Prayer Experiment

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

Then I suspect that you will get the most generic of guidance in response.

Do you think deities have nothing to do with their time but wait around to receive and respond to (vague) human requests?

Be bold! Be specific! And be ready for an answer or answers you don't want or like! Be read for an emphatic "NO!" Be ready for absolute silence.

But if you're vague, be ready for, "You want guidance? Here, listen to me give you good advice for the next 15 years, 24/7! Or, because I'm busy with other matters, why not just read the collected great works of philosophy and faith until you understand them all!"

So in essence just scream "HEY IS CHRISTIANITY TRUE? WHICH RELIGION SHOULD I BE! HEY!" got it.

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

So in essence just scream "HEY IS CHRISTIANITY TRUE? WHICH RELIGION SHOULD I BE! HEY!" got it.

No, I don't think you "got it."

If you don't know who is it you're praying to, and if you don't know what it is you're praying to them about, then I don't see what help anyone else's methods are going to be...

Except that you want to know which religion is right for you...the only way I know of that you can do that is to try each candidate out--read its texts, follow its rituals, understand the worldview, and so on--that is EXPERIENCE IT. Doing a simple general prayer according to someone else's formula is unlikely to tell you anything useful about the religion or its deity. Religions are about community (and individual, but that's at a personal level) relationship with the sacred.

It sounds an awful lot like you're auditioning deities...for a role in a production you are uncertain about, that hasn't been written yet. To me, that is not very respectful towards the deities, not to mention the communities, involved.

okay, I'll butt out of your thread now...

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

No, I don't think you "got it."

If you don't know who is it you're praying to, and if you don't know what it is you're praying to them about, then I don't see what help anyone else's methods are going to be...

Except that you want to know which religion is right for you...the only way I know of that you can do that is to try each candidate out--read its texts, follow its rituals, understand the worldview, and so on--that is EXPERIENCE IT. Doing a simple general prayer according to someone else's formula is unlikely to tell you anything useful about the religion or its deity. Religions are about community (and individual, but that's at a personal level) relationship with the sacred.

It sounds an awful lot like you're auditioning deities...for a role in a production you are uncertain about, that hasn't been written yet. To me, that is not very respectful towards the deities, not to mention the communities, involved.

okay, I'll butt out of your thread now...

Easy there @beenherebeforeagain I was just messing around , I understand what you meant.

 

[Geoff-Allen]

Interesting thread ... you asked for suggestions. Here is one site -

Positive Christianity - Guidance Prayers - Non Denominational

Hope that helps!

All the best.

 

[Geoff-Allen]

You might also try a google search of gratitude prayers?

Cheers

 

[beenherebeforeagain]

Easy there @beenherebeforeagain I was just messing around , I understand what you meant.

Sorry for over-reacting, you're new to me, and I sometimes do have difficulty reading people through text...So, until next time, Good Luck in your quest!

 

[Milton Platt]

So the idea here was to have a little prayer experiment to determine whether or not the feeling I have gotten of peace after praying is just a placebo. This is not a definitive test but it is certainly a beginning. Right off the bat it should be stated that we won’t be praying for any specific item or event just guidance and peace.



So we’re going to try several different types of prayer. Any prayers you think I should try go ahead nad suggest it. I’ll be trying to get through as many as possible but I want to give each a certain amount of time between. So it won’t be just one after another after another.



I’m going to try

-Christian Prayer



-Zoroastrian prayer



-Prayer to Hashem



-Hindu prayer



-Pagan prayer



This covers a decent amount of the world religions and we’ll see what the results end up being.

Depending on how I feel this may give me a tiny bit of indication as to which faith is right or at least right for me. It’s only the first step mind you and we have a long way to go after that.

@The Ragin Pagan If you could provide some resources on how to pray to the gods that would be great.

Your experiment won't really tell you much of anything. "Feelings of peace" is subjective and there is no way to quantify it. It may tell you which god and/or which prayer you like best through your reaction, but other people will assuredly have differing reactions.

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

Your experiment won't really tell you much of anything. "Feelings of peace" is subjective and there is no way to quantify it. It may tell you which god and/or which prayer you like best through your reaction, but other people will assuredly have differing reactions.

That's fine. I didn't figure it would.

 

[Spiderman]

The Rosary is by far my favorite. It helps me more than anything including professional help, Electroconvulsive therapy, and medications.

 

[Nous]

Regardless, it's going to be an experiment where n=1.

I'm sorry I don't actually understand. What do you mean?

That your "little experiment" is not an experiment by which one can answer the question you wish to answer. An actual placebo effect is found by comparing the outcomes of those receiving a treatment to those receiving an inert substance--a placebo. To be noteworthy, such an experiment requires a sample size large enough for the results to have statistical power. Especially with psychiatric drugs, the improvement seen in the treatment group is often mostly duplicated in the placebo group, indicating that the drug is actually not effective.

 

[Lorgar-Aurelian]

That your "little experiment" is not an experiment by which one can answer the question you wish to answer. An actual placebo effect is found by comparing the outcomes of those receiving a treatment to those receiving an inert substance--a placebo. To be noteworthy, such an experiment requires a sample size large enough for the results to have statistical power. Especially with psychiatric drugs, the improvement seen in the treatment group is often mostly duplicated in the placebo group, indicating that the drug is actually not effective.

K

 

[minorwork]

So the idea here was to have a little prayer experiment to determine whether or not the feeling I have gotten of peace after praying is just a placebo. This is not a definitive test but it is certainly a beginning. Right off the bat it should be stated that we won’t be praying for any specific item or event just guidance and peace.



So we’re going to try several different types of prayer. Any prayers you think I should try go ahead nad suggest it. I’ll be trying to get through as many as possible but I want to give each a certain amount of time between. So it won’t be just one after another after another.

Might sound strange but I get a feeling of peace shortly after my wife leaves the house. Did I pray for it, though?

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

@The Ragin Pagan If you could provide some resources on how to pray to the gods that would be great.

Sorry this has taken so long to get back to.

So with the Norse Gods, we don't often "pray" to them; not in the Christian sense. We mostly hail them, and to hail the Gods during a celebration or ceremony is to invite them to join us, and to thank them for their contribution in whatever it is that we're celebrating--be it planting, harvest, the solstices and equinoxes, or other such holiday. In general it is to recognize a Gods' presence - for instance, in a thunderstorm, a harvest, or the coming of spring.

When we pray to the Gods, it is usually as future thanks, rather than - for lack of a better word - groveling. We pray to Thor to bring us rain. We pray to Freyr to nourish the land. Freyr and Freyja for fertility - male and female respectively - etc. Things that will happen when they need to, but that we find reason to give thanks for.

When we do pray to the Gods in desire or petition, it's for things that are truly out of our hands. The above favorable weather conditions, or for a speedy recovery past what medicine and doctors can do. And - in general - thanks is given where it is deserved. A good example is with medicine; should there be a good outcome with, say, a surgery, the common Heathen response to that (if it's given) would be along the line of "Thank the Gods, and thank you Dr. Smith". We thank the Gods for what hand they may have had in the process (for instance, the ingredients used for medicine, or the knowledge of medicine in general), and the doctors for their skill and knowledge in performing the surgery.

 

[divine lover]

So the idea here was to have a little prayer experiment to determine whether or not the feeling I have gotten of peace after praying is just a placebo. This is not a definitive test but it is certainly a beginning. Right off the bat it should be stated that we won’t be praying for any specific item or event just guidance and peace.



So we’re going to try several different types of prayer. Any prayers you think I should try go ahead nad suggest it. I’ll be trying to get through as many as possible but I want to give each a certain amount of time between. So it won’t be just one after another after another.



I’m going to try

-Christian Prayer



-Zoroastrian prayer



-Prayer to Hashem



-Hindu prayer



-Pagan prayer



This covers a decent amount of the world religions and we’ll see what the results end up being.

Depending on how I feel this may give me a tiny bit of indication as to which faith is right or at least right for me. It’s only the first step mind you and we have a long way to go after that.

@The Ragin Pagan If you could provide some resources on how to pray to the gods that would be great.

In my opinion It doesn't matter which prayer you use it only matters how sincere you are and how much your mind drops in, the purpose of prayer is to slow the thoughts by concentration and open your feelings of connection and love, it's the same God whichever name or prayer you choose. To have faith in a religion you should study the philosophy and see what you agree with otherwise you wont have faith and achieve transcendence of your mind. I personally have been initiated into a mantra as well as other techniques and as the teacher was so beautiful and full of love it gives me faith and leads to the inner light and sound. We look outside with our eyes but if we look within with the inner eye we see light and by blocking the outer sounds we can hear inner sounds, this really takes us up a level beyond the mind. What we all need is satisfaction the world can never fully satisfy us, when we truly connect with God we are totally satisfied at last.

 

[Milton Platt]

That's fine. I didn't figure it would.

'Nuf said....carry on.

 

[New Age Spiritual Leader]

IMO - prayer is nothing more than a personal comforting to the person who is conducting the action.

Prayers are mental thoughts we choose to enact. There is no evidence that our thoughts are emitted to another person or entity, in order for the target person to be healed, "bettered" or helped.

There is no proof of any god, so how can one prove a prayer works or not?

I've enacted a simple process that can help determine the veracity of this "issue".

The experiment requires the participation of a minimum of three individuals.
- the prayer giver (PG)
- the prayer receiver (PR)
- third party person (3P) who is told by the prayer giver - on what the pray will be. This allows the "giver" to stay completely honest in their role and not change up a prayer.

1. The PG decides upon what prayer to utilize.
2. The PR is not told what this is.
3. The PG tells the 3P what the prayer will be.
4. The PG begins a 2-week period of time of praying for the PR to be "whatever".
+ Now at this point, many will say, "'God' has no time limit to answer prayers."
+ I have to disagree. "God" does need a time limit, because it could be a life or death situation for the individual. If the PG is praying for the PR to be healed, and they are not before they die, then the prayer actually failed. I'm trying to get the prayer to succeed by placing a time limit on the experiment.
+ what about if the prayer is something simple - like a "wish" to have the PR to be blessed with a new heart and goes to church. For me, I haven't been in a church, except once....when my father died. Maybe a prayer could be to have me "renew" my "christian values" and restart my life. I would think that this would happen within a two week period of time. Way more than enough time to get a prayer to "God" and then back to me.....I'm not going to alive to see the prayer completed if one "God day" is equal to 1000 years. There will be a limit on time.
+ This limit is why many refuse to participate in the experiment. They claim that this time limit "challenges God" when we shouldn't. Well....I'm not just anybody.....I'm a "god" too.....per the Bible.

5. The PG will contact the PR weekly to see if anything "special" has occurred.
+ I've a very honest person and will tell the PG if anything special has occurred. If something had occurred to me, the 3P will verify (or negate) what the PG said, and state whether that was indeed the initial prayer projected. If it is, then the praying was successful. If it was not....AFTER TWO-WEEKS.....then the experiment will end as a failure.

Who's ready to embark upon the unknown.

FYI - I've conducted this experiment two other times with willing participants and both times the experiment failed.

Does this make my theory that prayer fails true? I think it does. Thus praying is just a mind game people play with others to show comport and support, but actually never have something positive occur.

"The doctor is in......" - Lucy van Pelt

 

[The Emperor of Mankind]

When we do pray to the Gods in desire or petition, it's for things that are truly out of our hands. The above favorable weather conditions, or for a speedy recovery past what medicine and doctors can do. And - in general - thanks is given where it is deserved. A good example is with medicine; should there be a good outcome with, say, a surgery, the common Heathen response to that (if it's given) would be along the line of "Thank the Gods, and thank you Dr. Smith". We thank the Gods for what hand they may have had in the process (for instance, the ingredients used for medicine, or the knowledge of medicine in general), and the doctors for their skill and knowledge in performing the surgery.

This is a good example of something that's not uncommon in my local Pagan community. Using your example of medicine, more than a few people offer thanks to the gods for someone making it through surgery or a pregnancy in good health but they almost never thank the medical professionals involved in actually making that happen. I find it quite mystifying and rather impolite.

 

[Tumah]

Prayer to Hashem

I've never heard "peaceful feelings" described as an effect of Jewish prayer, nor is it a goal. So you can skip us.

 

[The Kilted Heathen]

...more than a few people offer thanks to the gods for someone making it through surgery or a pregnancy in good health but they almost never thank the medical professionals involved in actually making that happen. I find it quite mystifying and rather impolite.

They do too? Ugh... Yes, that is highly impolite. We ought thank the Gods for things like these bugs that have been discovered to digest plastics, not for the skills of another human.

 

[pearl]

I personally have been initiated into a mantra as well as other techniques and as the teacher was so beautiful and full of love it gives me faith and leads to the inner light and sound. We look outside with our eyes but if we look within with the inner eye we see light and by blocking the outer sounds we can hear inner sounds, this really takes us up a level beyond the mind. What we all need is satisfaction the world can never fully satisfy us, when we truly connect with God we are totally satisfied at last.

I think this is where genuine prayer, the desire to commune, is at, apart from any religious affiliation. You are on the right track with a 'mantra'. We can't meditate unless we place ourselves in the 'present'. Serious meditation may take years or even a lifetime to become successful. There are always dark periods when one wants to give up.

'When the Well Runs Dry; Prayer Beyond the Beginnings'
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/9084.When_the_Well_Runs_Dry

Personally I prefer meditative prayer in the Eastern form.