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Racial Integration in the US: Is it an ever-receding dream....

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
There's a trend for worse. All kinds of loud bigots speaking and escalating public debates on race tends to do that to society.
Hard to know whether people are becoming more racist or not, but I certainly agree that the current environment is certainly enabling and encouraging people who were already so inclined to begin with. Whereas once social pressure was sufficient to keep their mouths shut, they now feel safer to say what they think.

Not even going to speculate about the long term trends, but let's try to stay positive.
 

CruzNichaphor

Active Member
Hard to know whether people are becoming more racist or not,

LOL

No it's not.




but I certainly agree that the current environment is certainly enabling and encouraging people who were already so inclined to begin with. Whereas once social pressure was sufficient to keep their mouths shut, they now feel safer to say what they think.

Uh oh... this one takes the cake...

Next thing people might actually say what they really think and feel comfortable doing so.

What a horribly dangerous idea.

 
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Audie

Veteran Member
That's actually not true as study after study confirms that direct day-to-day contact with differing peoples tends to decrease prejudice.

"Prejudice" means to "pre-judge" and, therefore, is an act of ignorance.
True; but it also leads to post-judice, finding out things you dont like.
 

Audie

Veteran Member
LOL

No it's not.

Your post is spoken like a true racist, loudmouth, race-baiter.





Uh oh... this one takes the cake...

Next thing people might actually say what they really think and feel comfortable doing so.

What a horribly dangerous idea.


I think you are being totally unfair.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
A racist president in office, for one. Or the banning of ethnic study books in Arizona public schools, and Texas allegedly actually re-writing black and chicano history to sanitize them? The murders of young black men by the police?

How is the President a racist? BTW, even if all you said had any validity in racial inequality I would have to roll my eyes a little having lived through the Jim Crow era and race riots of the 50's and 60's. Evidently racism is relative.
 

Lyndon

"Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
Premium Member
the president is blaming Mexican immigrants for the problems the same way Hitler was blaming the Jews, that's racism, unless you're going to try and say Hitler wasn't a racist, which I would not be surprised to hear on this forum!!
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Many of what are now of the 'poor white' class used to be a step or two above the economic/race class of those they considered below them. They had nothing to worry about in terms of competition. But due to primarily economic changes and perhaps demographics, they now find themselves on the same level or lower, and they resent it. During the upheaval of the 70's and 80's you mentioned, came much fear and insecurity. All of these factors led to a polarization of attitudes, and Trump represents, in part, a figure who can make sure America remains racist, while protecting those who feel threatened by people of color who have become more and more vocal about social injustice. When the 80's came, came the recession, and that's when the issue of the undocumented worker really heated up. They were seen as a threat to the white American pocketbook, and something must be done. Up until then, Mexican labor freely came across the border to serve our needs while we mostly looked the other way. Today, we have literally become hysterical about them. Even Blacks have picketed against them as a threat to 'their' security, which never was a problem in the past.

Some of it may have been related to economics as well as geopolitics. During the 60s, America was at a kind of economic peak, and many Americans were doing well overall. But Americans were also watching of the tumult on TV. While many felt safe from what was happening in Vietnam or the violence in the South or in the inner cities, they didn't like what was being done in their name and spoke out against it. Americans may have seen themselves as an invulnerable giant, yet still a bully that needed to be reined in. That's what the anti-war protests were about, as well as opposition to racism and other abuses of power within America.

But by the 70s, with the Arab oil embargo hitting us hard, and later on, with the Iranian hostage crisis - Americans started seeing themselves as more vulnerable and impotent in solving the problems we faced. Reagan and his ilk stepped up the Red Scare rhetoric and tried to make it appear that America was in serious danger - which led to Americans supporting more defense spending and stronger internal measures against crime (more police, more prisons, an escalated war on drugs, reduction in civil liberties, etc.).

In other words, it's easier to restrain ourselves when we feel like an invulnerable bully who can't be touched. But if we feel vulnerable and in peril, then we might be a bit more on guard and paranoid against outsiders.

One thing that should also be noted is that, in 1970, America had the lowest percentage of foreign-born population at any time in the 20th century (https://www.census.gov/newsroom/pdf/cspan_fb_slides.pdf). Relations were slowly improving between blacks and whites, while immigrants were still a much smaller percentage of the population. Other ethnic groups had pretty much assimilated, but as a new wave of immigration hit, Americans started seeing an increased number of different language and cultural groups.

That may be where some of the pushback started. People who were generally okay with it in smaller doses may have felt overwhelmed, as if it was too much all at once.


Unfortunately, many coming across the border are now mules for the drug cartels, and so we have an exacerbated problem, which overshadows the issue of the need for viable work program for these laborers from the south. And so we pay rapt attention to the issue of the undocumented worker, rather than getting down to work on a creative plan to hire these much needed laborers.

A good deal of the demand for drugs comes from the US, which drives cartel activity along the border.

BTW, it was due to NAFTA that American corn growers dumped tons of cheap American corn onto the Mexican market, thereby putting scores of Mexican corn growers out of business, and driving their some 2 million now unemployed workers north to the US looking for work.

NAFTA was definitely problematic. It was fast-tracked and foisted on the people when they didn't even ask for it. It was also a complication that the elite were pushing for NAFTA at the same time they were pushing this war on drugs on the people. They would have been better off resolving the war on drugs one way or the other before passing NAFTA. You can't very well push for free trade and be anti-free trade at the same time.

Prior to the 70s and 80s, the actual percentage of undocumented workers was relatively low compared to later decades. I don't recall if there was any serious or severe need for labor during that time, although I think businesses were starting to react to the high cost of labor and the gains made by the labor movement in the post-WW2 era. It was clear that they were starting to look elsewhere for cheaper labor alternatives.
 

Shaul

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
the president is blaming Mexican immigrants for the problems the same way Hitler was blaming the Jews, that's racism, unless you're going to try and say Hitler wasn't a racist, which I would not be surprised to hear on this forum!!
Ding, ding, ding, ding, and we have our Hitler mention. I declare this thread has officially gone to seed and this comment beyond the pale.
 

Lyndon

"Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
Premium Member
not unlike the racism of Zionists against the Palestinians, racism comes in many forms. A lot of it has in Common with Hitler.
 

George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Really? Then why is Trump in power and has the support of over 94% of the Evangelicals? I mean, Hitler's Brown Shirts were a minority that cleverly exploited people's paranoia just as Trump exploited American's paranoia and hysteria. No, I am not equating the one to the other, but only the conditions that brought them to power.
Different times, different level of enlightenment and worldliness in the populace. Evangelicals are the dinosaurs and we have too many checks and balances for me to have even the slightest concern about them. Actually it is the overly left-wing and the so-called Social Justice Warrior (SJW) types that get me concerned about bullying their way around.
 

Lyndon

"Peace is the answer" quote: GOD, 2014
Premium Member
So your problem is specifically with the least racist group???
 

CruzNichaphor

Active Member
the president is blaming Mexican immigrants for the problems the same way Hitler was blaming the Jews, that's racism, unless you're going to try and say Hitler wasn't a racist, which I would not be surprised to hear on this forum!!

I've said "LOL" a lot on this forum but this genuinely made me laugh out loud.

That might be the most ridiculous thing I've ever heard on this forum.
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
Different times, different level of enlightenment and worldliness in the populace. Evangelicals are the dinosaurs and we have too many checks and balances for me to have even the slightest concern about them. Actually it is the overly left-wing and the so-called Social Justice Warrior (SJW) types that get me concerned about bullying their way around.

Well, now there is a new movement amongst Christians, the name of which escapes me at the moment, and one which you may know of, which says that Christians must get into power. It is an extension of the Manifest Destiny doctrine. You can poo poo Christian intent, but I take it very seriously, having been raised a Christian, Catholic to boot.

EDIT: Found it! They are called 'Dominionists', and Trump is their hero, and he is just like them in doctrine. See here, for one:

https://truthout.org/articles/chris...ngton-hotel-to-answer-the-divine-call-to-war/
 
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George-ananda

Advaita Vedanta, Theosophy, Spiritualism
Premium Member
Well, now there is a new movement amongst Christians, the name of which escapes me at the moment, and one which you may know of, which says that Christians must get into power. It is an extension of the Manifest Destiny doctrine. You can poo poo Christian intent, but I take it very seriously, having been raised a Christian, Catholic to boot.

EDIT: Found it! They are called 'Dominionists', and Trump is their hero, and he is just like them in doctrine. See here, for one:

https://truthout.org/articles/chris...ngton-hotel-to-answer-the-divine-call-to-war/
To be honest this doesn't concern me in the least. You can always find some people that support just about anything.
 

godnotgod

Thou art That
the president is blaming Mexican immigrants for the problems the same way Hitler was blaming the Jews, that's racism, unless you're going to try and say Hitler wasn't a racist, which I would not be surprised to hear on this forum!!

Lyndon, you're exactly right, but few will admit it. Hitler did two things: he blamed the Jews for the economic troubles of the German people, and then he dehumanized them as sub-human, ie 'untermenschen', IOW, 'genetically defective', as a device to justify their extermination.

Trump, and many Americans, have done exactly the same thing: blamed the Mexicans for economic issues, and dehumanized them publicly by calling them rapists and criminals. He hasn't taken the last step, which is to round them up and put them into gas chambers, but he is rounding them up and sending them back to Mexico, and in other instances, back to a death sentence.

No one is saying that Trump is Hitler. Just that the patterns and conditions which put them into power are similar, and to be regarded with alarm.
 
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