• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Our politicians lied to us for 20 years about Afghanistan !?

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
This article seems legit to me.

The Summary: The Afghan National Security Forces were never actually trained, and what's happened in Afghanistan during the last several weeks was inevitable.

I served in Afghanistan as a US Marine, twice. Here’s the truth in two sentences
I'd take it with a grain of salt. Only now it's mentioned after the fact?

Don't forget Afghanistan is a country where war is commonplace. I find it hard to fathom a rookie Afghanistan soldier even exists there.


If it was that, one would expect concerns of combat readiness would have been expressed publicly long before.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
You presume I haven't.

You haven't demonstrated that you have.

But I'm not the one ignoring history in pursit of a bogus conspiracy theory.

At least I can cite it. If you think that I'm "ignoring history," then I dare you - I double dare you - show me which "history" I'm ignoring. Because I'm not sure that you actually know.

An ironic accusation to make.

Oh? You said that I wasn't serious, when I'm clearly writing more about this topic than you. Compare your posts to mine, and see whose are longer. The one who writes more is the one who cares more, and is therefore more serious.

So, do you now wish to withdraw the accusation that I'm not serious? Do you seriously believe that I don't care about the issues under discussion? As far as I can tell, I care more than you do.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't reward ad hominems & dismissals with the effort of discussion.

You think your posts are a "reward"? And you have no room to talk when you speak of "ad hominems and dismissals."

EDIT: I would also note this as an admission that you don't put any effort into proving your assertions or claims.
 

lewisnotmiller

Grand Hat
Staff member
Premium Member
This article seems legit to me.

The Summary: The Afghan National Security Forces were never actually trained, and what's happened in Afghanistan during the last several weeks was inevitable.

I served in Afghanistan as a US Marine, twice. Here’s the truth in two sentences

It meshes with what I've read from other sources, albeit this is from a military perspective.

Estimates are suggesting that of the 350,000 strength Afghan Army, approximately 100,000 didn't exist at all, and were manufactured persons for multiple reasons (including local commanders collecting pay cheques).

Supply and logistical problems were rife.

Ultimately, the elite commando units were the only ones equipped and trained to a level which made them more than paper tigers.
 

pearl

Well-Known Member
Lucas Kunce had an interview with Rachel Maddow last night but I could not bring up the transcript. He was interesting and had no problem telling it like it is, or at least how he perceived it. But if those of us who are old enough look back over Vietnam and Iraq I think we must agree with Kunce.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
True, we're a country born in war, although at the beginning of our existence, we eschewed foreign entanglements and permanent alliances. Our Founders initially favored neutrality, rejecting the idea of playing favorites among nations. Americans didn't fear war (as we fought many during the 19th century), but the World Wars were the major turning point. That's when America's mindset and perceptions about itself and about the rest of the world changed into what it is now.

That's when America stopped being an actual physical country and started to become more of an abstract idea. Patriotism was no longer about defending the actual land, but more about defending ideas, such as "democracy" and "freedom," regardless of what territory we were fighting in.

Most Americans don't even know where a lot of these countries are, so how can they possibly believe that we can build nations if we can't even find them on the map? Don't the voters even bother to look at maps?



I would submit that a different standard must be followed when making accusations against government. By definition, government is required to prove their actions are/were justifiable to the people. We're not following the typical "rules of evidence." This is because We The People are the bosses of the government, and an employee has every legal and moral responsibility to report thoroughly and honestly to his employer.

It's not the same thing as proving something in science, nor is it a matter of a court case where someone is being accused of a crime. It's a boss calling his employee on the carpet to explain himself and justify his actions. If he's weaselly and doesn't give straight answers (or says he's "not at liberty to say" to HIS OWN BOSS), then I find that suspicious. That's grounds for termination, at least in an employer-employee relationship.

And that's all the conspiracy theorist has to prove in this case.

Good thing France didn't stay neutral during the American Revolution. Yorktown wouldn't have happened.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Good thing France didn't stay neutral during the American Revolution. Yorktown wouldn't have happened.

Possibly, although I'm struggling to see the connection between this assertion and the post you're quoting. Perhaps you'd care to elaborate?

I can sort of see what you might be getting at, but then, are you saying that U.S. should have returned the favor by siding with Napoleon during the Napoleonic Wars?
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
Possibly, although I'm struggling to see the connection between this assertion and the post you're quoting. Perhaps you'd care to elaborate?

I can sort of see what you might be getting at, but then, are you saying that U.S. should have returned the favor by siding with Napoleon during the Napoleonic Wars?

You were saying how the Founders were advocates of neutrality. I found it ironic that they were beneficiaries of France NOT staying neutral.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
You were saying how the Founders were advocates of neutrality. I found it ironic that they were beneficiaries of France NOT staying neutral.

True, although they had their own reasons for wanting the American revolutionaries to win, mainly because they still viewed England as a rival.

A key difference, though, is that, unlike our interventionist wars, the French didn't impose a puppet government upon us or force us to become a permanent ally.
 
Top