Poll: Should ALL drugs be legalized?

[blü 2]

All drugs?

Cyanide and strychnine and lots of more subtle stuff?

And there were no restrictions on Radithor, I recall.

Not a good idea.

As for cannabis, heroin, crack, ecstasy and the rest of the everchanging zoo, addiction is often a physical propensity of certain vulnerable individuals, and I'd say feeding the addictable to the people who already bring you cigarettes isn't what a well-run society ought to do.

But the situation could be a lot freer than it is, as the cannabis experiments are showing.

 

[Jeremiahcp]

Well, it certainly isn't now. I would guess it's the number one criminal problem in my town.
And it isn't getting better. I think we should try something evidence based in the way of solutions.
Tom

You mean how tobacco just went away since it is legal and all, because highly addictive drugs when legal just go away, and I am sure you have irrefutable evidence to prove that.

 

[David1967]

Selectively. Pot? Sure, why not. I dont think it's as bad as alcohol. Plus the medicinal value. Meth? Never under any circumstances.

 

[columbus]

ou mean how tobacco just went away since it is legal and all,

Compared to when I was a kid it mostly has.
And while you might not care about this, it didn't involve millions of people going to jail or hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars funding those jails and the cops to put people there. Nor did it involve heavy government intrusion into citizens lives to enforce anti tobacco laws.

It mostly revolved around regulations and taxation. Selling to underage people is forbidden and around $5 per pack is tax. There are ways to do this that don't mostly create crime and wealthy drug dealers.
Tom

 

[sun rise]

I know that is thread is about *all* drugs, but I find it funny how some people perceive cannabis to be this heinous social menace, but have no qualms with the availability of alcohol and its consumption, despite the later being far more addicting, unhealthy, and dangerous than the former. You can't oppose the legalization of cannabis without also supporting another prohibition of alcohol, otherwise you would be a two-face hypocrite.

Unhealthy - well, there's more and more evidence about the dangers of cannabis all the time. Some of it is preliminary such as
Marijuana associated with three-fold risk of death from hypertension

Some of the evidence is stronger such as for example the special risk to those under 21 and risks of stroke and heart failure.https://www.livescience.com/24558-marijuana-effects.html

According to a 2014 Northwestern Medicine study of teen marijuana users, memory-related structures in the brain appeared to shrink, a possible signs of a decrease in neurons. These abnormalities remained two years after the teen stopped using marijuana, indicating that the drug has long-term effects and look similar to brains of schizophrenics. Those who started using marijuana after 21 generally do not experience the same type of brain abnormalities as those who started using the drug earlier.

A 2017 study by the Einstein Medical Center in Philadelphia found that those who used marijuana were 26 percent more likely to have a stroke than those who did not use marijuana. Those studied were also 10 percent more likely to have developed heart failure.

As far as addiction goes, casual occasional use is one thing but there is evidence that heavy use is something else
While it is widely thought that marijuana is not addictive, about 30 percent users may have some degree of marijuana use disorder, according to NIDA. Long-term marijuana users who try to quit experience cravings, irritability, sleeplessness, decreased appetite and anxiety — some of the same physical symptoms of those trying to quit other types of drugs or alcohol.

A 2016 study found a link between certain genetic markers and symptoms of marijuana addiction, suggesting that some people may have a genetic predisposition to marijuana addiction.

So while both can be argued as safe for casual and occasional moderate use, it's not clear to me that heavy regular use of alcohol is more dangerous to health than heavy regular use of marijuana.

 

[Laika]

I am interested in as many responses as possible; please vote.

Voted "No", but I could be persuaded to vote Yes. I find legalisation problematic because legalisation means privatisation and that all drugs become commodities within a marketplace. Even with some regulation, that's still pretty dangerous and I think there may be a slippery slope argument to be made about how drugs become acceptable. However, prohibition does not and cannot eliminate drug use entirely (on its own at least), so I can only really support it as a "lesser evil" (if that). If legalisation is a better way to manage the problem, I could support it. Its not an issue I know much about and wouldn't want to jump to conclusions simply because the principle of legalisation sounds good on paper. More freedom is not necessarily better particularly when addiction is involved.

 

[Jumi]

All recreational drugs? I'm not a fan of them but yes, almost all of them should be legal. The model has worked for Portugal who are spending money on rehab instead of enforcement.

 

[Quetzal]

Sorry, if I am not keen on the idea of legalizing meth just because you want to regulate it, guess I am just funny that way.

All we need is more corporate nonsense lobbying regulations and putting out false misleading information so they can cash in on more types of highly addictive poison. Yep, that is a brilliant idea, because we all know big business is super duper moral and they would never try to influence those regulations at the cost of consumer health.

My argument would be that with regulation comes greater safety and a better chance of effective treatment. Or we can go back to Clinton's war on drugs again. Worked out well before.... right?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

"Everything else has been a miserable, utter, and total failure."

Including legalization.

If legalized,
I suppose consideration as to what drugs actually do to people and how it affects lives is off the table.

As for cannabis, heroin, crack, ecstasy and the rest of the everchanging zoo, addiction is often a physical propensity of certain vulnerable individuals, and I'd say feeding the addictable to the people who already bring you cigarettes isn't what a well-run society ought to do.

For starters, that "illegal" status makes it incredibly difficult to study, including a studying how those substances and addiction work, and as well how to treat addicts. It creates a thriving black market that is helmed by violent, dangerous, and other wise unsavory types who should not wield the power they do. Being illegal and unregulated makes it easier for kids and teens to get, it creates a "forbidden fruit" temptation to use, and years later we are finding that were drugs are legalized and/or decriminalized, overall usage goes down. Not too mention legalization opens up room in jails and prisons, ends law enforcement of such laws, which saves tons of money and opens up time and resources to go after real/violent/dangerous criminals. And not to mention the huge extra waves of cash coming in from taxes. For the state, it is a win-win. For regular citizens who use and those who do not, it is a win-win. For those with kids, it is a win-win. Even with meth, I would much rather people's meth come from a stable environment that is an actual lab rather than risk some random person making it under very poor conditions and risking fires and leaking the toxic byproducts out into the environment.

You mean how tobacco just went away since it is legal and all, because highly addictive drugs when legal just go away, and I am sure you have irrefutable evidence to prove that.

With regulations it does go down. Because it is legal, there are no barriers and obstacles to overcome in researching addiction treatment.

Meth? Never under any circumstances.

ADHD meds like Ritalin and Adderal are forms of meth.

I find legalisation problematic because legalisation means privatisation and that all drugs become commodities within a marketplace.[/QUOTE

]
All drugs are already commodities within a marketplace. However, it is a market that makes dangerous and violent people rich and powerful.

 

[Quetzal]

For starters, that "illegal" status makes it incredibly difficult to study, including a studying how those substances and addiction work, and as well how to treat addicts.

To add to this, there are potential benefits as well. But we can never explore those if they are illegal. LSD, for example, has shown great promise as a treatment for cancer patients in regards to mental health. It also has promising outcomes for mental illness. Hemp has a wide gambit of medical and recreational benefits but is still caged in misinformation that can only be evaluated if it is legalized on a large scale.

 

[blü 2]

Because it is legal, there are no barriers and obstacles to overcome in researching addiction treatment.

But you seriously propose to legalize crystal meth and mop up afterwards?

I wouldn't.

 

[Quetzal]

But you seriously propose to legalize crystal meth and mop up afterwards?

I wouldn't.

The alternative is to continue as we always have and hope things change (they won't). At some point, a risk has to be taken.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

But you seriously propose to legalize crystal meth and mop up afterwards?

I wouldn't.

Makes me think you either aren't reading or aren't considering what I am saying. Even to study treatments into addiction is neigh impossible with the illegal status. It also scares away some from getting the treatment they need. We have people who need treatment, but we can't even study how to treat them.
And, yes, seriously I would rather legalize crystal meth and have it made under safe conditions by those who have an actual background in chemistry and a real lab set to make it in that a shaky set up that can put entire apartment buildings and city blocks at risk. We're already mopping up a mess, and this mess does include people who are evacuated from their homes because buying meth in a store isn't an option. So people make meth at home, they blow up, they leak toxic chemicals, and when the product makes someone addicted we can't even learn how to best treat them.
And I am very much for taking money out of the hands of gangs and cartels. If alcohol prohibition taught us anything, it's that the wrong types of people become rich and powerful from these black markets, usage tends to go up, and the problem does not go away. Had alcohol prohibition never been a thing, we'd have no idea who Al Capone was.

 

[blü 2]

The alternative is to continue as we always have and hope things change (they won't). At some point, a risk has to be taken.

I find it hard to disagree.

I just find it hard to agree.

 

[blü 2]

And, yes, seriously I would rather legalize crystal meth and have it made under safe conditions by those who have an actual background in chemistry and a real lab set to make it in that a shaky set up that can put entire apartment buildings and city blocks at risk.

Same answer as I just gave Quetzal.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Same answer as I just gave Quetzal.

Have you looked into Portugal? They decriminalized all drugs some time ago (over a decade ago now, I think), and their overall rate of drug usage has been going down.

Spoiler: pic

Drug induced deaths plummeted:

Spoiler: pic

Even rates of HIV are down:

Spoiler: pic

 

[Quetzal]

I find it hard to disagree.

I just find it hard to agree.

It's a scary idea, isn't it? I agree. Like others have pointed out, there is considerable risk! I think it should be scaled and monitored carefully. I will agree that a wide range legalization nationwide without any stops/steps in between could be a catastrophe.

 

[YmirGF]

I'm not keen to legalize all drugs, however, the war on drugs mentality has been a horrendously costly massive failure. We need to rethink this whole problem and a measured relaxing of laws would help to alleviate a lot of the stigma around recreational drug use and perhaps help to ease it into the mental health arena - where is rightly belongs. There are reasons people take drugs and if we concentrate on those reasons perhaps we can dent the incredible dependency our pill popping society has created.

 

[Quetzal]

I'm not keen to legalize all drugs, however, the war on drugs mentality has been a horrendously costly massive failure. We need to rethink this whole problem and a measured relaxing of laws would help to alleviate a lot of the stigma around recreational drug use and perhaps help to ease it into the mental health arena - where is rightly belongs. There are reasons people take drugs and if we concentrate on those reasons perhaps we can dent the incredible dependency our pill popping society has created.

There was a great program I heard about on NPR. I can't remember where (Oregon, maybe?) but they offered clean needles for drug users and a safe place to shoot up (without legal consequence) under the agreement that they would have a mandatory meeting with a substance abuse specialist. Their initial findings seemed promising but not conclusive, of course. What do you think of something like that?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

We need to rethink this whole problem and a measured relaxing of laws would help to alleviate a lot of the stigma around recreational drug use and perhaps help to ease it into the mental health arena - where is rightly belongs.

Indeed. Successful policies that have these policies approach drug addiction as a health issue/concern, not a legal problem. And it makes sense to do it that way, because addiction so very often does revolve around the mental health, crises, hardships, or other difficulties faced by those addicted. We know people with a mental disorder are more likely to use. Why should we punish them instead of helping them?