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Populist Xenophobia moves The Netherlands to the Right

Evangelicalhumanist

"Truth" isn't a thing...
Premium Member
It certainly looks as if Geert Wilders, the extreme right populist, anti-immigrant politician in the Netherlands has led his party to victory. This is very disappointing, as it seems to show that the our fears about one another based on race, religion, sexual orientation and what-have-you are playing a larger and larger part in our politics.

In my view, this cannot bode well for the future.

Comments welcome, of course.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
It certainly looks as if Geert Wilders, the extreme right populist, anti-immigrant politician in the Netherlands has led his party to victory. This is very disappointing, as it seems to show that the our fears about one another based on race, religion, sexual orientation and what-have-you are playing a larger and larger part in our politics.

In my view, this cannot bode well for the future.

Comments welcome, of course.
It's not only the Netherlands, it's a tendency all over Europe. It was an important factor for Brexit and we have Orban in Hungary and had until recently the PIS in Poland who refuse to take immigrants according to the European distribution model. Frontex, the European border patrol is violating human rights without loud outcries from the European public. We are in prepper mode for the upcoming climate crisis which is expected to displace hundreds of millions of people from then unliveable regions.
 

Debater Slayer

Vipassana
Staff member
Premium Member
It certainly looks as if Geert Wilders, the extreme right populist, anti-immigrant politician in the Netherlands has led his party to victory. This is very disappointing, as it seems to show that the our fears about one another based on race, religion, sexual orientation and what-have-you are playing a larger and larger part in our politics.

In my view, this cannot bode well for the future.

Comments welcome, of course.

Aside from the numerous threats to the rights of certain groups in the Netherlands that the ideology of someone like Wilders poses, this also somewhat worries me on a personal level because I don't want to end up finding nowhere in Europe to which I can immigrate due to the rise of anti-immigrant parties.

From what I have read about the Dutch elections, a likely silver lining is that Wilders' party will have to form a coalition with less extremist parties, and that means that the majority of Wilders' most radical ideas may not come to fruition. I hope that ends up being the case.
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
It certainly looks as if Geert Wilders, the extreme right populist, anti-immigrant politician in the Netherlands has led his party to victory. This is very disappointing, as it seems to show that the our fears about one another based on race, religion, sexual orientation and what-have-you are playing a larger and larger part in our politics.

In my view, this cannot bode well for the future.

Comments welcome, of course.
Migration is an issue all over Europe now and the emergence of communities with alien habits and appearance is unsettling large numbers of people, especially in those locations that have no history of being cultural melting pots. Towns in Britain like Leicester (~50% S Asian, mainly Indian Census 2011: Leicester 'most ethnically diverse' in region), or Bradford (25% Pakistani), which in my youth were monoculturally English, have seen very rapid change. It is hardly surprising that there is pushback from the indigenous inhabitants. In places like London, people worry less, as it has always had numerous communities of people with overseas ancestry.

Current drivers of migration are wars of course, plus growing awareness, via the internet, of how bad conditions are at home compared to elsewhere. (I was reading only today in the FT about the brain drain from Iran, due to the poor political and economic situation there.) Climate change may also be starting to be part of it and this will only increase.

To some degree, one can see much of it as payback for past colonialism. People come to the countries that previously colonised them, as they often have some understanding of it and may speak the language. But this argument is unlikely to impress a rural Dutchman who feels his village is rapidly turning into a muslim enclave. And of course, when economic times are hard, people look at what has changed when seeking a scapegoat.
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
For context: BBC > Dutch election: Anti-Islam populist Geert Wilders wins dramatic victory

From what I have read about the Dutch elections, a likely silver lining is that Wilders' party will have to form a coalition with less extremist parties, and that means that the majority of Wilders' most radical ideas may not come to fruition. I hope that ends up being the case.

On the other hand, there's the trajectory of the Israeli Knesset and the U.S. GOP. Right-wing populism has proven its ability to attract many and intimidate more.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Pardon me, dears....if you read the posts of me 5 years ago...I had told you guys that my country would unleash European Nationalism throughout Europe. And the results are evident. I mean...Sweden...Hungary...now Netherlands.
You should have believed me, guys. :)
 
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Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
It's not only the Netherlands, it's a tendency all over Europe. It was an important factor for Brexit and we have Orban in Hungary and had until recently the PIS in Poland who refuse to take immigrants according to the European distribution model. Frontex, the European border patrol is violating human rights without loud outcries from the European public. We are in prepper mode for the upcoming climate crisis which is expected to displace hundreds of millions of people from then unliveable regions.
One question: isn't it better we help Africans remain in Africa?
I mean...there are the resources, the money to help those countries develop.
 
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Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
Hopefully, in the UK it is starting to turn, but the damage has already been done.
Not one of these far right parties have delivered any benefit (except to their funders)
Exactly. I mean, Britain would have felt uncomfortable remaining in a EU filled with Christian Nationalists.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
Nationalism... isn't something that I sympathise with, to put it very mildly. Very, very mildly.

Ditto for the far-right and the alt-right.

But there are some matters that tend to be neglected or glossed over by most everyone else, and I think/hope/fear that one of those may have been decisive here.

The matter of the fact is that I largely agree with his views on Islam and I think that we are in dire need for other political tendencies to pay those better attention and even respect.

Although I don't think that nationality can or should ever be considered the same as adherence to Islam, and I don't agree with plans of paying people to leave. Quite on the contrary, I think it is important to let go of national boundaries and to provide assistance for people raised among Muslim expectations to find and learn alternatives. We do no choose our social environments, certainly not from birth.
 
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Heyo

Veteran Member
One question: isn't it better we help Africans remain in Africa?
I mean...there are the resources, the money to help those countries develop.
It would be but is impossible or very hard for multiple reasons. We can't stop climate change on our own, we can't politically intervene to stabilise the countries, especially when our USAmerican friends like to de-stabilise or start wars. It also wouldn't give us any clout with the right-wing xenophobes as they are as much opposed to foreign aid as they are to immigration.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
It would be but is impossible or very hard for multiple reasons. We can't stop climate change on our own, we can't politically intervene to stabilise the countries, especially when our USAmerican friends like to de-stabilise or start wars. It also wouldn't give us any clout with the right-wing xenophobes as they are as much opposed to foreign aid as they are to immigration.
Quite the opposite. The Italian right-wing is preparing a Marshall Plan for Africa.

Africa is borderless. There are areas which aren't affected by climate change.
And Europe is tiny and overpopulated, and cannot welcome 1 billion Africans, can it?
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
(...) Europe is tiny and overpopulated, and cannot welcome 1 billion Africans, can it?
There is some question about the future trends of acceptance of African immigrants in several countries.

Mainly those that perceive themselves as having low fertility rates and significant demand for workers on occupations that are undersupplied internally.

Whether Africans would be willing to fulfill that demand remains to be seen and IMO underdiscussed. Most people don't want to move abroad just because.
 

Estro Felino

Believer in free will
Premium Member
There is some question about the future trends of acceptance of African immigrants in several countries.

Mainly those that perceive themselves as having low fertility rates and significant demand for workers on occupations that are undersupplied internally.
In Europe there are already legal migrants from Syria, Tunisia, Morocco that work on undersupplied occupations. Legal migrants.
Tell me why we should welcome African illegals who are not needed, since Europe already has legal migrants.
Just one reason.
Most people don't want to move abroad just because.
Maybe they are into European women...who knows.
They are all males, those who land in Lampedusa.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
In Europe there are already legal migrants from Syria, Tunisia, Morocco that work on undersupplied occupations. Legal migrants.
Tell me why we should welcome African illegals who are not needed, since Europe already has legal migrants.
Just one reason.

Can't think of any, but then again I was not talking about illegal migration.
 

LuisDantas

Aura of atheification
Premium Member
That should be fairly obvious. Laws should be enforced and/or changed accordingly to the convenience of each community.

Would that be a concern here? I don't know. It is a hypothetical to begin with.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
It certainly looks as if Geert Wilders, the extreme right populist, anti-immigrant politician in the Netherlands has led his party to victory. This is very disappointing, as it seems to show that the our fears about one another based on race, religion, sexual orientation and what-have-you are playing a larger and larger part in our politics.

In my view, this cannot bode well for the future.

Comments welcome, of course.
I can't help but wonder how much social media is being exploited by state actors whose modus operandi is to attack democracies at their weak points.
 

Wandering Monk

Well-Known Member
Europe going to experience a demographic age problem: higher population of retired than workers. This will squeeze national budgets by reducing taxes from those in the workforce while having to support retirees. Lower population of young people will reduce the demand for goods, services and housing. GDP will suffer.

It seems that the most pragmatic solution would be to open up LEGAL immigration to increase the younger working population.
 
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