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Only your religion is right. Justification please!?

Muffled

Jesus in me
Ok, thank you, lets use your reasoning then shall we?

1. GODS CREATE RELIGIONS
2. Many religions means there are many gods.
3. Bible and Quaran MUST be wrong.

It IS good to have all the facts.


Or, are you saying "The one an only god" created Hinduism with it's thousands of different gods, then told everyone there is only 1 god? Hmmmmm...sounds like god is either confused, a trickister, or he doesn't create religions, man does.

Well, ok, you did in the end say your religion (Christianity), is the ONLY right one. So, in that case, god makes wrong religions? Or man makes religions? So, yet again, my premise stands up.

Thank you for answering the question in your last line. You justify your religion to be right, because there is one aspect of it you particularly warm to, the idea of salvation. Interesting. Cheers.

You are missing a premise in your logic. I suppose your mind takes the shortcut but in presenting logical statements it is better to present all the premises.
I think you are trying to say that the Bible and Qu'ran do not recognize that there are other gods. However that is not the case with the Bible and I don't know enough about the Qu'ran but the idea of One God is similar to the judaic ie that there is one true God over all. So you conclusion is false because your missing premise is false.

Hinduism recognizes one God over all as well. I don't see any difference in that respect from the Bible. Hinduism pays respects to other gods which is diffeent from the Bible.

God works with people at the level they are capable of reaching. If as a parent I hand a child a plastic saw it is due to the fact that a real saw would be dangerous for the child. However to saw wood , one needs to grow up and use a real saw.

It is after all the requirement of God that people not sin not a matter of what I like or don't like.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Perhaps you are in for a rude awakening when you find out the Hindus are right, and there is thousands of gods. Your religion has no more validity than any other. You may not like this fact, but it is however, quite true.

I don't have any problem believing that there were thousands of gods. I just have not seen any evidence that they are around now or that they are worth listening to if they are.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Now read this over slowly and see if you can detect the circular reasoning.

I can see your perspective on this but then the question is circular also.

I just read an article about push polling. That is where the questions are oriented at provoking a response to a loaded question like: Have you stopped beating your wife?

All religions appear to have a standard of right and wrong and most of the time those standards are in agreement. However at times the ideas of men will creep into religions and those ideas are not always right in the eyes of God. So the bottom line is that the Paraclete provides an immediate assessment of what is right whereas books and the ideas of men about books can be tainted. However what you perceive as circular reasoning I see as a truism. There is nothing wrong with saying that a white wall is white.
 

Riverwolf

Amateur Rambler / Proud Ergi
Premium Member
That doesn't sound like a God concept at all. Do they do anything? If not, how do they meet the criteria for a God? What doesn't meet the criteria for a God?

God-concepts are numerous, and the three that I provided are followed by many.

Sri Bhagavan is the primary one, and for me, serves as an example-setter. The word "bhagavan" is often translated as "God." Sri Bhagavan takes many, many forms; for me, the primary ones are Siva, Parvati/Durga/Kali, Sri Rama, Mother Sita, and Ganesha.

I'm a monist, so I deify the total sum of all existence, and call it the name given to it in the Vedanta: Brahman. According to the Sages (and it seems to be working), this will help me achieve my goal of universal love.

Equating Siva-Sakti with potential/kinetic energy is based on something a modern Sage said that makes sense to me, but I don't actually place a whole lot of import on this part; it's really just deifying a part of the Universe.

We still don't know about that too. If one of the guesses we have are correct, all matter created itself through the laws of physics along with the concept of time, all in line with the laws of quantum physics (since whenever you have nothing, you will always get a boiling brew of quantum particles that pop in and out of existance).
That's still something. Besides, popping "in and out of existence" makes no sense. I think it may be more accurate to say, "popping in and out of measurable existence."

Besides, the laws of nature and time are part of the aggregate of existence.

Exactly. When we're comparing our opinions on a movie we hold different ones. I happened to like Citizen Kane, wich provides us with a good example.

When someone asks me about my opinion on Citizen Kane, I'll say it was a really great movie. Then they'll move onto you, and you'll say you hated it. Through inductive reasoning, we've now established that "Riverwolf did not like Citizen Kane" and "nrg did like Citizen Kane", but the one's who asked still have absolutely no kind of empirical observations that can determine "Is Citizen kane the greatest movie of all time?". It doesn't matter if I'm out numbered by a million to one either, or if you are, because you mesaure how entertaining a movie is by how an individual responds to it, and we all respond differently. You can't even establish if "Citizen Kane made great uses of downward angles", you can only establish that "I responded with pleasure when I saw the downward angles in Citizen Kane".
And that's subjectivity. There is no "right" or "wrong" in this case; just opinions.

My point was, you cannot, however, draw the conclusion "Riverwolf hated Citizen Kane" and "Riverwolf gave Citizen Kane 5 out of 5", both of them being right. You see we're I'm getting at? If you do have two opinions, they can't both be right. Likewise, you cannot hold the belief that "God exists and God doesn't exists", therefore you state the other to be false when you pick one of them.
Ah, I see. The same person can't have two conflicting opinions. ... I don't believe that I was arguing that.

Absolutely, I was just trying to talk about how a dogmatic view about what's morally acceptable is not compatible with materialistic atheism, for better or worse I suppose.
I do agree that, in all cases (whether materialistic atheism is right or not), moral absolutism is NEVER a good thing.

That's what my programing teacher says too.
Hey, I'm in programming this semester, too! Small world. ^_^

That's what I say when I'm helping out with the Swedish for Immigrants education too. I'm confused, is following advices of people a religion? Because it seems we're drifting more and more away from the original discussion.
Buddhism is considered a religion, and following the Buddha's advice is what it's all about.

I think what makes following someone's advice a religion is if that advice is about how to live, and someone takes it up.

The second definition of religion from dictionary.com (which is based on the Random House Dictionary) is:

a specific fundamental set of beliefs and practices generally agreed upon by a number of persons or sects: the Christian religion; the Buddhist religion.
I think what I've been talking about fits the bill.


Do you mean in the particular task at hand? That if you do you math test well, you'll get a better grade? I could stretch that your overall propability to get a good math grade increases if you do well, but that's it.
It's not just for a single task at hand, but for all things in life. IMO, it's about trying one's best in all things, not just one.

You should've listened to your doubt, because that's not what I was talking about.
Yeah, I didn't think so. But I don't regret making my statement, because if nothing else, it will help this confusion ease.

Let me give you an example. Let's say you and I are working out at the gym. You become brutally honest with me, and tell me that if I want to get my abs into shape I'll have to come to the gym two more times a week. I listen to you, I start going to the gym more often, get in shape and become proud over my achievments.

However, I only came to the gym more often because you advised it. If you hadn't, I wouldn't have started going to the gym more often until some other event would've convinced me. And you only said I should come more often because I was at the gym, at that time. If I would've been sick that day, you wouldn't have, and you would've been forced to tell me at another time, or maybe it wouldn't cross you're mind and you would never think about saying it ever again. And in turn, you only told me to do it because you wanted to give me advice, like something a friend would do. If you would've thought I was an obnoxious moron, maybe you couldn't care less about my health.

We can compare it with something that's commonly misunderstood of chaos theory (but still proven), the butterfly effect. Weather predictions are totally useleess if they're off with a couple of factors, wich is why everyone makes jokes about how wrong the forecasts are sometimes. Therefore, you cannot predict wether or not it will rain in Kansas City a year from now, because a butterfly can flap it's wings and throw the whole weather prediction off, wich is why weather fills the criteria for a chaotic system. And you cannot predict what your life will be 30 years from now; you could be depressed and filled with no motivation at all, or be full of energy after a series of events and accomplish great things. It's all decided by very small changes that accumulates into larger ones. No wing flap, no rain. No advice, no abs.
I did read Jurassic Park, thank you. ^_^

I see what you mean now. You're not saying that we can't change habits or overcome addictions, which are also based on certain chemicals in the brain (I assume, at least). That's what it sounded like you were saying in the context of what I was trying to say.

I am aware that we most often need external forces to let us know to change our ways. I'm not arguing that. My argument is that we do have control over what we do.

Now that we're clear, your statement fits perfectly well with Buddhism... in fact, I think it's part of the Buddhist teaching of "no-soul". In this teaching, it's said that we don't have immortal souls, but are simply aggregates of existence that go on and on and on.

I do too. I'm just discussing wether or not you can say "Buddhism is right" while at the sime time saying that "Materialistic atheism is wrong". The sort of secular buddhism you're explaining sounds like it doesn't contest material atheism at any ground, and that I do confess.
And that is what I'm trying to say.

All right, and depending on the interpretation, it either contradicts or doesn't contradict all other religions in the world. Shake hands?
Okies. ... they need to have a "shake hands" smiley.

Sorry, I jumped to conclusions.
S'okay.

I'll confess that it's lazy to lable everyone by their community. My intention was just that it's more practical to discuss views and how they contend other views.
Oh, I'll certainly admit that there are plenty of schools of Buddhism that do not work with materialistic atheism. :D
 
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Luminous

non-existential luminary
I don't have any problem believing that there were thousands of gods. I just have not seen any evidence that they are around now or that they are worth listening to if they are.
they are about as around as ghosts and the big-foot that asks for a cup of sugar in exelent English.
 

logician

Well-Known Member
Obviously, since all religions can't be right, they must all be wrong.

Otherwise, please point out the correct religion.
 
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