Origins Of Evil

[9Westy9]

I don't agree. But I see why you would say that.

Why don't you agree?

4) That was the point of the two great commandments. To encompass/condense all of them.

and cover the ones they missed

 

[URAVIP2ME]

and cover the ones they missed

Wouldn't Jesus NEW commandment also cover anything missed ?

-John 13 vs 34,35; 15 vs 10-14

 

[waitasec]

Wouldn't Jesus NEW commandment also cover anything missed ?

-John 13 vs 34,35; 15 vs 10-14

question is why was anything missing in the 1st place?

 

[9Westy9]

Wouldn't Jesus NEW commandment also cover anything missed ?

-John 13 vs 34,35; 15 vs 10-14

Indeed it would

 

[Sleeppy]

Why don't you agree?



and cover the ones they missed

I think we'd just be going in another circle :/ But lets see...

God is good. Giving life and maintaining life. Giving true happiness and maintaining it. etc. etc.

God is giving the choice to be disobedient ( free will )
God is just, giving what is deserved ( punishment )
God is forgiving, taking away deserved punishment when we accept His son, which is who stops our downward spiral, and repent ( stop sinning )
God then gives us what we don't deserve ( reward )

That's benevolent.

God is omnipotent. The origin of all power, with all power under Him, and for Him.

 

[9Westy9]

Didn't answer my question. Why does a benevolent, omnipotent god need to use evil?

I think we'd just be going in another circle :/ But lets see...

God is good. Giving life and maintaining life. Giving true happiness and maintaining it. etc. etc.

God is giving the choice to be disobedient ( free will )

Would you rather a world with no hurt, pain, suffering etc. Or the world we live in now?

God is just, giving what is deserved ( punishment )

So eternal suffering is what we deserve?

God is forgiving, taking away deserved punishment when we accept His son, which is who stops our downward spiral, and repent ( stop sinning )

So salvation is belief in one person rather than for what we do?

God then gives us what we don't deserve ( reward )

in both heaven and eternal hell

That's benevolent.

Not really. Remember who created this in the first place.

God is omnipotent. The origin of all power, with all power under Him, and for Him.

Omnipotent and benevolent don't mix in this universe.

 

[Sleeppy]

Didn't answer my question. Why does a benevolent, omnipotent god need to use evil?



Would you rather a world with no hurt, pain, suffering etc. Or the world we live in now?



So eternal suffering is what we deserve?



So salvation is belief in one person rather than for what we do?



in both heaven and eternal hell



Not really. Remember who created this in the first place.



Omnipotent and benevolent don't mix in this universe.

I promise you.. I am trying. If He didn't excercise His power over it, you would be certain saying that He isn't omnipotent.

I'd rather be in paradise.

Eternal suffering. Why are you asking me? Did you read that?

Salvation is belief in God. I'm guessing you meant to say be responsible for what we do. If you were attentive to the extent of actions that people have, you would see that you can't even see the full.

The people that are worried about eternal hell are cowards. Do what you're supposed to do. I'm not worried about prison, because i'm not breaking a law that would put me there.

Make an effort to understand. If I say God is the source for all Good, what do I remember? That you ignored it.

Like I said. A big pointless circle.

 

[9Westy9]

I promise you.. I am trying. If He didn't excercise His power over it, you would be certain saying that He isn't omnipotent.

Big assumption

I'd rather be in paradise.

Then why aren't we?

Eternal suffering. Why are you asking me? Did you read that?

You mentioned punishment. Most Christians I know believe in a literal, eternal hell. Unless you don't believe in eternal punishment?

Salvation is belief in God. I'm guessing you meant to say be responsible for what we do. If you were attentive to the extent of actions that people have, you would see that you can't even see the full.

Actions speak louder than words. Are you truly saying that a very moral atheist can't go to heaven just due to a lack of belief?

The people that are worried about eternal hell are cowards. Do what you're supposed to do. I'm not worried about prison, because i'm not breaking a law that would put me there.

How is that relevant? He gives us what we don't deserve (hell and heaven)

Make an effort to understand. If I say God is the source for all Good, what do I remember? That you ignored it.

he's also the source for all evil. Also how this refutes what I said doesn't appear clear to me. If God's all good then his creation is all good. It can't be tainted by anything. Unless you want to do away with some of the qualities you attribute to God.

Like I said. A big pointless circle.

Only because you failed to adequately address my arguments.

 

[gnosticx]

evil is anything that makes it harder 4 u or someone to consider the truth of a matter no matter how trivial or great....if everyone treated each other how theyd like to be.....the world would b a different place...but it isnt and the children of evil are far more organised than ......so evil existed b4 this world or any other was kick started....

 

[Sleeppy]

Big assumption



Then why aren't we?



You mentioned punishment. Most Christians I know believe in a literal, eternal hell. Unless you don't believe in eternal punishment?



Actions speak louder than words. Are you truly saying that a very moral atheist can't go to heaven just due to a lack of belief?



How is that relevant? He gives us what we don't deserve (hell and heaven)



he's also the source for all evil. Also how this refutes what I said doesn't appear clear to me. If God's all good then his creation is all good. It can't be tainted by anything. Unless you want to do away with some of the qualities you attribute to God.



Only because you failed to adequately address my arguments.

We lost the priveledge for paradise.
Age-during.
Those who accept salvation, have it.
Why twist my words back at me? Why is it hard to understand that if you leave God, you will lose everything and when you have God, your blessings keep multiplying?
That's your god. I don't know that one.

Why are you questioning me at all? If it's to repeatedly deny something I know, then you'd be better off with someone who doesn't know.

 

[9Westy9]

We lost the priveledge for paradise.

Why weren't we born in paradise? Why are we made to live this pointless life if God exists?

Those who accept salvation, have it.

And those who deny Jesus never existed go to hell no matter how good they are, whereas a person who has committed genocide merely has to accept Jesus on his deathbed. Do you not see the injustice here?

Why twist my words back at me? Why is it hard to understand that if you leave God, you will lose everything and when you have God, your blessings keep multiplying?

I left God and I'm doing just fine. Are all millionaires theists? No. Your claim has no evidence whatsoever.

That's your god. I don't know that one.

Then your God isn't possible. A benevolent omnipotent creator can't make or allow for anything that isn't good. How can you possibly reconcile this contradiction?

Why are you questioning me at all? If it's to repeatedly deny something I know, then you'd be better off with someone who doesn't know.

I question you because I believe your wrong. I feel like I'm wasting my time however. Also, you know the qualities of God? Are you joking? I'm trying to show how your definition of God is impossible, yet I only recieve assertions in return. If my objections are wrong then show them to be wrong.

 

[Iti oj]

We lost the priveledge for paradise.
Age-during.
Those who accept salvation, have it.
Why twist my words back at me? Why is it hard to understand that if you leave God, you will lose everything and when you have God, your blessings keep multiplying?
That's your god. I don't know that one.

Why are you questioning me at all? If it's to repeatedly deny something I know, then you'd be better off with someone who doesn't know.

Yet people pray and pray and pray yet still go hungry? The countries with the most religous people tend to have the least of their basic needs meet. Why is this?

if good realy does bless his believers wouldn't that be quantifiable?

 

[Sleeppy]

Why weren't we born in paradise? Why are we made to live this pointless life if God exists?

It's not pointless. I've already gone into why we weren't born there.

And those who deny Jesus never existed go to hell no matter how good they are, whereas a person who has committed genocide merely has to accept Jesus on his deathbed. Do you not see the injustice here?

Why would you deny Him? What your doing is putting everything within a lifespan. Stop. You're also not understanding that God isn't a fool. He accepts the heart and spirit, not an empty deathbed apology.

I left God and I'm doing just fine. Are all millionaires theists? No. Your claim has no evidence whatsoever.

According to you, you're doing fine. Yet, you don't realize the full extent of anything you do. Millionaires? That's your blueprint? And you already claim to know there isn't evidence. Smh.

Then your God isn't possible. A benevolent omnipotent creator can't make or allow for anything that isn't good. How can you possibly reconcile this contradiction?

The same reason you don't understand free will and why God extends His power over all, is why you're not able to accept the reason behind slavery in the Old Testament.

I question you because I believe your wrong. I feel like I'm wasting my time however. Also, you know the qualities of God? Are you joking? I'm trying to show how your definition of God is impossible, yet I only recieve assertions in return. If my objections are wrong then show them to be wrong.

Showing anything to you seems impossible. You don't even realize that you're questioning me with preconceived notions of what those qualities should be. If what i'm saying is impossible then move on.

 

[Iti oj]

god is the ruler of earth. if god was only a man and he only ruled a kingdom or country we would call him an unhumane and unfit leader if my human standers god is inhuman how can we call god human and moral?

 

[Sleeppy]

Yet people pray and pray and pray yet still go hungry? The countries with the most religious people tend to have the least of their basic needs met. Why is this?

if God really does bless His believers wouldn't that be quantifiable?

I'm done talking to this mindset. This isn't that type of thread or even sub-forum. And explaining this to you would probably evolve into several other follow up questions.

 

[Iti oj]

I'm done talking to this mindset. This isn't that type of thread or even sub-forum. And explaining this to you would probably evolve into several other follow up questions.

Not at all. you ask what is the origin of evil. my purpose is to suggest god is the origin of evil. either via dualism or gods as creator of everything and evil being apart of everything

 

[lunamoth]

Why is there evil?


I'm Christian.. so i'll be responding from this point of view.

The perception that we are separate from each other and our environment.

 

[Sleeppy]

The perception that we are separate from each other and our environment.

That's really interesting. Why do you think there is that perception?

 

[Sleeppy]

Not at all. you ask what is the origin of evil. my purpose is to suggest god is the origin of evil. either via dualism or gods as creator of everything and evil being apart of everything

Ok. What is the answer to your previous question to me, from either or both of those ideas?

 

[Iti oj]

Ok. What is the answer to your previous question to me, from either or both of those ideas?

god allows this to happen. Go has the ability to do something about this. God has the ability but does not do anything about it. Nor does God destroy evil. how is that anything but evil. Just say i am wrong, and god is not evil... good has no meaning with out evil to compare it too just like happy has no meaning with out sad. God needs evil to exist their for Gods existence causes evil. Also im looking for the blessing your god promise and i see nothing but a curse.