Question for people that believe in evolution

[Kerr]

LOL no I get the point, but perhaps not the point which you perceive.

I made the point, if you miss what I mean you miss the point .

 

[Tristesse]

Personal experience can be valid evidence, in many cases as in the previous examples pertaining to fear, it can be measured and investigated via scientific method. And do you know what, it is, has been and continues to be.

A perception can be a personal view, that only one or a few perceive, else it can be global view which everybody perceives and every possible configuration in-between.

It's only valid for the person experiencing it, but it depends on what you mean by personal experience. If you mean something that someone is interpreting as "god" or some supernatural force than like I said it's only valid for that person having the experience, since those types of experiences are untestable. But if you mean something mundane that doesn't claim the supernatural than sure.

 

[footprints]

I realize I was getting off topic, but your bold assertions were getting to me. The above paragraph failed to show any hypocrisy, you just simply stated that he was hypocritical without offering any justification for it, so, thats why I asked.

Tistesse, I used Dawkins to prove a point. I will not directly say anything else without Dawkins being present to defend himself. However I will use those present who can defend themselves and their actions.

 

[Tristesse]

Tistesse, I used Dawkins to prove a point. I will not directly say anything else without Dawkins being present to defend himself. However I will use those present who can defend themselves and their actions.

And what point would that be? I understand that you don't want to say anything further without him being here, but why than would you call him a hypocrite and a bigot without backing it up with evidence. That to me seems even worse than just bold assertions about him.

 

[footprints]

It's only valid for the person experiencing it, but it depends on what you mean by personal experience. If you mean something that someone is interpreting as "god" or some supernatural force than like I said it's only valid for that person having the experience, since those types of experiences are untestable. But if you mean something mundane that doesn't claim the supernatural than sure.

Most things suggested as supernatural can be tested and the end resultant generally is, it is explainable in a rational, logical and natural way.

Even a person who says they are experiencing God, can be tested. Evidence to date suggests they are experiencing something, brain wave patterns change, dopamine and adrenalin levels change, increased activity in neurotransmitter activity is noted and Delta frequecies rise. What they are experiencing is yet to be determined, albeit many suggestions are mooted, some in the negative direction and some in the positive.

 

[Tristesse]

Most things suggested as supernatural can be tested and the end resultant generally is, it is explainable in a rational, logical and natural way.

Even a person who says they are experiencing God, can be tested. Evidence to date suggests they are experiencing something, brain wave patterns change, dopamine and adrenalin levels change, increased activity in neurotransmitter activity is noted and Delta frequecies rise. What they are experiencing is yet to be determined, albeit many suggestions are mooted, some in the negative direction and some in the positive.

How would you go about testing the supernatural? because as far as I am aware science only operates on the natural. And I'm not doubting the fact that their experiencing something, but to say that their brain waves are changing etc... and that means that it's something supernatural is ridiculous. How would you get that conclusion?

 

[footprints]

And what point would that be? I understand that you don't want to say anything further without him being here, but why than would you call him a hypocrite and a bigot without backing it up with evidence. That to me seems even worse than just bold assertions about him.

I did back it up Tristesse, I just didn't use Dawkins to show it. Everybody is a bigot and hypocrite in one way shape or form, it is part of human nature and tied to human intelligence.

 

[Tristesse]

I did back it up Tristesse, I just didn't use Dawkins to show it. Everybody is a bigot and hypocrite in one way shape or form, it is part of human nature and tied to human intelligence.

Ok, but I was asking what about him makes him a hypocrite, I'm sure we all are in one way or another, but you were saying it in a direct manner, which suggested that you knew what made him hypocritical.

 

[footprints]

How would you go about testing the supernatural? because as far as I am aware science only operates on the natural. And I'm not doubting the fact that their experiencing something, but to say that their brain waves are changing etc... and that means that it's something supernatural is ridiculous. How would you get that conclusion?

Hmmm so do you believe the supernatural exists then?

Yes Tristesse, it does say it is something natural and not something supernatural. To many people God per se, is a very natural thing. I do hope you understand and realise that Supernatural is just a power of suggestion which some people keep as Gospel.

 

[footprints]

Ok, but I was asking what about him makes him a hypocrite, I'm sure we all are in one way or another, but you were saying it in a direct manner, which suggested that you knew what made him hypocritical.

Just like you Tristesse, I can only go on the evidence before me. When reading the God Delusion, the evidence was right in front of me.

 

[Tristesse]

Hmmm so do you believe the supernatural exists then?

Yes Tristesse, it does say it is something natural and not something supernatural. To many people God per se, is a very natural thing. I do hope you understand and realise that Supernatural is just a power of suggestion which some people keep as Gospel.

No I don't, whcih can seem like a catch-22 because I don't believe it exists, because there isn't any evidence for it, but at the same time if it does exist it doesn't manifest in the natural world.

 

[footprints]

How would you go about testing the supernatural? because as far as I am aware science only operates on the natural. And I'm not doubting the fact that their experiencing something, but to say that their brain waves are changing etc... and that means that it's something supernatural is ridiculous. How would you get that conclusion?

As I do not know of anything which is supernatural, could you please give me an example of something which you conclude is supernatural, then I may be able to show you ways of testing it.

 

[footprints]

No I don't, whcih can seem like a catch-22 because I don't believe it exists, because there isn't any evidence for it, but at the same time if it does exist it doesn't manifest in the natural world.

Tristesse, even something which doesn't manifest in the natural world, if it does exist, still wouldn't be supernatural, just something science hasn't been able to explain the natural causes of yet. A deity if they exist, would be able to be explained by natural reasoning. If something exists, it is real and therefore explainable when we have the knowledge to understand it.

 

[Tristesse]

As I do not know of anything which is supernatural, could you please give me an example of something which you conclude is supernatural, then I may be able to show you ways of testing it.

I don't know of anything thats supernatural, seeing as how I don't believe in the supernatural. I just know the claims that are made, with no evidence to back the claims up, they are just basically bold assertions about the supernatural. Things like ghosts, visions of god, and things like that.

 

[Tristesse]

Tristesse, even something which doesn't manifest in the natural world, if it does exist, still wouldn't be supernatural, just something science hasn't been able to explain the natural causes of yet. A deity if they exist, would be able to be explained by natural reasoning. If something exists, it is real and therefore explainable when we have the knowledge to understand it.

I realize that, I was just making reference to the supernatural nothing else, I was saying that if the supernatural exists than it would not manifest in the natural world.

 

[footprints]

I realize that, I was just making reference to the supernatural nothing else, I was saying that if the supernatural exists than it would not manifest in the natural world.

Look I will not debate this point any more, you keep making reference to the supernatural existing. If that is your belief, if you see probability for it, then I do not want to take this belief away from you. Personally I do not subscribe to any supernatural causes, that is my belief. So from my perspective we will agree to disagree on this point.

 

[Tristesse]

Look I will not debate this point any more, you keep making reference to the supernatural existing. If that is your belief, if you see probability for it, then I do not want to take this belief away from you. Personally I do not subscribe to any supernatural causes, that is my belief. So from my perspective we will agree to disagree on this point.

wait, what? I've told you numerous times I don't believe the supernatural exists. I thought you did. I guess we somewhat agree, because I do not believe the supernatural exists, and I'm not sure how you got the idea that I did, but I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression.

 

[Storm]

Tristesse, it's a troll. Don't expect it to be coherent.

 

[footprints]

wait, what? I've told you numerous times I don't believe the supernatural exists. I thought you did. I guess we somewhat agree, because I do not believe the supernatural exists, and I'm not sure how you got the idea that I did, but I'm sorry if you got the wrong impression.

Human perception is a powerful thing, it can distort observations all over the place, even among masses. However, be warned human perception can look so real to us, even where science is concerned.

 

[footprints]

Tristesse, it's a troll. Don't expect it to be coherent.

Nice bit of trolling there storm.