Punishing censorship on social media: what do you think?

[Stevicus]

Did Obama have the tail of straw by chance?
So the organization canceled the show to make him a favor?

I had to look that phrase up:

Avere la coda di paglia
Language: Italian

In English, please! To have a straw tail

What it means: To have a guilty conscience

Why a straw tail? Do you have a colleague who is always late? Let’s imagine that one day they finally arrive on time. You are delighted and tell them how happy you are about this achievement. They might feel slightly embarrassed by the unexpected compliment. Not wanting to reveal their guilt, they might give a rude or grumpy reply. Having a straw tail describes a situation where their weakness has been exposed and can be easily seen by everyone – just like a straw tail catching fire.

Italian Conference Interpreter - To have a straw tail (unlockingwords.co.uk)

I don't recall the circumstances of Roseann Barr's firing, as I tried to avoid watching anything to do with her. Though I do remember when she took a lot of heat for singing the National Anthem at a ballgame and doing it in a mocking style. Some say she should have gotten fired for that, but apparently that didn't happen.

Most corporations try to avoid controversy, and if one of their employees or contractors becomes more of a liability than an asset, then they'll cut ties for business reasons. Sometimes that's a matter of properly gauging public opinion, which is an inexact science and can be hit and miss. The public might support it, but then again, there might be those who criticize a corporation for being "too woke." So, it may be a situation where they're damned if they do, damned if they don't.

 

[Estro Felino]

I had to look that phrase up:

Avere la coda di paglia
Language: Italian

In English, please! To have a straw tail

What it means: To have a guilty conscience

Why a straw tail? Do you have a colleague who is always late? Let’s imagine that one day they finally arrive on time. You are delighted and tell them how happy you are about this achievement. They might feel slightly embarrassed by the unexpected compliment. Not wanting to reveal their guilt, they might give a rude or grumpy reply. Having a straw tail describes a situation where their weakness has been exposed and can be easily seen by everyone – just like a straw tail catching fire.

Italian Conference Interpreter - To have a straw tail (unlockingwords.co.uk)

I don't recall the circumstances of Roseann Barr's firing, as I tried to avoid watching anything to do with her. Though I do remember when she took a lot of heat for singing the National Anthem at a ballgame and doing it in a mocking style. Some say she should have gotten fired for that, but apparently that didn't happen.

Most corporations try to avoid controversy, and if one of their employees or contractors becomes more of a liability than an asset, then they'll cut ties for business reasons. Sometimes that's a matter of properly gauging public opinion, which is an inexact science and can be hit and miss. The public might support it, but then again, there might be those who criticize a corporation for being "too woke." So, it may be a situation where they're damned if they do, damned if they don't.

I understand. But ABC can never figure out whether the majority of the people sides with Roseanne, despite her tweet, and after her tweet.
When you love a comedian or a show, you don't care about her political ideas, no matter how controversial they can be.
I think it had nothing to do with the audience. It had to do with certain political mechanisms...that make the Clintons, the Obamas and the Bidens untouchable.


PS: Thank you so much for that insightful English translation. Sorry...I frequently use that idiom IRL...so I had to...

 

[Estro Felino]

@Stevicus
There is an interview with Barr on the Hannity Show.
By the way, as you may know, Libya is just an open book to me. To all Italians it is.
I do know what was done in Libya, back in the days. And that Gaddafi was hated because he used to fight radicals. But how can you be called a tyrant just because you jail the radicals and the Salafists that would like to take Libya back to the Middle Ages?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Hitler was in combat. Probably.

During the Holocaust? Nah. Nice sidestep though.

Manson attempted on Bernard “Lotsapoppa” Crowe from my understanding.

" In 1971, Manson was convicted of first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder for the deaths of seven people, including the film actress Sharon Tate. The prosecution contended that, while Manson never directly ordered the murders, his ideology constituted an overt act of conspiracy.[1]"

Charles Manson - Wikipedia
People v. Manson

 

[ImmortalFlame]

I understand. But ABC can never figure out whether the majority of the people sides with Roseanne, despite her tweet, and after her tweet.
When you love a comedian or a show, you don't care about her political ideas, no matter how controversial they can be.
I think it had nothing to do with the audience. It had to do with certain political mechanisms...that make the Clintons, the Obamas and the Bidens untouchable.

That is just completely baseless.

Roseanne's political opinions were well known before the renewal of her TV show. It had literally been the most notable thing about her since her show's first cancellation.

The show wasn't renewed because there was a massive public backlash against her racist comments.

Stop denying reality.

 

[SkepticThinker]

If you can't speak out loud, you prevent people from expressing thoughts and challenging wrong thoughts... thought control. If you can speak into the thoughts of man and another person is prevented of doing so... thought control.

If you want to "speak out loud" and tell people that they are garbage, you have that right. And people have the right to tell you that you're a jerk.

The dude you're talking about was arrested for "mischief" and "causing a distubance." Much like somebody you might find peeing on a street corner. And those charges were dropped.

This isn't thought control.

 

[SkepticThinker]

I understand. But ABC can never figure out whether the majority of the people sides with Roseanne, despite her tweet, and after her tweet.
When you love a comedian or a show, you don't care about her political ideas, no matter how controversial they can be.
I think it had nothing to do with the audience. It had to do with certain political mechanisms...that make the Clintons, the Obamas and the Bidens untouchable.


PS: Thank you so much for that insightful English translation. Sorry...I frequently use that idiom IRL...so I had to...

"Ms. Barr later apologized, but it was too late. In announcing the show’s cancellation, ABC’s entertainment president, Channing Dungey, said in a statement that “Roseanne’s Twitter statement is abhorrent, repugnant and inconsistent with our values.”
After Racist Tweet, Roseanne Barr’s Show Is Canceled by ABC (Published 2018)

“Roseanne’s Twitter statement is abhorrent, repugnant and inconsistent with our values, and we have decided to cancel her show,” Channing Dungey, president of ABC Entertainment, said in a statement Tuesday. ...

... The CEO of ABC’s parent company, the Walt Disney Co., agreed with the decision to cancel the series.

“You can’t debate what is morally right,” Bob Iger said in an interview with CNBC’s David Faber minutes after the announcement.

Iger said there was no debate internally about what to do. He discussed the cancellation with Ben Sherwood, president of the Disney-ABC Television Group, and other executives, according to Faber.

“There was only one thing to do here, and that was the right thing,” Iger said in a tweet that quoted Dungey’s statement.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/29/abc...t-about-black-obama-aide-valerie-jarrett.html

There you go. You're searching for a conspiracy that doesn't exist.

If you think Hillary Clinton, Obama (throw his wife into the mix too - she's been at the receiving end of some gross comments) and the Bidens are "untouchable" from mean Tweets and horrible comments and attacks, then all I can say is you haven't looked around the internet enough, or you've got blinders on. I mean, Hillary Clinton has been the target of some super nasty comments for decades now.

 

[SkepticThinker]

@Stevicus
There is an interview with Barr on the Hannity Show.
By the way, as you may know, Libya is just an open book to me. To all Italians it is.
I do know what was done in Libya, back in the days. And that Gaddafi was hated because he used to fight radicals. But how can you be called a tyrant just because you jail the radicals and the Salafists that would like to take Libya back to the Middle Ages?

So we're changing the subject now?

 

[Estro Felino]

"Ms. Barr later apologized, but it was too late. In announcing the show’s cancellation, ABC’s entertainment president, Channing Dungey, said in a statement that “Roseanne’s Twitter statement is abhorrent, repugnant and inconsistent with our values.”
After Racist Tweet, Roseanne Barr’s Show Is Canceled by ABC (Published 2018)

“Roseanne’s Twitter statement is abhorrent, repugnant and inconsistent with our values, and we have decided to cancel her show,” Channing Dungey, president of ABC Entertainment, said in a statement Tuesday. ...

... The CEO of ABC’s parent company, the Walt Disney Co., agreed with the decision to cancel the series.

“You can’t debate what is morally right,” Bob Iger said in an interview with CNBC’s David Faber minutes after the announcement.

Iger said there was no debate internally about what to do. He discussed the cancellation with Ben Sherwood, president of the Disney-ABC Television Group, and other executives, according to Faber.

“There was only one thing to do here, and that was the right thing,” Iger said in a tweet that quoted Dungey’s statement.
https://www.cnbc.com/2018/05/29/abc...t-about-black-obama-aide-valerie-jarrett.html

There you go. You're searching for a conspiracy that doesn't exist.

If you think Hillary Clinton, Obama (throw his wife into the mix too - she's been at the receiving end of some gross comments) and the Bidens are "untouchable" from mean Tweets and horrible comments and attacks, then all I can say is you haven't looked around the internet enough, or you've got blinders on. I mean, Hillary Clinton has been the target of some super nasty comments for decades now.

Honestly, I watched this interview and she points out how hers was a political tweet and there was nothing racist in that joke because she thought Jarrett was white (she does look like a white person to me, Iranians are white).

And by the way, she is a comedian so the First Amendment applies twice.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Honestly, I watched this interview and she points out how hers was a political tweet and there was nothing racist in that joke because she thought Jarrett was white (she does look like a white person to me, Iranians are white).

ABC Disagrees.

By the way, I grew up watching Roseanne as a child. It's one of my favourite shows to this day and I was terribly upset when she was fired from the show for selfish reason - because I love it.
But I understand why ABC fired her.

And by the way, she is a comedian so the First Amendment applies twice.

Yep, so the government can't infringe upon her right to speak freely. And they haven't.

 

[SkepticThinker]

The subject is freedom of speech.
For example, after listening to Obama's speech in Cairo, I am really speechless, wondering how there can be Americans who still believe he's a Christian.
That seemed the sheik of the sheiks's speech.

Sorry, what's that got to do with free speech?

 

[Estro Felino]

ABC Disagrees.

By the way, I grew up watching Roseanne as a child. It's one of my favourite shows to this day and I was terribly upset when she was fired from the show for selfish reason - because I love it.
But I understand why ABC fired her.


Yep, so the government can't infringe upon her right to speak freely. And they haven't.

Behind the scenes some Deep State probably did.
And that's exactly the same thing.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Honestly, I watched this interview and she points out how hers was a political tweet and there was nothing racist in that joke because she thought Jarrett was white (she does look like a white person to me, Iranians are white).

Suuuuuuure. She just happened to say she looked like an Islamic terrorist and an ape purely by accident.

For someone totally ready to believe ridiculous conspiracy theories at the drop of a hat, you sure are willing to trust people beyond all reason when you agree with them.

And by the way, she is a comedian so the First Amendment applies twice.

The first amendment wasn't compromised. There was no impingement on her speech.

 

[ImmortalFlame]

Behind the scenes some Deep State probably did.
And that's exactly the same thing.

When you have no evidence for anything, just invent a conspiracy.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Behind the scenes some Deep State probably did.
And that's exactly the same thing.

I've seen zero evidence backing up that claim.

 

[Estro Felino]

Suuuuuuure. She just happened to say she looked like an Islamic terrorist and an ape purely by accident.

For someone totally ready to believe ridiculous conspiracy theories at the drop of a hat, you sure are willing to trust people beyond all reason when you agree with them.


The first amendment wasn't compromised. There was no impingement on her speech.

I do respect your views, but
We speak two different languages, really.
We are the most outspoken country in the world. And the most politically incorrect country in Europe.
So we have a completely different vision of freedom of speech.

This is our PM
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/I7n8B_A4Q2o

 

[SomeRandom]

Honestly, I watched this interview and she points out how hers was a political tweet and there was nothing racist in that joke because she thought Jarrett was white (she does look like a white person to me, Iranians are white).

And by the way, she is a comedian so the First Amendment applies twice.

Pretty much all companies these days have clauses in their contracts for not bringing any ill repute onto said company. It’s not a violation of free speech to lose your job because the company you work for thinks your public comments damage their reputation.
Even supermarkets can fire or otherwise punish employees for public tweets, if they are directly linked to their company’s brand.
It usually falls under “code of conduct.”
You can say whatever you want that’s free speech, you’re not above consequences from said speech though. Be they financial or social or even both. That’s just life
Indeed Roseanne did just that. She chose to make those comments, as is her right to do so. But now instead of accepting the consequences of her actions she wants to cry about deep state conspiracies on right wing media? And here I thought the Republicans were supposedly the party of personal responsibility.
But I suppose actually acting upon one’s espoused values is too much to ask for these days

 

[Estro Felino]

Pretty much all companies these days have clauses in their contracts for not bringing any ill repute onto said company. It’s not a violation of free speech to lose your job because the company you work for thinks your public comments damage their reputation.
Even supermarkets can fire or otherwise punish employees for public tweets, if they are directly linked to their company’s brand.
It usually falls under “code of conduct.”
You can say whatever you want that’s free speech, you’re not above consequences from said speech though. Be they financial or social or even both. That’s just life
Indeed Roseanne did just that. She chose to make those comments, as is her right to do so. But now instead of accepting the consequences of her actions she wants to cry about deep state conspiracies on right wing media? And here I thought the Republicans were supposedly the party of personal responsibility.
But I suppose actually acting upon one’s espoused values is too much to ask for these days

In post #236 I posted a little video of something our PM said.
Does it fall within the freedom of speech, on Twitter?

 

[SomeRandom]

In post #236 I posted a little video of something our PM said.
Does it fall within the freedom of speech, on Twitter?

On todays dumpster that is Twitter? Probably lol
But Twitter has chased away a lot of advertisers since welcoming the free speech absolutists. At least that’s my understanding

 

[Stevicus]

I understand. But ABC can never figure out whether the majority of the people sides with Roseanne, despite her tweet, and after her tweet.
When you love a comedian or a show, you don't care about her political ideas, no matter how controversial they can be.

Well, as I said, I was never a fan of Roseanne Barr, so it was no loss for me either way. I recall seeing her on some Rodney Dangerfield specials a long time ago, but I wasn't really impressed then. I could never understand why or how she gained such a large following in the first place.

I think it had nothing to do with the audience. It had to do with certain political mechanisms...that make the Clintons, the Obamas and the Bidens untouchable.

I'm not so sure of that. It's not exactly unprecedented for media and other corporations to dismiss someone who might bring controversy or unfavorable opinion. I've seen things like this happen going back to even before Clinton or Obama or Biden became household names. A memorable example was the firing of Jimmy the Greek by CBS, who got caught on camera saying some things about blacks. This was back in January 1988, while Reagan was still President. (Jimmy Snyder (sports commentator) - Wikipedia)

CBS did get some flak over that. While Jimmy the Greek had a sizable fanbase, most people ultimately respected that it was CBS' decision to make. Many didn't like what he said, but thought it wasn't bad enough to get fired over.

While I was looking for a link on Snyder, I found this other link which also has some background to the story: Jimmy the Greek fired, Jay-Z embraced for similar stuff (nypost.com):


Naturally, the piece spends more than a few minutes on the events of January 1988, starting with the beginning of Snyder’s end, when a local TV crew found him in D.C.’s renowned restaurant/hangout, Duke Zeibert’s, and asked questions that Snyder was ill-suited to answer.

To know The Greek — and I knew him well — was to know that a) he enjoyed attention, and b) he was incapable of delicate answers to any questions. And these questions, in conjunction with Martin Luther King Day, were about race, specifically why blacks are superior athletes.

Snyder provided a fractured lecture on U.S. history, genetics and the breeding of slaves, all roughly spoken. That’s how he spoke about horses, pastry and people. And although some answers sounded as if he admired African-American athletes and some sounded resentful, it all came out the same: Ugly. He sounded like a racist.

But what could anyone expect? For crying out loud, he was from river-town Steubenville, Ohio; he was a kid when his uncle shot and killed his immigrant mother. Who did CBS think was in its employ, Adlai Stevenson? His 12 years as a kibitzer/tout on CBS’s NFL pregame show were based on being a street guy with a big mouth and lots of opinions.

And so CBS fired him because he was a street guy with a big mouth and lots of opinions.

Abandoned as a pariah, The Greek’s career — TV, movies, commercial gigs — was over. He’d gone bust before, lots of times, but he wasn’t going to rally from a racist rap.

Demetrious Georgios Synodinos, born to wrong-side Steubenville, was buried there in 1996.


5-10 years earlier, he probably wouldn't have gotten fired, but something noticeably changed during the 1980s, at least as far as standards and what would be considered acceptable and unacceptable in the eyes of the powers that be. I've also noticed this in discussions about movies made before 1985, among people who were born after 1980 or '85. Movies like Sixteen Candles or Revenge of the Nerds - people take a completely different perspective on it when viewed through "woke" eyes.

But whatever the process is (and regardless of what anyone calls it, "woke," "politically correct," etc.), I seriously doubt it has anything to do with the Clintons or Obamas or Bidens.

PS: Thank you so much for that insightful English translation. Sorry...I frequently use that idiom IRL...so I had to...

It's an interesting idiom, although a lot of times they don't translate too well.