joelr
Well-Known Member
The argument here is false one. It goes like this, "Because many religious stories are patently
false then they are all patently false." You can't prove that.
Yes, many church people don't like to show similar doctrines or beliefs to Judaeo Christian ones
because of the IMPLICATION. Implication is a standard tactic in politics for instance, ie America is
racist, homophobic, sexist, class ridden ... THEREFOR it's ideas, values, and nation are not worth defending.
It's the low hanging fruit argument IMO.
The main deficit in such arguments is they focus upon the similarities AND IGNORE THE DIFFERENCES.
Well you can't prove it's true or that Romulus isn't the true savior god.
But this lends credibility that Jesus was a pagan copy and probably wasn't even a real person.
The differences are because every cult is different and has different mythologies. Religious synchretism always shows differences that are unique to each religion. What matters and what tells us synchrezation is happening is the similarities, you actually have it completely backwards.
Every dying-and-rising god is different. Every death is different. Every resurrection is different. All irrelevant. The commonality is that there is a death and a resurrection. Everything else is a mixture of syncretized ideas from the borrowing and borrowed cultures, to produce a new and unique god and myth.
Not in ancient Asia. Or anywhere else. Only the West, from Mesopotamia to North Africa and Europe. There was a very common and popular mytheme that had arisen in the Hellenistic period—from at least the death of Alexander the Great in the 300s B.C. through the Roman period, until at least Constantine in the 300s A.D. Nearly every culture created and popularized one: the Egyptians had one, the Thracians had one, the Syrians had one, the Persians had one, and so on. The Jews were actually late to the party in building one of their own, in the form of Jesus Christ. It just didn’t become popular among the Jews, and thus ended up a Gentile religion. But if any erudite religious scholar in 1 B.C. had been asked “If the Jews invented one of these gods, what would it look like?” they would have described the entire Christian religion to a T. Before it even existed. That can’t be a coincidence.
The general features most often shared by all these cults are (when we eliminate all their differences and what remains is only what they share in common):
- They are personal salvation cults (often evolved from prior agricultural cults).
- They guarantee the individual a good place in the afterlife (a concern not present in most prior forms of religion).
- They are cults you join membership with (as opposed to just being open communal religions).
- They enact a fictive kin group (members are now all brothers and sisters).
- They are joined through baptism (the use of water-contact rituals to effect an initiation).
- They are maintained through communion (regular sacred meals enacting the presence of the god).
- They involved secret teachings reserved only to members (and some only to members of certain rank).
- They used a common vocabulary to identify all these concepts and their role.
- They are syncretistic (they modify this common package of ideas with concepts distinctive of the adopting culture).
- They are mono- or henotheistic (they preach a supreme god by whom and to whom all other divinities are created and subordinate).
- They are individualistic (they relate primarily to salvation of the individual, not the community).
- And they are cosmopolitan (they intentionally cross social borders of race, culture, nation, wealth, or even gender).
- They are all “savior gods” (literally so-named and so-called).
- They are usually the “son” of a supreme God (or occasionally “daughter”).
- They all undergo a “passion” (a “suffering” or “struggle,” literally the same word in Greek, patheôn).
- That passion is often, but not always, a death (followed by a resurrection and triumph).
- By which “passion” (of whatever kind) they obtain victory over death.
- Which victory they then share with their followers (typically through baptism and communion).
- They also all have stories about them set in human history on earth.
- Yet so far as we can tell, none of them ever actually existed.
The Jews saw these concepts from the Persians and even started writing it into the OT and predicting their own messiah.
Then all other nations in the area start having their own savior and the Jews finally create one, last to the party.
Even Christian apologists and church fathers in those days admitted the similaries and told people that Satan changed history to make it look like Jesus was a copy of Pagan gods.
Almost 2000 years ago Justin Myrter actually had better apologetics than modern Christians who just pretend like there isn't anything to it. Denial.