One Of The Reasons I Find It Difficult To Take The Bible Seriously

[Skwim]

.

Lack of consistency among it various translations.


Take the four Bible verses below, which should make any student of the Christian religion tear their hair out in exasperation.


9 different translations of Philippians 3:8, "Because of Christ, I lost all these things, and now I know that they are all worthless trash. . . ."

Substitutes:

Refuse
Garbage
Rubbish
Filth
Worthless
Less than nothing
Manure
Sewer trash
​

So, which is it?


10 Different versions of John 14:2 "In My Father’s house are many mansions;"

Substitutes:

Places
Dwellings
Dwelling places.
Room
Room to spare
Rooms
Abodes
Places-to-stay
Homes​

So, which is it?


11 different translations of Isaiah 45:7 ". . .I make peace, and create evil; "

Substitutes:

Disaster
Calamity
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Trouble(s)
Bad times
Discords
Hard times
​

So, which is it?

12 different translations of Psalm 10:5 "His ways are always grievous;"

Substitutes:

Firm
Prosper
Secure
Twisted
Successful
Succeed
Prosperous
Endure
Well
Defouled
Pain​

So, which is it?


Then there are reference in one Bible that are simply omitted in another. Take Mark 9:46 where the KJV says: "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

Now, quite a few translations (26) do include references to the worm, but quite a few do not. Their version of Mark 9:46 reads:

CEV
You would be better off to go into life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

TLB
Better be lame and live forever than have two feet that carry you to hell.

NIRV
It would be better to enter God’s kingdom with only one foot than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

MSG
You’re better off maimed or lame and alive than the proud owner of two hands and two feet, godless in a furnace of eternal fire.

Phillips
It is better for you to enter life maimed than to keep both your hands and go to the rubbish-heap,​

Other verses also disappear . Take Matthew 18:11 where in the KJV it says “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.” But in some translations the verse is missing altogether , although it may make mention of the verse and its source in a footnote. Translations such as

(CEV) Verse removed
(NIV) Verse removed.
(NWT) Verse removed.
(NCV) Verse removed.
​

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say. Of course there's always the up side in that a person can choose whatever version best fits one's theology and be comfortable that it's backed up by the Good Book.

.
.

 

[leov]

.

Lack of consistency among it various translations.


Take the four Bible verses below, which should make any student of the Christian religion tear their hair out in exasperation.


9 different translations of Philippians 3:8, "Because of Christ, I lost all these things, and now I know that they are all worthless trash. . . ."

Substitutes

Refuse
Garbage
Rubbish
Filth
Worthless
Less than nothing
Manure
Sewer trash
​

So, which is it?


10 Different versions of John 14:2 "In My Father’s house are many mansions;"

Substitutes

Places
Dwellings
Dwelling places.
Room
Room to spare
Rooms
Abodes
Places-to-stay
Homes​

So, which is it?


11 different translations of Isaiah 45:7 ". . .I make peace, and create evil; "

Substitutes

Disaster
Calamity
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Trouble(s)
Bad times
Discords
Hard times
​

So, which is it?

12 different translations of Psalm 10:5 "His ways are always grievous;"

Substitutes

Firm
Prosper
Secure
Twisted
Successful
Succeed
Prosperous
Endure
Well
Defouled
Pain​

So, which is it?


Then there are reference in one Bible that are simply omitted in another. Take Mark 9:46 where the KJV says: "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

Now, quite a few translations (26) do include references to the worm, but quite a few do not. Their version of Mark 9:46 reads:

CEV
You would be better off to go into life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

TLB
Better be lame and live forever than have two feet that carry you to hell.

NIRV
It would be better to enter God’s kingdom with only one foot than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

MSG
You’re better off maimed or lame and alive than the proud owner of two hands and two feet, godless in a furnace of eternal fire.

Phillips
It is better for you to enter life maimed than to keep both your hands and go to the rubbish-heap,​

Other verses also disappear . Take Matthew 18;11 where in the KJV it says “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.” But in some translations the verse is missing altogether , although it may make mention of the verse and its source in a footnote. Translations such as

(CEV) Verse removed
(NIV) Verse removed.
(NWT) Verse removed.
(NCV) Verse removed.
​

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say. Of course there's always the up side in that a person can choose whatever version best fits one's theology and be comfortable that it's backed up by the Good Book.

.
.

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

 

[sooda]

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

That is a really lame excuse.

 

[InChrist]

.

Lack of consistency among it various translations.


Take the four Bible verses below, which should make any student of the Christian religion tear their hair out in exasperation.


9 different translations of Philippians 3:8, "Because of Christ, I lost all these things, and now I know that they are all worthless trash. . . ."

Substitutes

Refuse
Garbage
Rubbish
Filth
Worthless
Less than nothing
Manure
Sewer trash
​

So, which is it?


10 Different versions of John 14:2 "In My Father’s house are many mansions;"

Substitutes

Places
Dwellings
Dwelling places.
Room
Room to spare
Rooms
Abodes
Places-to-stay
Homes​

So, which is it?


11 different translations of Isaiah 45:7 ". . .I make peace, and create evil; "

Substitutes

Disaster
Calamity
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Trouble(s)
Bad times
Discords
Hard times
​

So, which is it?

12 different translations of Psalm 10:5 "His ways are always grievous;"

Substitutes

Firm
Prosper
Secure
Twisted
Successful
Succeed
Prosperous
Endure
Well
Defouled
Pain​

So, which is it?


Then there are reference in one Bible that are simply omitted in another. Take Mark 9:46 where the KJV says: "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

Now, quite a few translations (26) do include references to the worm, but quite a few do not. Their version of Mark 9:46 reads:

CEV
You would be better off to go into life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

TLB
Better be lame and live forever than have two feet that carry you to hell.

NIRV
It would be better to enter God’s kingdom with only one foot than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

MSG
You’re better off maimed or lame and alive than the proud owner of two hands and two feet, godless in a furnace of eternal fire.

Phillips
It is better for you to enter life maimed than to keep both your hands and go to the rubbish-heap,​

Other verses also disappear . Take Matthew 18;11 where in the KJV it says “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.” But in some translations the verse is missing altogether , although it may make mention of the verse and its source in a footnote. Translations such as

(CEV) Verse removed
(NIV) Verse removed.
(NWT) Verse removed.
(NCV) Verse removed.
​

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say. Of course there's always the up side in that a person can choose whatever version best fits one's theology and be comfortable that it's backed up by the Good Book.

.
.

I think it is because Hebrew words carry multiple layers of meaning. So there can often be several English words that have almost the same meaning as a particular Hebrew word, but it is usually quite difficult to find one word that has almost the exact same meaning as a particular Hebrew word and it is usually almost impossible to find just one that expresses all a Hebrew word’s meaning. That is the reason a Strong's concordance is useful to look up the various English words associated with the Hebrew word and also taking the context into consideration. I suppose it is challenging, but most of the examples you listed are not really that different from each other and the overall message is consistent in all the standard translations.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Or you could just study it in the original languages to learn the proper meanings. It's not difficult these days with the Internet.

 

[Salvador]

.

Lack of consistency among it various translations.


Take the four Bible verses below, which should make any student of the Christian religion tear their hair out in exasperation.


9 different translations of Philippians 3:8, "Because of Christ, I lost all these things, and now I know that they are all worthless trash. . . ."

Substitutes

Refuse
Garbage
Rubbish
Filth
Worthless
Less than nothing
Manure
Sewer trash
​

So, which is it?


10 Different versions of John 14:2 "In My Father’s house are many mansions;"

Substitutes

Places
Dwellings
Dwelling places.
Room
Room to spare
Rooms
Abodes
Places-to-stay
Homes​

So, which is it?


11 different translations of Isaiah 45:7 ". . .I make peace, and create evil; "

Substitutes

Disaster
Calamity
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Trouble(s)
Bad times
Discords
Hard times
​

So, which is it?

12 different translations of Psalm 10:5 "His ways are always grievous;"

Substitutes

Firm
Prosper
Secure
Twisted
Successful
Succeed
Prosperous
Endure
Well
Defouled
Pain​

So, which is it?


Then there are reference in one Bible that are simply omitted in another. Take Mark 9:46 where the KJV says: "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

Now, quite a few translations (26) do include references to the worm, but quite a few do not. Their version of Mark 9:46 reads:

CEV
You would be better off to go into life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

TLB
Better be lame and live forever than have two feet that carry you to hell.

NIRV
It would be better to enter God’s kingdom with only one foot than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

MSG
You’re better off maimed or lame and alive than the proud owner of two hands and two feet, godless in a furnace of eternal fire.

Phillips
It is better for you to enter life maimed than to keep both your hands and go to the rubbish-heap,​

Other verses also disappear . Take Matthew 18;11 where in the KJV it says “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.” But in some translations the verse is missing altogether , although it may make mention of the verse and its source in a footnote. Translations such as

(CEV) Verse removed
(NIV) Verse removed.
(NWT) Verse removed.
(NCV) Verse removed.
​

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say. Of course there's always the up side in that a person can choose whatever version best fits one's theology and be comfortable that it's backed up by the Good Book.

.
.

Many of the world’s population believe that this book called the Bible is actually the Word of God. Whether you believe this or not, there's no denying the power of the Bible’s influence around the globe—in both good and bad ways. Emanuel Swedenborg’s spiritual experiences and resulting philosophies reveal deeper, spiritual messages contained within the Bible. Throughout his writings, Swedenborg takes what many consider to be a book of outdated moral lessons and turns them into modern, timeless messages of love and hope for people of all genders, races, and religions.

On our own we know nothing of heavenly and spiritual affairs, so we learn about them from divine revelation, which is the Word. —Secrets of Heaven 3880

There's biblical revelation of every era of humanity that Swedenborg described in his writings. From the beginning of the human race, which was very close to heaven and had direct communication with God, all the way to the eighteenth century, when Swedenborg was writing.
By that point in human history, much evil had been done in the name of God and religion. Swedenborg said the revelation for our modern era is a new understanding of the true meaning of scripture. As portrayed in this animated excerpt from True Christianity, Swedenborg actually had a defining vision for a new spiritual mindset for humanity.
Immediately after experiencing this life-changing vision, Swedenborg then had an interaction with an angel who explained how he should explore the hidden meanings of the Bible to learn and share the truths about the Lord.

From that point on it became Swedenborg’s mission to study the literal words within the Bible to uncover the internal sense of the Word of God.

Swedenborg became so passionate about his new mission that his first and largest title, called Secrets of Heaven, was a verse-by-verse exposition on the books of Genesis and Exodus.

It is characteristic of the Word’s style that there is something holy in every statement, even in every word, even at times in the letters themselves; so the Word unites us to the Lord and opens heaven…The Word fills us with good desires that come from love and truths that lead to wisdom, provided we read it with the help of the Lord and not just on our own. It fills our will with good desires that come from love and fills our understanding with truths that lead to wisdom. As a result, we gain life by means of the Word. —Sacred Scripture 3

Swedenborg was so diligent in his explorations of the Bible that he discovered the many times things are paired together over and over again, and he even offered an explanation for the dualities of the Bible.

Swedenborg says these things are paired together purposefully to symbolize the union of the heart (love) and the mind (wisdom) as one. It’s a powerful revelation that serves as the basis for Swedenborg’s theory about the Bible’s main message.

There are three different types of narratives Swedenborg described within each book of the Bible from Genesis to Revelations:

Genesis 1-11: Fictional narratives that are full of symbolic lessons

Rest of Old Testament: Historical and prophetical content with meaning that’s both concealed and unconcealed

New Testament: Historical stories of Jesus’s life that have concealed internal meaning

Essentially, Swedenborg says that even through all the violent and vengeful words of the Bible, the hidden message is about love for the Lord and others. He says that even the Ten Commandments convey this internal meaning and significance

If God wanted to provide us with a printed form of communication to last for eternity, then why would he obscure its true meaning behind complex symbolism? Why wouldn’t the text just mean exactly what it says? Curtis explains Swedenborg’s philosophy about how divine concepts require earthly containers like the Bible and introduces an animated excerpt from Sacred Scripture to explain the concept further.

We can tell from this that in its literal meaning the Word is really the Word. There is spirit and life within; the spiritual meaning is its spirit and the heavenly meaning is its life. This is what the Lord said: “The words that I speak to you are spirit and are life” (John 6:63). The Lord said his words to the world and said them in their earthly meaning. Apart from the earthly meaning, which is the literal meaning, the spiritual and heavenly meanings are not the Word; [without it] they are like a spirit and life without a body—and like a palace that has no foundation to rest on. —Sacred Scripture 39

We can see an example of Swedenborg’s philosophy about literal v. internal through his interpretation of the prophesy about Egypt, Israel, and Assyria becoming one. Swedenborg says that the prophesy represents scholarly study, rational thinking, and spirituality become one—and is the future of science and spirituality working together for the best of humanity.

The Word in Heaven
Indeed, without the Word no one would know anything about the Lord, about love and faith, redemption, or any of the other secrets of heavenly wisdom. In fact, without the Word there would not be a heaven, just as in the world there would not be a church without the Word —The Word of the Lord 14

Swedenborg says the Bible does exist in heaven, but the Word in the spiritual world or afterlife is not the same as the word in the physical world or earth. Spirits and angels have an almost immediate revelation or understanding of the deepest spiritual sense of the Word in heaven so there’s no need for historical narratives and metaphors. In fact, there are different levels of understanding the Word amongst angels depending on the level of heaven they occupy. Chara Daum, a translator for the New Century Edition, explains how angels understand the Bible on different levels.

There are five excerpts from Swedenborg’s writings shedding some more light on the differences between the literal and spiritual meanings of the Word. Throughout his writings, Swedenborg reveals how the Bible is more of a spiritual tour of heaven than a book of moral instructions.

The inner meaning gives the Lord’s Word life. That meaning is like a soul whose body is the superficial sense. The case resembles that with human beings; when our body dies—when we join the angels—our soul comes alive, and when our soul lives, we no longer know anything of bodily affairs. By the same token, we no longer know what the literal meaning of the Word is, only what its soul is. —Secrets of Heaven 1143

Enlightenment
If you believe there’s both a literal and internal sense of the Word, you can gain access to the deeper level of understanding. According to Swedenborg, it’s possible to connect with the Word even if you have never read the Bible, are not Christian, and have never followed his teachings on the internal sense.

Swedenborg says the way to connect with the Bible’s spiritual message is to live it—or practice what you preach.
You can be connected to the spiritual Word simply by living a life of love because love for the Lord and others is the core message of the Bible.

In his mercy the Lord accepts and saves anyone anywhere on the globe who has lived a good life, because goodness itself is what accepts truth. A good life is the actual soil in which seed, or truth, is planted. An evil life positively does not accept the seed.—Secrets of Heaven 2590

Swedenborg and Life Recap: What the Bible Is 2/1/16 – Swedenborg Foundation

 

[Enoch07]

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say.

Looking up the original Hebrew or Greek meaning helps. Often enough for experienced students, context is enough without even having to translate. Just another reason why a non-believer can never understand the Bible as much as a believer.

 

[Deeje]

Let's see.....

9 different translations of Philippians 3:8, "Because of Christ, I lost all these things, and now I know that they are all worthless trash. . . ."

Substitutes
Refuse
Garbage
Rubbish
Filth
Worthless
Less than nothing
Manure
Sewer trash

The word in Greek is "skybalon" which means....

1. any refuse, as the excrement of animals, offscourings, rubbish, dregs
   1. of things worthless and detestable." (Strongs)

So, which is it?

Any or all of the above which virtually mean the same thing as suggested by the original word.

10 Different versions of John 14:2 "In My Father’s house are many mansions;"

Substitutes
Places
Dwellings
Dwelling places.
Room
Room to spare
Rooms
Abodes
Places-to-stay
Homes

The word in Greek is "monē" which means.....
"a staying, abiding, dwelling, abode"

So, which is it?

Any of the above. Jesus promised that he was going to prepare a place for his disciples to live after their resurrection to heaven. It didn't really matter what that dwelling place was since they had no say in it anyway.
Jesus was never going to make them live in a hovel. (as if such a thing existed in heaven)

11 different translations of Isaiah 45:7 ". . .I make peace, and create evil; "

Substitutes
Disaster
Calamity
Doom
Woe
Sorrow
Trouble(s)
Bad times
Discords
Hard times

The word in Greek is "ra`" and it can mean....

1. bad, disagreeable, malignant
   
   
2. bad, unpleasant, evil (giving pain, unhappiness, misery)
   
   
3. evil, displeasing
   
   
4. bad (of its kind - land, water, etc)
   
   
5. bad (of value)
   
   
6. worse than, worst (comparison)
   
   
7. sad, unhappy
   
   
8. evil (hurtful)
   
   
9. bad, unkind (vicious in disposition)
   
   
10. bad, evil, wicked (ethically)
    1. in general, of persons, of thoughts
       
       
    2. deeds, actions

So quite a range of meaning in this word. Context is always a good guide when translating words like this one.
Suffice it to say, God can use both good and evil to his own purpose.

So, which is it?

As a God in whom there is no injustice, whatever "evil" or 'calamitous' things that God can bring on his enemies is always deserved.

12 different translations of Psalm 10:5 "His ways are always grievous;"

Substitutes
Firm
Prosper
Secure
Twisted
Successful
Succeed
Prosperous
Endure
Well
Defouled
Pain

The word in Greek is "chuwl" which also has a variety of meanings....translation would depend on context.
According to Strongs....it means...
to twist, whirl, dance, writhe, fear, tremble, travail, be in anguish, be pained

So, which is it?

Taken in context verse 4 says....

"In his haughtiness, the wicked man makes no investigation;
All his thoughts are: “There is no God.”
5 His ways keep prospering,
But your judgments are beyond his understanding;
He scoffs at all his adversaries.
6 He says in his heart: “I will never be shaken;
For generation after generation
I will never see calamity.”

Since this is talking about an atheist, then his wicked (grievous) ways are what are prospering. He will never understand the things of God because there is no room in his heart for God. He is confident in his unbelief.

Your surface knowledge of the Bible always lets you down...no wonder you can never make sense of anything.
Can you not do your own research?

Then there are reference in one Bible that are simply omitted in another. Take Mark 9:46 where the KJV says: "Where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched."

Now, quite a few translations (26) do include references to the worm, but quite a few do not. Their version of Mark 9:46 reads:

CEV
You would be better off to go into life lame than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

TLB
Better be lame and live forever than have two feet that carry you to hell.

NIRV
It would be better to enter God’s kingdom with only one foot than to have two feet and be thrown into hell.

MSG
You’re better off maimed or lame and alive than the proud owner of two hands and two feet, godless in a furnace of eternal fire.

Phillips
It is better for you to enter life maimed than to keep both your hands and go to the rubbish-heap,

Some manuscripts read here “where their maggot does not die and the fire is not put out,” but these words do not appear in important early manuscripts. Similar words do appear in verse 48, where there is no uncertainty regarding the text.

The "worm" mentioned in this passage is about "gehenna" which in all those translations, only one is rendered correctly....Phillips is the only one that translates "gehenna" as a "rubbish heap". "Hell" in those versed referred to Jerusalem's rubbish dump.....a place to dispose of unwanted refuse. It was kept burning day and night by the addition of brimstone (sulfur) and what the flames missed, the maggots finished off. Nothing alive was ever cast there. Jesus used it as a metaphor for utter destruction of whatever was thrown in there. (Matthew 23:15; 33)

Other verses also disappear . Take Matthew 18;11 where in the KJV it says “For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.” But in some translations the verse is missing altogether , although it may make mention of the verse and its source in a footnote. Translations such as

(CEV) Verse removed
(NIV) Verse removed.
(NWT) Verse removed.
(NCV) Verse removed.

When a verse is added later but cannot be found in earlier manuscripts, it is best to omit them or to add them with a footnote.
Some manuscripts include the words: “For the Son of man came to save what was lost,” but these words do not appear in the earliest and most reliable manuscripts. A similar statement is part of the inspired text at Luke 19:10. Some are of the opinion that an early copyist borrowed the expression from Luke’s account.

Personally, any book that has so many inconsistency would be extremely difficult to take seriously no matter what else it has to say. Of course there's always the up side in that a person can choose whatever version best fits one's theology and be comfortable that it's backed up by the Good Book.

If you are looking for excuses not to believe, then I assure you that God will allow you the desires of your own heart. If the Bible is God's word then its renderings will be consistent and its message unaltered. A little research is all it takes, unless you just want to pacify yourself with as much negativity as you need to stay on the fence....although IMO, I think you have slipped off the other side of agnosticism and right on into atheism. If you are comfortable there, then perhaps that is where you are meant to be?
Aren't you sick of posting negative threads like this?

 

[sun rise]

I think it is because Hebrew words carry multiple layers of meaning.

Some English words do as well. For example the word "light" can refer to illumination or weight. And then there's Explanation of Homonyms, Homophones, Homographs and Heteronyms
bough (tree limb)
bow (front of a boat)
bow (at the waist)
bow (tied with ribbon)
bow (shoots arrows)

 

[lukethethird]

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

I was born spiritually ready.

 

[sun rise]

Translations of poetry are quite often more about the translator than the poet. But if you translate a poem literally it often makes no sense.

From another perspective ("Lights of Kabbala" Facebook group) :
"People think the Torah is all about laws and rituals and quaint stories, with a mystical side as well.

In truth, the Torah is entirely spiritual. But when you cannot perceive the spiritual, all you see are laws and rituals and quaint stories."

 

[leov]

That is a really lame excuse.

No. 99.9% translators know language but are not spiritual, so they do not understand what they are reading and become interpreters.

 

[leov]

I was born spiritually ready.

Lucky you.

 

[lukethethird]

Lucky you.

Not really, it's a curse.

 

[Skwim]

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

And you know this to be a fact because ____________________________________________________________ .

.

 

[Salvador]

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

I've personally experienced an out of body experience, which happened to me when I was 13 years old. It happened immediately after I had a fainting spell from hyperventilating and holding my breath in such a way that I'd forced myself to pass out. When I woke up from this fainting spell, I was floating outside and above my body. While I was floating outside and above my body, everything in the room started spinning around me and then became brightly illuminated with a blinding white light which blinded me until I descended back into my body.

Me being spiritual alone did not help me understand the Bible. Me reading the works of Emanuel Swedenborg is what helped me clearly understand the Bible's inner spiritual meaning.

 

[leov]

And you know this to be a fact because ____________________________________________________________ .

.

Well, first thing, Bible itself says so.

 

[leov]

I've personally experienced an out of body experience, which happened to me when I was 13 years old. It happened immediately after I had a fainting spell from hyperventilating and holding my breath in such a way that I'd forced myself to pass out. When I woke up from this fainting spell, I was floating outside and above my body. While I was floating outside and above my body, everything in the room started spinning around me and then became brightly illuminated with a blinding white light which blinded me until I descended back into my body.

Me being spiritual alone did not help me understand the Bible. Me reading the works of Emanuel Swedenborg is what helped me clearly understand the Bible's inner spiritual meaning.

You were prepared to understand.

 

[Salvador]

From get go Bible was intended to be understood by only who were spiritually ready.

I was born spiritually ready.

My out of body experience was a deeply spiritual experience for me. but my reading of Emanuel Swedenborg's interpretation of the Bible is what has helped me understand the Bible's true meaning.

 

[leov]

S

Not really, it's a curse.

Sometimes. Can you tell a bit more?