There are plenty of passages that explicitly prescribe killing. I gave you some references. If ISIS uses those passages to justify killing, you can't claim that they don't prescribe killing, you can only claim that you don't agree with the way ISIS are implementing those prescriptions
Yes, I agree ISIS uses those verses to kill people
No, the verses don't say what ISIS think it says, or ISIS bent it to make seem says what it doesn't say to fulfill their agenda
I understand that you dislike ISIS (as every rational person does), but you can't claim that their actions have nothing to do with Islam, or that their leaders know nothing about Islam. Both claims are demonstrably untrue
I still claim that their action has nothing to do with Islam. For example, in Islam, you can't go around and kill innocent people, but ISIS does
Exactly.
There is a verse that explicitly states that anyone who insults Muhammad will receive a painful punishment. That is all it says.
You claim that the punishment can only come from god in the afterlife. Others claim that the punishment can be imposed by men in this world.
Neither of you has anything to prove your claim. It is just opinion.
However, if there are examples elsewhere in the Quran of punishments against transgressors being imposed by men, then a precedent has been set that supports the claim that men can impose punishment on those who transgress Allah's laws
Ok, we are moving in circles here
There is no command, that means there is no action to be done
But, if that floats your boat, so be it
1. It is not "unclear". The verse is explicit and unequivocal. Those who insult Muhammad will be painfully punished.
2. Verse 3:7 does not say to ignore any verse that is not clear. It says that those with perverse hearts will interpret unclear verses to suit their own agenda. And as no one can know the true meaning, no one can say if any interpretation is wrong.
3. It says that those of true belief will accept everything in the Quran.
4. It says "people of understanding" will grasp the message.
So we can see that 3:7 both vague itself, and contradictory. It also raises the question of why Allah would deliberately insert verses that he knows will be misinterpreted by people to work against Islam.
Oh, boy
The verse says ".......As for those in whose hearts is deviation [from truth], they will follow that of it which is unspecific......"
Since ISIS follows something that is not clear, and not specified, that means their heart is deviated, which makes them not following the rules of Islam
As I never made that claim, why are you still chasing that straw man?
However in his tafsir, Ibn Abbas said "(for them there is a painful doom) in the life of this world and in the Hereafter."
So you have your scholarly reference
I was not chasing that, I was just telling how the debate went so far.
Still, Ibn Abbas didn't say it is a command to Muslims, God can punish in this world, or hereafter
You asked me for verses in the Quran that had commands to harm other, because you claimed that there were no such verses.
I think we are talking about two different things here
For example, Capital punishment
There is a verse that says if you kill, you get killed. Do you consider this as a verse of harming others?
What I am saying here is, yes, there are verses about killing and punishments, but, it is the same as the constitution of countries, there are rules of punishment if someone commits a crime.
I think you are making it the Quran says to kill others because they are not Muslims. That doesn't exist in Islam.
And the only evidence you have is members of ISIS LOL
2:10 is talking about those who spread mischief (specifically mentioned in the next verse).
Wrong. read again "In their hearts is disease, so Allah has increased their disease; and for them is a
painful punishment because they [habitually] used to lie"
5:33 clearly states that a punishment for those spreading mischief is to be killed. So that example confirms that "painful punishment" is to be dome in this world. Thanks.
Some of those specifically mention the punishment being in the afterlife, so they are not relevant.
This is a bunch of misleading statements by you here.
5:33
Indeed, the penalty for those who
1. wage war against Allah and His Messenger and
2. strive upon earth [to cause] corruption is none but that they be
A. killed or
B. crucified or that their
C. hands and feet be cut off from opposite sides or that they
D. be exiled from the land. That is for them a disgrace in this world; and for them in the Hereafter is a great punishment,
That is the verse above.
It is not like you simplified it above
The verse is saying, In a Muslim state, where Islamic law is implemented, anyone who wages war against the president (Muhammed)
AND spreads corruption (killing, stealing, damaging properties,.....etc.)
conditions 1 and 2 must be present
punishments vary as a ruler sees fit
HOWEVER, you didn't answer my question
What is the punishment in your country for a person who wages war against the president and against the government?
However, it is interesting that you happily acknowledge that there are so many passages where Allah promises painful punishment for those who do not submit to Islam. But I bet you'll also claim that there is "no compulsion in religion"
You are missing the point LOL
See the verses I provided including 9:61 and compare it with verse 5:33
In all those verses it says "Painful punishment"
verse 5:33 clearly states the punishment to be carried by people
Can't you see the difference? it is simple