Questions for my Gnostic Friends!

[Halcyon]

Currently, I'm reading the

The Book of Mormon - 2nd Nephi
The Bible - Old Testament - Genesis
Nag Hammadi Library - Apochryphon of John

I have a lot on my plate.

Thats just weird, i'm at the same points as you in both BoM and Bible.
But it does take me months to read even a novel, let alone a scripture which you need to concentrate on, so you'll probably be finished by the time i'm onto Exodus

Anywho. So a question about what you said here. So what sort of things keep you from the 'truth' and what is this 'truth'.

Ignorance, ususally self created ignorance is what keeps us blind to the truth. But also by our very nature we are blind, we're 'designed' that way in order to function in this world.

What is the truth? Well, we don't know. We won't know until we acquire Gnosis, and even then we won't be able to explain it to you - unfortunately that is the nature of Gnosis. Up until then we have our myths and teachings which are little more than theories created to (hopefully) aid us in getting Gnosis.

Could it be any religious teachings that are good or is it only Gnostic?

We believe all religious teachings are of some merit and are worth studying.
Its when those teachings, or our interpretation of them, lead us into blind faith that problems arise.
I believe we must always question anything we are told, even if it is God who is supposedly speaking. We must always ask, does this make sense?
When we find something that doesn't make sense or is contradicted by evidence we must re-evaluate the validity and so the worth of that teaching. Thats the attitude i take to every bit of scripture i read, both Gnostic and others.

 

[Revasser]

Oh, what an interesting thread! Hello, my gnostic friends! I thought I'd come check out your sub-forum here.

The spirit is immortal and is essentially a little bit of God, unchanging and unchangable. The soul is the personality, it is linked to the body more directly and changes over time, it might also be destroyed at death along with the body.

This concept feels very familiar to me. It's not all that dissimiliar for the Kemetic concept of ka and ba. Would you agree, Halcyon?

 

[gnostic]

Its when those teachings, or our interpretation of them, lead us into blind faith that problems arise.
I believe we must always question anything we are told, even if it is God who is supposedly speaking.

I couldn't agree with you more. I would prefer people to question more than just accept everything written at their face value.

The comparison of the Apocryphon of John and Genesis (and that of all other versions, including that of Qur'an) leave a lot of questions to be asked.

 

[Karl R]

What does the voice that John hears saying, "I an the one who is [with you (pl)] always. I [am the Father], I am the Mother, I am the Son" ? Why isn't daughter included in this, or is it just my book?

I've just been reading a book by Elaine Pagels, a scholar of the gnostic gospels.

According to Pagels, this is a version of the trinity. The holy spirit is interpreted as being female (hence the mother) instead of asexual. The greek word for spirit (pneuma) is neuter. The hebrew word for spirit (ruah) is feminine.

Also, what does Against Heresies by Ireabaes have to say about this (if you know)?

Pagels delves quite deeply into Irenaeus comments, but doesn't draw direct connections from the gnostic passages to Irenaeus' responses.

Indirectly, Pagels claims that verses like these led gnostic circles to have a high degree of equality between men and women.

Pagels notes Irenaeus' dismay with how the gnostic teacher Marcus had attracted "many foolish women" from his own congregation

Irenaeus says, Marcus "addresses them in such seductive words" as his prayers to Grace, "She who is before all things," and to Wisdom and Silence, the feminine element of the divine being.

Bishop Irenaeus seemed indignant that Marcus encouraged women to prophesy and help serve & consecrate the eucharist.

 

[Halcyon]

Oh, what an interesting thread! Hello, my gnostic friends! I thought I'd come check out your sub-forum here.

This concept feels very familiar to me. It's not all that dissimiliar for the Kemetic concept of ka and ba. Would you agree, Halcyon?

Yeah kind of, although its been a while since i read up on kemetic concepts. Isn't Ba the mortal soul and Ka the immortal spirit self? I forget.
Also, i remember there being 7 parts to the human being in kemetic beliefs, or am i just imagining that?

 

[Revasser]

Yeah kind of, although its been a while since i read up on kemetic concepts. Isn't Ba the mortal soul and Ka the immortal spirit self? I forget.
Also, i remember there being 7 parts to the human being in kemetic beliefs, or am i just imagining that?

Switch 'em around and you're right. Ka is the mortal spirit tied directly to the body, Ba is the immortal. The way I usually hear it described is something like: Ka is your "this life" soul, Ba is your "all life" soul. Those are the two most often thought of and talked about, the "main" bits, if you will. You are correct, however, there are thought to seven distinct parts, not including the khat, or physical body.

Despite that, I find the similarity of the two "main" parts intriguing!

 

[Halcyon]

Switch 'em around and you're right. Ka is the mortal spirit tied directly to the body, Ba is the immortal. The way I usually hear it described is something like: Ka is your "this life" soul, Ba is your "all life" soul. Those are the two most often thought of and talked about, the "main" bits, if you will. You are correct, however, there are thought to seven distinct parts, not including the khat, or physical body.

Despite that, I find the similarity of the two "main" parts intriguing!

Yes they are very similar. Gnosticism was popular everywhere in ancient times, including Egypt. Perhaps ancient kemetic beliefs filtered their way into Gnostic texts, who can say?

 

[Revasser]

Yes they are very similar. Gnosticism was popular everywhere in ancient times, including Egypt. Perhaps ancient kemetic beliefs filtered their way into Gnostic texts, who can say?

Indeed! It may simply have been an idea whose time had come at that point and a few groups maintained it.

And since this is a question thread, I have a question about the demiurge (is that title that should be capitalised?)Namely, where did it come from and does it have a purpose or is it an accident of some kind?

 

[Halcyon]

The Demiurge (which means creator or craftsman) is the son of Sophia. He is ignorance born of wisdom, accidently when Sophia was trying to comprehend the One God.

He's the creator of this world, the God of the OT, he is ignorant believing that he is the one and only God, remember he says there are no other Gods before him in the bible. His ignorance of his origin and of the true God are passed onto us since he created us. But the divine spark or spirit inside of us (which is inside of the demiurge as well) comes directly from the One God (via Sophia) and has the power to free us from ignorance. Or so the story goes...

 

[Revasser]

The Demiurge (which means creator or craftsman) is the son of Sophia. He is ignorance born of wisdom, accidently when Sophia was trying to comprehend the One God.

He's the creator of this world, the God of the OT, he is ignorant believing that he is the one and only God, remember he says there are no other Gods before him in the bible. His ignorance of his origin and of the true God are passed onto us since he created us. But the divine spark or spirit inside of us (which is inside of the demiurge as well) comes directly from the One God (via Sophia) and has the power to free us from ignorance. Or so the story goes...

Oh, interesting!

From what I know of Gnosticism, I presume the story would be considered largely a conceit to help humans on the path to understanding. Is that right or am I making stuff up? :areyoucra

 

[Buttons*]

Oh, interesting!

From what I know of Gnosticism, I presume the story would be considered largely a conceit to help humans on the path to understanding. Is that right or am I making stuff up? :areyoucra

.... could be

 

[Godfather89]

In my search to understand Gnosticism, I will share you this excerpt I wrote on Wikipedia when discussing Comparative Religion:

It should be noted that there are two kinds of religions:

The first kind is a Society Model Religion which assumes that everything that happens on earth happens in said divine, otherworldly or invisible realm, therefore, God is maker and father of all. God rewards and punishes through messengers and various judgments handed down by laws. God loves and hates certain people in his creation, he is depicted as a human being. This is founded in human social interactions. According to the social model, God is Lord and as lord wants praise and worship. What matters is the interpersonal relationships among those he has created, both with each other and with the creator. These ideas are the basis of the western religions such as Christianity, Judaism and Islam. Because of adherence to a dogmatic style of thinking, adherents of society model religions often assume their scriptures are based on a historical point in time when in fact, like many religions and sects before them, the scriptures used myth and allegory within the narrative.

The second kind of religion is a Mind Model religion which assumes that the universe, whole reality and divine are thought to be like a mind, mental terms are formed in metaphor. In this model, the nature of reality can only be known through introspection and unlike the society model of religious adherence, salvation does not come from proper behavior, obedience and submission to the word of law. Rather, salvation comes from knowledge (e.g. Gnosis or Enlightenment), insight and meditation. It should be noted however that through meditation and insight self-discipline can be achieved. Mind Model religions are common in the eastern world religions such as Hinduism, Buddhism and Taoism, and in esoteric western traditions such as Kabbalah and Gnosticism. There writings include myths and allegories; however they also have transformative properties that affect the reader who understands what is written.

It is dangerous to try and interpret a mind model religion into a society model religion as it will lead to misunderstanding. A great example would be the dispute between Gnosticism and Christianity where people believe that Gnosticism is an off-shoot of Christianity, when in fact it came before Christianity and was founded by a sect of Hellenize Jews who started this tradition, therefore much misunderstanding has erupted over the nature and roots of Gnosticism.

Knowing that Gnosticism is about the mind, its about you... You are all the aspects and characters being discussed in Gnostic texts and in them it discusses how you can achieve wholeness with your positive and negative aspects. The demiurge, Sophia, Christos, The Pleroma and The World of Forms.

Gnosticism answers some of the existential questions thats exist in the world today and how to address and answer those questions. I am only beginning to learn but I get little clicks in my mind once and while, these clicks go beyond words but understanding within... Understanding myself... But in order to understand something you need to know it first this is Gnosis.

For example I know the sky is blue but why is the sky blue? The understanding comes when someone tells you the sky is blue because... The Sunlight, The Gases in the atmosphere... etc. In the words of Socrates "The unexamined Life is not worth living."