Pre-Easter and Post-Easter Jesus

[mohammed_beiruti]

parakletos is the Greek word for “helper”

Jesus said he would send a parakletos or helper soon after his departure.

thanks pegg , but do you have a neutral resource? a dictionary or some thing like that?

please can you provide me the manuscript number that mentioning this particular word(if any).

 

[Thesavorofpan]

Do you think it's important to make a distinction between the two? The Pre-Easter Jesus being the man Jesus who taught things and was crucified. The Post-Easter Jesus being the risen Christ or mystic Christ, who Christians believe is divine, saviour of the world, etc. What can differentiating between the two show us?

Uhh so you believe there was two Jesus? If not could you explain what you mean by this?

 

[Pegg]

thanks pegg , but do you have a neutral resource? a dictionary or some thing like that?

please can you provide me the manuscript number that mentioning this particular word(if any).

by manuscript number i assume you mean the 'bible verse'
if so, they are as follows:

John 14:16: "he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you"
John 14:26: "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the"
John 15:26: "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send"
John 16:7: "if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto"
1 John 2:1: "any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus"

Acts 2:33 "Therefore because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out this which YOU see and hear. "


​

a couple of references:
try here

or here

 

[mohammed_beiruti]

by manuscript number i assume you mean the 'bible verse'
if so, they are as follows:

John 14:16: "he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you"
John 14:26: "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the"
John 15:26: "But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send"
John 16:7: "if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto"
1 John 2:1: "any man sin, we have an advocatewith the Father, Jesus"​

Acts 2:33 "Therefore because he was exalted to the right hand of God and received the promised holy spirit from the Father, he has poured out this which YOU see and hear. "​

a couple of references:
try here

or here

thank very much pegg, anyway I do not consider a biblical resource as a neutral one.

sorry no offense!

 

[Pegg]

thank very much pegg, anyway I do not consider a biblical resource as a neutral one.

sorry no offense!

ah ok, so you want a non theological definition for parakletos?

I will try to find something, non theological.

 

[Pegg]

wiki??

 

[Oberon]

thanks pegg , but do you have a neutral resource? a dictionary or some thing like that?

please can you provide me the manuscript number that mentioning this particular word(if any).

From A Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament and other Early Christian literature (otherwise known as the BDAG, which is perhaps THE lexicon for NT Greek in English):

Parakletos- "originally meant in the passive sense (...parakletos dedoka auto= when I was asked I gave to him...) 'one who is called to someone's aid.' Accordingly Lain writers commonly rendered it, in its NT occurances, with 'advocatus'... In the few places where the word is found in pre-Christian and extra-Christian literature, as well it has for the most part a more general sense: one who appears in another's behalf, mediator, intercessor, helper (Demosth. 19, 1, Dionys. Hal. 11, 37, 1; Heraclit. Sto. 59 p. 80, 19,; Cass. Dio 46,20, 1; POxy 2725, 10...

 

[dogsgod]

[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]
[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]paraklētos[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva] is Greek. [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]παράκλητος[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]


summoned, called to one's side, esp. called to one's aid

1. one who pleads another's cause before a judge, a pleader, counsel for defense, legal assistant, an advocate
2. one who pleads another's cause with one, an intercessor
   1. of Christ in his exaltation at God's right hand, pleading with God the Father for the pardon of our sins
3. in the widest sense, a helper, succourer, aider, assistant
   1. of the Holy Spirit destined to take the place of Christ with the apostles (after his ascension to the Father), to lead them to a deeper knowledge of the gospel truth, and give them divine strength needed to enable them to undergo trials and persecutions on behalf of the divine kingdom

Translations:
[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]KJV (5) - advocate, 1; comforter, 4; [/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]NAS (5) - Advocate, 1; Helper, 4; [/FONT]
[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]http://www.searchgodsword.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3875
[/FONT][/FONT][/FONT]

 

[tomato1236]

[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]
[/FONT][/FONT]paraklētos[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva] is Greek. [/FONT][/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]παράκλητος[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]



[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]summoned, called to one's side, esp. called to one's aid

1. one who pleads another's cause before a judge, a pleader, counsel for defense, legal assistant, an advocate
2. one who pleads another's cause with one, an intercessor
   1. of Christ in his exaltation at God's right hand, pleading with God the Father for the pardon of our sins
3. in the widest sense, a helper, succourer, aider, assistant
   1. of the Holy Spirit destined to take the place of Christ with the apostles (after his ascension to the Father), to lead them to a deeper knowledge of the gospel truth, and give them divine strength needed to enable them to undergo trials and persecutions on behalf of the divine kingdom

Translations:[/FONT]
[/FONT][/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]KJV (5) - advocate, 1; comforter, 4; [/FONT][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]NAS (5) - Advocate, 1; Helper, 4; [/FONT]
[/FONT][/FONT]
[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Arial, Geneva]http://www.searchgodsword.org/lex/grk/view.cgi?number=3875[/FONT]
[/FONT][/FONT]

Holy crap. Greek is just like Cyrillic. I had no idea! I just read that Greek word and holy crap. I can read Greek.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Uhh so you believe there was two Jesus? If not could you explain what you mean by this?

Pre-Easter Jesus and Post-Easter Jesus is terminology I borrowed from liberal Christian scholar and university professor Marcus Borg to differentiate between the historical Jesus and the Jesus of Christianity, or how Christianity came to view Jesus, post-Easter.

 

[dogsgod]

Do you think it's important to make a distinction between the two? The Pre-Easter Jesus being the man Jesus who taught things and was crucified. The Post-Easter Jesus being the risen Christ or mystic Christ, who Christians believe is divine, saviour of the world, etc. What can differentiating between the two show us?

These are distinctly different, and always have been. Interestingly enough, the post-Easter Christ came first, the epistle writers were obsessed with a risen Christ, and much later the pre-Easter Jesus came about once the gospels were written. Differentiating the two show us how early Christianity evolved, and how these writings have influenced followers.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

Do you think it's important to make a distinction between the two? The Pre-Easter Jesus being the man Jesus who taught things and was crucified. The Post-Easter Jesus being the risen Christ or mystic Christ, who Christians believe is divine, saviour of the world, etc. What can differentiating between the two show us?

I think learning the transition would be far more beneficial. Differentiating between the two (actually suppressing the pre- and lifting up the post-) is what the Catholic Church does and it hasn't got it very far.

 

[dogsgod]

I think learning the transition would be far more beneficial. Differentiating between the two (actually suppressing the pre- and lifting up the post-) is what the Catholic Church does and it hasn't got it very far.

It's only the wealthiest church in the world.

 

[Oberon]

I think learning the transition would be far more beneficial. Differentiating between the two (actually suppressing the pre- and lifting up the post-) is what the Catholic Church does and it hasn't got it very far.

How exactly does the catholic church do this?

 

[strikeviperMKII]

It's only the wealthiest church in the world.

I think Jesus said something about that...I think it goes 'easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle'. Something like that.

 

[strikeviperMKII]

How exactly does the catholic church do this?

1. Tell everyone that Jesus is the only way to heaven. Quote scripture when asked for proof ('I am the way, the truth and the life)
2. Tell everyone that Jesus gave the apostles power to forgive sins, which is the way to hell.
3. Tell them that the apostles gave this power to every priest after them and so on and so on.
4. Tell them that ONLY priests can forgive sins, because they were given the power by Jesus.

Everything else spawns from there. It's all based on the fear of hell, which Jesus didn't even talk about. It puts Jesus up on a pedestal, one that is impossible to reach without the Catholic Church. In essence, the Church became Jesus, so they can make all the rules.
Everything else

 

[ukCatholic]

The pre- and the post Easter Jesus are the same. Both are 100% man, and 100% God.

At least from my point of view.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

The pre- and the post Easter Jesus are the same. Both are 100% man, and 100% God.

At least from my point of view.

Of course, that's what the Church dictates to you.

 

[Thesavorofpan]

Pre-Easter Jesus and Post-Easter Jesus is terminology I borrowed from liberal Christian scholar and university professor Marcus Borg to differentiate between the historical Jesus and the Jesus of Christianity, or how Christianity came to view Jesus, post-Easter.

Thank you for clarfing that for me.

Well it all depends on the subject at hand. I say if your trying to look at the history of Christianity without any religious bias then trying to find information on the Pre-easter Jesus would be needed, but I don't think you could find it by just googling it up. Too many Christian websites out there.

 

[Rainbow Mage]

Thank you for clarfing that for me.

Well it all depends on the subject at hand. I say if your trying to look at the history of Christianity without any religious bias then trying to find information on the Pre-easter Jesus would be needed, but I don't think you could find it by just googling it up. Too many Christian websites out there.

Scholars suggests one could find information about the pre-Easter Jesus in the gospels if they put them into a 1st century Jewish context and sift out all the things Jesus as a Jew wouldn't likely say.