Policing For Profit

[Revoltingest]

We've long had a problem that governments will tailor laws & enforcement to produce revenue. Asset forfeiture has been
particularly popular, eg, find some dope in a car, & confiscate the car to sell at auction, letting repeat drunk drivers back
on the street after they pay hefty fines & court costs. Florida has a new game to snare innocent drivers...
Florida quietly shortened yellow light standards & lengths, resulting in more red light camera tickets for you | wtsp.com

Further reading:
http://www.ij.org/policing-for-profit-the-abuse-of-civil-asset-forfeiture-4

 

[Wirey]

Scuzzy, ain't it. Still, better than a tax hike.

 

[Revoltingest]

Scuzzy, ain't it. Still, better than a tax hike.

We got the tax hikes too.

 

[VajraYosid]

Aren't you a libertarian? What's not to like about pseudo-privatization of law enforcement?

What's next, prisons?

Oh...

 

[Revoltingest]

Aren't you a libertarian? What's not to like about pseudo-privatization of law enforcement?

When government enacts & enforces laws for income purposes, this not privatization.
Privatization is to have some functions of government performed by non-gov companies, eg, street repair.

 

[VajraYosid]

I swear I wrote pseudo; the point is, what's wrong with profiting from law enforcement? The same perversion of incentives occurs whether you consider it public or private sector if these "income purposes" are involved.

Granted, I'm not sure the alternative's incentives are any less perverse. Gorramn gubmint.

 

[Revoltingest]

I swear I wrote pseudo; the point is, what's wrong with profiting from law enforcement?

If law enforcement is seen as a profit center, this creates an incentive for government to create more lucrative violations, with just enforcement being supplanted with oppression.

The same perversion of incentives occurs whether you consider it public or private sector if these "income purposes" are involved.

There is a difference: We have a far more voluntary relationship with the private sector. Moreover, government limits business's ability to impose sanctions, eg, in MI a landlord's late fees must be reasonable to be enforceable. Government has far greater power, & less of a limit on punishment they can inflict.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Aren't you a libertarian? What's not to like about pseudo-privatization of law enforcement?

What's next, prisons?

Oh...

A Libertarian would tell the government to get out of the traffic light, other than what is required so that they put them there and keep them in a uniform color sequence so those who are color blind can tell what light is being shown (some might think it's too much, but I think the more common and everyday Libertarian would agree uniform color-coded traffic lights are for everyone's benefit).
And this is not at all a privatization of law enforcement, but a coalition of corporations and paid-for government manipulating the law to put the common citizen at an even further disadvantage. The law should never be for profit, and I would imagine you will be very hard pressed to find a Libertarian that thinks such a craftily manipulative government is acceptable.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

A Libertarian would tell the government to get out of the traffic light, other than what is required so that they put them there and keep them in a uniform color sequence so those who are color blind can tell what light is being shown (some might think it's too much, but I think the more common and everyday Libertarian would agree uniform color-coded traffic lights are for everyone's benefit).
And this is not at all a privatization of law enforcement, but a coalition of corporations and paid-for government manipulating the law to put the common citizen at an even further disadvantage. The law should never be for profit, and I would imagine you will be very hard pressed to find a Libertarian that thinks such a craftily manipulative government is acceptable.

Actually, Libertarian, Moderate, Progressive, Liberal, Conservative, I think everyone except for those of an authoritarian brand would be against the government bending over it's citizens to have their way with them in such a manner. It may even be one of the very rare things in which the Tea Party and Lefty Liberals may agree with.

 

[Revoltingest]

Actually, Libertarian, Moderate, Progressive, Liberal, Conservative, I think everyone except for those of an authoritarian brand would be against the government bending over it's citizens to have their way with them in such a manner. It may even be one of the very rare things in which the Tea Party and Lefty Liberals may agree with.

But would they ever admit it?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

But would they ever admit it?

I read a book about Vlad Dracula, the real Wallachian Voivode, not the fictional vampire that just so happened to be slapped with the same name, and in this story Vlad mentions that the only times the Christians were able to unite was when it came to time kill the Turks and reclaim the Holy Land (this taking place during the late 1300's through mid 1400's).
I can't help but wonder if today we are still stuck in the same mindset of hating our own until a greater threat comes along that threatens our very way of lives. And even though the Ottoman Empire faded into history just under a century ago, and you no longer hear the phrase "the Turks," we are still a people that is divided deeply on trivial issues until some warmongering Middle Easterners come along and unite us.
But then again conflicts between the West and Near-East have gone back since ancient times, and people who could only unite under a great threat.
So no, I really do not think they will ever admit it unless someone is serious about threatening violence. Which will probably always most likely be Middle Easterners for nothing more than it has always been a central focal point of global trade and the very gateway between the East and the West.

 

[Revoltingest]

Cop gets caught extorting money from motorist.
Cop gets desk duty, but no arrest for his felony extortion.
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...d-Bribery-Tickets-traffic-Stop-322537481.html
How many times do they get away with this without being recorded?
Without youtube, such a thing would'a been swept under the rug.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Cop gets caught extorting money from motorist.
Cop gets desk duty, but no arrest for his felony extortion.
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...d-Bribery-Tickets-traffic-Stop-322537481.html
How many times do they get away with this without being recorded?
Without youtube, such a thing would'a been swept under the rug.

Too bad Dr. Dre can't preside over a real case with Ice Cube prosecuting the police.

 

[Revoltingest]

Too bad Dr. Dre can't preside over a real case with Ice Cube prosecuting the police.

That must mean something to you young whippersnappers.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

We've long had a problem that governments will tailor laws & enforcement to produce revenue. Asset forfeiture has been
particularly popular, eg, find some dope in a car, & confiscate the car to sell at auction, letting repeat drunk drivers back
on the street after they pay hefty fines & court costs. Florida has a new game to snare innocent drivers...
Florida quietly shortened yellow light standards & lengths, resulting in more red light camera tickets for you | wtsp.com

Further reading:
http://www.ij.org/policing-for-profit-the-abuse-of-civil-asset-forfeiture-4

That article is two years old. I'm not sure of Florida specifically, but there are other states that were forced to change their yellow intervals after red light camera tickets were challenged in court.

I've taken some training on automated enforcement programs - one of the things they drill into you is to make sure your yellow and all-red times meet established standards before you start using red light cameras. There are some organizations that do their own thing; typically, they end up having to lengthen their yellow times to make sure their automated tickets are enforceable.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

A Libertarian would tell the government to get out of the traffic light, other than what is required so that they put them there and keep them in a uniform color sequence so those who are color blind can tell what light is being shown (some might think it's too much, but I think the more common and everyday Libertarian would agree uniform color-coded traffic lights are for everyone's benefit).

Fun fact: Quebec has the world's highest rates of colour blindness. It also has unique traffic signals: each signal light is a different shape, and the "stop" indication is shown at both ends of the signal head to make it easy to differentiate.

 

[Revoltingest]

That article is two years old.

Well, my post is over 2 years old too.

I'm not sure of Florida specifically, but there are other states that were forced to change their yellow intervals after red light camera tickets were challenged in court.
I've taken some training on automated enforcement programs - one of the things they drill into you is to make sure your yellow and all-red times meet established standards before you start using red light cameras. There are some organizations that do their own thing; typically, they end up having to lengthen their yellow times to make sure their automated tickets are enforceable.

I've no doubt that there are people in government who don't see the cops' function as fleecing us.
Nonetheless, the structure is still there to reap financial reward from enforcement.
Until that changes, they'll have the incentive to take our money & property.

Now, for something more current......
http://www.cato.org/multimedia/daily-podcast/policing-profit-lone-star-state

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That must mean something to you young whippersnappers.

It's a rap song from NWA called **** Tha Police, which was made in '86 I think. A part of it is a mock court session with Dr. Dre presiding as judge, and Ice Cube and Eazy E (but he died I think back in the 90s) acting as prosecutors, and those being prosecuted are the police.
A very different approach from Ice T's song Cop Killer, which goes straight for the black shirt, ski mask, gloves, and 12-gauge sawed off.
But both songs are a lot of fun, and have lots of chanting of "**** the police!"

 

[Revoltingest]

It's a rap song from NWA called **** Tha Police, which was made in '86 I think. A part of it is a mock court session with Dr. Dre presiding as judge, and Ice Cube and Eazy E (but he died I think back in the 90s) acting as prosecutors, and those being prosecuted are the police.
A very different approach from Ice T's song Cop Killer, which goes straight for the black shirt, ski mask, gloves, and 12-gauge sawed off.
But both songs are a lot of fun, and have lots of chanting of "**** the police!"

A history lesson from a whippersnapper.
Dang, I am brought low.

 

[Revoltingest]

In the news....
Chicago Is Trying to Pay Down Its Debt by Impounding Innocent People’s Cars