soul the body could not function.

You are right that this could be a long discussion and it is late here so I will leave you with a couple of things I have posted that describe what I believe the soul is and what happens to our body and soul when we die. Then we can pick this discussion up later if you want to.

The soul comes into being at the moment of conception and it animates the human body. The body needs a soul or it cannot live, but the soul does not need a body, so it continues to exist after the body dies. The body is destructible and temporary so eventually it dies; the soul is indestructible and eternal so it lives forever in the spiritual world.

Let me try to explain what I meant about the soul’s functions as briefly as possible. The soul (spirit) cannot be perceived in the material world, except as it is expressed in outward signs and works. The human body is visible, the soul is invisible. Nevertheless, it is the soul that directs human faculties. As outer circumstances are communicated to the soul by the eyes, ears, and brain, the soul communicates its desires through the brain to the physical body, which thereby expresses itself.

The soul is the sum total of the personality so it is the person himself; the physical body is pure matter with no real identity. The person, after he dies and leaves his physical body behind remains the same person, and he goes to the spiritual world where he continues the life he conducted in the physical world. The soul takes on some kind of a spiritual form made up of elements that exist in the spiritual world. Nobody can understand what that will be like before they die because the only reference point we have is the physical world and the physical body.

I believe the physical body dies only once and it remains dead in forever. When the physical body dies, the spirit (soul) leaves the body and passes from one world into another.

421. When the body is no longer able to perform the bodily functions in the natural world that correspond to the spirit’s thoughts and affections, which the spirit has from the spiritual world, man is said to die. This takes place when the respiration of the lungs and the beatings of the heart cease. But the man does not die; he is merely separated from the bodily part that was of use to him in the world, while the man himself continues to live. It is said that the man himself continues to live since man is not a man because of his body but because of his spirit, for it is the spirit that thinks in man, and thought with affection is what constitutes man. Evidently, then, the death of man is merely his passing from one world into another. And this is why in the Word in its internal sense “death” signifies resurrection and continuation of life. Heaven and Hell, p. 351​

I call that other world the spiritual world, but there is no real separation, as the spiritual world is within this world.

“Those who have passed on through death, have a sphere of their own. It is not removed from ours; their work, the work of the Kingdom, is ours; but it is sanctified from what we call ‘time and place.’ Time with us is measured by the sun. When there is no more sunrise, and no more sunset, that kind of time does not exist for man. Those who have ascended have different attributes from those who are still on earth, yet there is no real separation.” ‘Abdu’l-Bahá in London, pp. 95-96

After the soul takes its flight to the spiritual world, the soul continues to progress on its journey through the spiritual world where it will endure forever.

“And now concerning thy question regarding the soul of man and its survival after death. Know thou of a truth that the soul, after its separation from the body, will continue to progress until it attaineth the presence of God, in a state and condition which neither the revolution of ages and centuries, nor the changes and chances of this world, can alter. It will endure as long as the Kingdom of God, His sovereignty, His dominion and power will endure. It will manifest the signs of God and His attributes, and will reveal His loving kindness and bounty.” Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, pp. 155-156