Opium of the people . Question for Atheists /agnostics

[Spiderman]

“Religious suffering is at one and the same time the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.” - Karl Marx

Just curious, even if you find religion is just an opiate, do you see it as an opiate that should be thrown out?

Opiates are very important. I've known disabled people that claim without their pain killers they would kill people.

Without this opium of the people, there may be more pain , greed, materialism, sex-addiction, pride, and anger, which could create more violence and sociopathic tenancies, no?
So, perhaps this "opium of the people " is very important.

Napoleon had no personal use for Religion other than belief in his lucky star, but did find Religion useful for political reasons. He made Catholicism the official Religion of His Empire.

He said Religion "prevented the poor from killing the rich."

Do you as an agnostic /atheist see any positive use for Religion?

 

[Desert Snake]

I'm not an atheist, but I'm not 'religious' either. Sure, there is use for religion, many uses. Do you want a list or something? Keep in mind that many subjects are compiled in a religious manner, and theology even so forth.

 

[Spiderman]

I'm not an atheist, but I'm not 'religious' either. Sure, there is use for religion, many uses. Do you want a list or something? Keep in mind that many subjects are compiled in a religious manner, and theology even so forth.

Religion only has no use, for the extremely uninformed, or very myopic. Or, a reactionary action stemming from the inability to rectify ones atheism.

Yes, how about a list.

Also, do you consider Marx an Atheist?

 

[ADigitalArtist]

(Disclosure, this is just personal opinion, not something i think everyone does or should agree with)
If we are keeping with the medicine metaphor, I think religion isn't an opium but something even less. It's sugar water. We get what we put into it, and nothing more. There is nothing in it helping except us. It feels like it's helping some people get through pain, sure, and I'm happy for those who do. But it also can obscure real problems behind the guise of feeling better. Problems some don't want to aknowledge because, if they did, would spoil the whole effect, shatter the conception that it's medicine at all, and leave us alone to work through the problems by ourselves.

 

[Spiderman]

(Disclosure, this is just personal opinion, not something i think everyone does or should agree with)
If we are keeping with the medicine metaphor, I think religion isn't an opium but something even less. It's sugar water. We get what we put into it, and nothing more. There is nothing in it helping except us. It feels like it's helping some people get through pain, sure, and I'm happy for those who do. But it also can obscure real problems behind the guise of feeling better. Problems some don't want to aknowledge because, if they did, would spoil the whole effect, shatter the conception that it's medicine at all, and leave us alone to work through the problems by ourselves.

I understand it to be your opinion, and can respect it, though it differs from mine.

However, there were times I behaved less selfishly, performed works of charity, gave money to people, forgave, purged my heart of hate, lust, greed, pride, anger, covetousness, jealously, laziness, and gluttony, and would not have done so were there not a belief that a higher power wanted me to.

I know that it's even more noble if a person would do such things just for integrity, but I personally did it to please spirits...Not so much because I think I'll get an eternal reward for it, but because it makes the spirits happy, and I believe (perhaps foolishly) that it comes back to me in some way (and have received multiple signs that confirm me in this conviction.)

I hope those who believe solely in the material world would find as much joy in the material world as we spiritual people find in the Spirit-world.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

I am an atheist. But I would be extremely naïve if I were to say that religious "has no use" or is "only an opiate." It's foolish to try and dismiss something that is so universally human.

Life is a complicated thing, and there's not one of us doesn't need some help getting through it. Where that help comes from -- well that's the problematic part.

I live in a world in which information is gloriously, lasciviously abundant, and I revel in trying to absorb it (though, dumb as I am, I don't understand nearly all of it). But the truth is, not everybody can get there. In the face of not knowing "why" or "what will happen" or "what should I do" or "what is death," how do people cope? Because at the end of the day, they do have to cope -- and let's be clear, most people do.

For some people, philosophy provides some (never all) answers. Science provides others. In the face of knowledge (to the atheist, anyway) of your own eventual extinction, resignation provides something -- combined with the comfort of knowing it won't "feel" any different being dead than it "felt" not being alive before you were born.

But not all of us have even those comforts, and I cannot -- as an atheist -- deny that religion does provide a great deal of comfort, and a great deal of a sense of direction in "how should I treat others." (That last part, by the way, I think we would all understand better by simply thinking about how we'd like to be treated, and "do unto others." But I think just about every religion and philosophy on earth has managed to come up with that one, so I'm probably not very original there.)

 

[Desert Snake]

There is an assumed premise or two, to the original post.
I think it's not quite, 'is there a use for religion', it's more like 'is there a use for religion because x,y & ,z.'

 

[Spiderman]

There is an assumed premise or two, to the original post.
I think it's not quite, 'is there a use for religion', it's more like 'is there a use for religion because x,y & ,z.'

Depends. Some people hate Religion and would prefer it be banned (illegal). I try to respect their views in the sense that they must have seen Religion do much more harm than good for them to arrive at such contempt for it.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

I understand it to be your opinion, and can respect it, though it differs from mine.

However, there were times I behaved less selfishly, performed works of charity, gave money to people, forgave, purged my heart of hate, lust, greed, pride, anger, covetousness, jealously, laziness, and gluttony, and would not have done so were there not a belief that a higher power wanted me to.

I know that it's even more noble if a person would do such things just for integrity, but I personally did it to please spirits...Not so much because I think I'll get an eternal reward for it, but because it makes the spirits happy, and I believe (perhaps foolishly) that it comes back to me in some way (and have received multiple signs that confirm me in this conviction.)

I hope those who believe solely in the material world would find as much joy in the material world as we spiritual people find in the Spirit-world.

I'm glad your religion is such a force for positivity and accomplishment in your life. I just personally don't believe you need it to do the same, and that there's wonder and amazement enough in the natural world to give you goals and happiness, and less temptation to let the 'what would be nice' get in the way of 'what is' with spiritual trappings. Just imo.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

Depends. Some people hate Religion and would prefer it be banned (illegal). I try to respect their views in the sense that they must have seen Religion do much more harm than good for them to arrive at such contempt for it.

However you are informed -- whether by religion, science, philosophy and such -- so long as what you know and believe (and believer you know) impels you to make life better for yourself AND FOR THOSE AROUND YOU -- you are making our world better. There will be mistakes and setbacks (we're human ), but the overall result ought to be positive. It's why the "Golden Rule" (and I don't really care how you phrase it) is so good.

Think about the Golden Rule this way: when you meet somebody who is different than you, who believes other than you, who has different goals than you, who isn't as pretty or handsome, or any of the other things you cherish, do you:

1. Try to get to know/understand or even like them?
2. Object to them?

There's your answer.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

However, there were times I behaved less selfishly, performed works of charity, gave money to people, forgave, purged my heart of hate, lust, greed, pride, anger, covetousness, jealously, laziness, and gluttony, and would not have done so were there not a belief that a higher power wanted me to.

I know that it's even more noble if a person would do such things just for integrity, but I personally did it to please spirits..

Would it not have been good enough to do it just because it made you happy? (And think about this for a moment, if it made you happy to make others happy, why do you suppose that might be?)

 

[Spiderman]

I share in Atheist's disgust for Religion. All this talk about people going to a place of eternal torture forever and ever and ever for not believing this or that Dogma , is thoroughly disgusting and the greatest act of injustice and most irrational policy I've ever heard of .... the most depressing thing I've ever heard.


People who preach such, create a God who is less just and less merciful than myself, which is quite pathetic.

He expects us to be charitable yet is most cruel and uncharitable if that is God.

If God is going to choose to be invisible and leave us with a Bible full of parable, hyperbole, poetry, and symbolism hard to interpret (that often states the opposite of what it previously said) and then burn people in hell for not believing correct dogma, I regret that I was ever born and do not want to spend eternity with such a cruel God.

If that is our God, I prefer that my mom had aborted me! I'm serious!

 

[Spiderman]

Would it not have been good enough to do it just because it made you happy? (And think about this for a moment, if it made you happy to make others happy, why do you suppose that might be?)

It would not have made me as happy were I not to have believed in the involvement of spirits in my life.

But I admire those who perform an act of kindness because it makes them happy , without the motive of pleasing another entity or eternal reward.

That just isn't who I am, but I do admire it.

 

[lewisnotmiller]

Religion impacts on how people think, in my opinion. And yours. And Marx's!

So we all agree!!!

 

[Skwim]

Just curious, even if you find religion is just an opiate, do you see it as an opiate that should be thrown out?

Opiates are very important. I've known disabled people that claim without their pain killers they would kill people.

Without this opium of the people, there may be more pain , greed, materialism, sex-addiction, pride, and anger, which could create more violence and sociopathic tenancies, no?
So, perhaps this "opium of the people " is very important.

Not in the sense that it works like an opiate: however, it does work to calm fears, give hope, and function as a security blanket.

Do you as an agnostic /atheist see any positive use for Religion?

Absolutely (see above); however, it also has its negative side. It has fostered a distrust of reason and logic, instigated wars, led to hate between people, and excused homicide.


.

 

[Iti oj]

“Religious suffering is at one and the same time the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.” - Karl Marx

Just curious, even if you find religion is just an opiate, do you see it as an opiate that should be thrown out?

Opiates are very important. I've known disabled people that claim without their pain killers they would kill people.

Without this opium of the people, there may be more pain , greed, materialism, sex-addiction, pride, and anger, which could create more violence and sociopathic tenancies, no?
So, perhaps this "opium of the people " is very important.

Napoleon had no personal use for Religion other than belief in his lucky star, but did find Religion useful for political reasons. He made Catholicism the official Religion of His Empire.

He said Religion "prevented the poor from killing the rich."

Do you as an agnostic /atheist see any positive use for Religion?
View attachment 15120

Heroin is an opiate

 

[Spiderman]

H

Heroin is an opiate

Heroin works on endorphins. Prayer also releases endorphins. Religion can be a pain reliever and cause euphoria. I'm assuming that is what Marx was getting at.

 

[Desert Snake]

Since I'm not religious, why are you asking me about Marx's theories on how religion affects people?

 

[Spiderman]

Since I'm not religious, why are you asking me about Marx's theories on how religion affects people?

No, I was just wondering if you thought Marx was an Atheist. Nevermind.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

If religion is an opiate for the masses, so is TV, sports, music, movies, food, video games, board games, beer...anything that keeps the people from seeing the oppression of the system and moving to liberate themselves...