Poll: Are all babies atheist?

[Father Heathen]

I argued those points myself. Understanding and belief are separate things, and their negations are similarly distinct. You can understand god or not on one hand, and you can not believe in god on the other, but only one of those is atheism.

None of that negates what I've said.

Atheism is defined as a lack of belief in any deity. A baby doesn't know what a deity is, much less believe in one. It's not complicated.

 

[outhouse]

Are dead theists atheists?

(I won't clutter the forum with a new thread for such a silly question.)

No they are dead.

 

[Me Myself]

None of that negates what I've said.

Atheism is defined as a lack of belief in any deity. A baby doesn't know what a deity is, much less believe in one. It's not complicated.

Are rocks atheists?

 

[Willamena]

A baby doesn't know what a deity is, much less believe in one. It's not complicated.

It's also not atheism. It's just being uninformed.

If we already have a long-held concept for being uninformed, why do we need the relatively new label "atheism" to attach to it?

 

[Me Myself]

It's also not atheism. It's just being uninformed.

If we already have a long-held concept for being uninformed, why do we need the relatively new label "atheism" to attach to it?

Becaude being uninformed about deities is one of the definitions the oxford dictionary labels as atheist

 

[Willamena]

Becaude being uninformed about deities is one of the definitions the oxford dictionary labels as atheist

My Oxford Dictionary doesn't.

 

[Me Myself]

My Oxford Dictionary doesn't.

atheist
Pronunciation: /ˈeɪθɪɪst/
Translate atheist | into French | into German | into Italian | into Spanish
Definition of atheist
noun
a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods:
he is a committed atheist

Edit: now I replied my own question rocks and animals cant be atheists because it must be a person.

 

[Willamena]

atheist
Pronunciation: /ˈeɪθɪɪst/
Translate atheist | into French | into German | into Italian | into Spanish
Definition of atheist
noun
a person who disbelieves or lacks belief in the existence of God or gods:

Okay, so where does it say "a person who is uninformed about the existence of gods"?

Definitions are specific for a reason. If you read into the definition, you can read anything into it.

 

[Magic Man]

It's also not atheism. It's just being uninformed.

If we already have a long-held concept for being uninformed, why do we need the relatively new label "atheism" to attach to it?

Atheism is the lack of belief in gods. If you don't know about gods (are unaware of the concept), then you necessarily don't believe in them. So:

Person A doesn't know about gods > Person A lacks belief in gods > Atheists lack belief in gods > Person A is therefore an atheist

Quite simple really. Now you can argue that the definition "one who lacks belief in gods" isn't accurate or one that you like, but if you're going to agree that that's a valid definition, then you can't argue that the above doesn't apply.

 

[Willamena]

Person A doesn't know about gods > Person A lacks belief in gods

The red part is atheism, the black part isn't. Regardless that the black part leads to the red part, the black part isn't atheism.

Let's take another example: bouncing a ball.

Person A throws a ball > The ball strikes and rebounds off the floor

Which part is "bouncing"?

 

[Magic Man]

The red part is atheism, the black part isn't. Regardless that the black part leads to the red part, the black part isn't atheism.

Let's take another example: bouncing a ball.

Person A throws a ball > The ball strikes and rebounds off the floor

Which part is "bouncing"?

What's the point? The original comment that started this was that a baby doesn't have an understanding (in other words, doesn't know anything about) gods, let alone believe in them. I guess if you really want to split hairs, not being aware of gods is not technically atheism, but it might as well be, and the point is that one can't possibly believe in something one has no knowledge of.

 

[Ouroboros]

I'd say babies are more like agnostics (or soft atheists perhaps). They don't know what they are yet.

 

[Me Myself]

Okay, so where does it say "a person who is uninformed about the existence of gods"?

Definitions are specific for a reason. If you read into the definition, you can read anything into it.

If you dont know about gods you lack belief in them :slap:

If you want to go specific, then you can see it doesnt say :

"A person who has heard the concept of god or thought about it herself and then decided/realised she does not to believe about it":sarcastic

Because if it mesnt what you say and only that, that is what it wouldeed to say there.

 

[Me Myself]

I'd say babies are more like agnostics (or soft atheists perhaps). They don't know what they are yet.

Soft atheism would make sense.

 

[Willamena]

If you dont know about gods you lack belief in them :slap:

Then you are equating knowledge and belief, making them the same thing. Do you really believe that they are the same?

 

[Me Myself]

You are equating knowledge and belief, making them the same thing. Do you really believe that they are the same?

Nope, I am saying that without knowledge there is no believe. You can have knowledge and not belief, but you cant have belief without (At least unconscious) knowledge.

Therefore, without their knowledge they would have to lack their belief in it.

So babies are :

People? Check

Lack belief in god? Check

Atheists.

 

[Willamena]

Nope, I am saying that without knowledge there is no believe. You can have knowledge and not belief, but you cant have belief without (At least unconscious) knowledge.

Therefore, without their knowledge they would have to lack their belief in it.

We're just butting heads now. We'll have to agree to disagree.

 

[Me Myself]

We're just butting heads now. We'll have to agree to disagree.

On what part of that you disagree? You dosagree with the oxford dictionary definition or do you think that one can have a belief in sometng one does not know at all?

 

[Willamena]

On what part of that you disagree?

You don't know, even after all this arguing?

You consider natural atheism to be implicit of being uninformed, I consider it to be explicit of being informed.

You dosagree with the oxford dictionary definition...

Not at all. I agree with it. It's you I disagree with.

 

[Me Myself]

You consider natural atheism to be implicit of being uninformed

So does the oxford.

The oxford says that if you lack e belief you are an atheist, and it doesnt make spcific exclusion of those who havent heard of it.

So according to the oxford, babies are atheists.