Racism, Christianity, U.S history, Christopher Columbus all rolled into one discussion

[tumbleweed41]

I am half Native American and I know who was in America first.

:clap

 

[Averroes]

I've got a question for the OP: One of the things I've noticed in my African studies is that in their task of deconstructing negative stereotypes of blacks, the African scholars are constantly trying to compare themselves to the other races as if they need to measure up to a certain standard. IMO the comparison game is the worst thing any person can do. Be who you are and F what everyone else thinks I say.

What do you mean compare? Explain....

The only thing I can think of is that African-Americans in comparison to let's say Mexicans don't know their true language since my ancestors were cut off from their respective tribes. In comparison to the Chinese, African-Americans don't know which country their ancestors came from (in Africa). In comparison to the Jews, African-Americans don't know the "true" religion of their ancestors. We have knowledge of the religions of the slaves but myself along with millions of others cannot trace back to the religion of my forefathers.

 

[Averroes]

I've got another question for the OP: Do you think that minorities in America can be manipulative through pulling the race card and accusing people of being racist?

I think anybody can be manipulative and pull the so-called race card Caucasians did that with affirmative action even those knowing that African Americans and other minorities didn't get the same chance and opportunities so sure.

 

[tumbleweed41]

The only thing I can think of is that African-Americans in comparison to let's say Mexicans don't know their true language since my ancestors were cut off from their respective tribes.

The majority of Mexicans are a mix of Spanish and Indigenous peoples. They have no knowledge of their "true" indigenous languages.
As for me, I can't speak any Swedish.

In comparison to the Chinese, African-Americans don't know which country their ancestors came from (in Africa).

Due to the method in which the majority of African-Americans were forced to migrate, I can see how this would be difficult.

In comparison to the Jews, African-Americans don't know the "true" religion of their ancestors.

Besides those of Jewish descent, who does know the "true" religion of their ancestors?

We have knowledge of the religions of the slaves but myself along with millions of others cannot trace back to the religion of my forefathers.

Again, who does know the "true" religion of their ancestors?
Is my "true" religion based on my ancestors Norse polytheism? Or the later Christian beliefs? Or even earlier primitive beliefs?
What exactly is a persons ancestral "true" religion? And should it influence what you believe today?

 

[-Peacemaker-]

First off miss me with that sly sarcastic remark of saying "whitey" since we are making assertions on the other please do not speak as if that is how I refer to Caucasians. Second, it is greatly possible that Africans even black Africans sailed to the new world before Columbus. Third, out of respect for me, don't refer to African-Americans as "you people" or in reference to my ethnic group say "my people" that is exactly my point jungle. Certain words or phrases of that caliber can be considered rude and having racist undertones.

I apologize if I've offended you. Nevertheless, Do minorites often use language like this to be manipulative and subject people to intimidation in a very subtle way? Is language like this often used to get a white man walking on egg shells and make him so afraid of offending a minority that he won't open his mouth? In this way is he able to then control him?

 

[Rakhel]

Averroes, have you ever read A People's History of the United States? My guess is that you have, but if you haven't, you need to pick up (or download ) a copy.

We have that book. It's in storage of course. but we have it

 

[-Peacemaker-]

As far as Greeks giving acknowledgment to the Egyptians please provide evidence. Inball my yeara studying Greek thought I've never read anything where the Greeks pay respect to Egyptians. I've read Greeks referencing Egyptian thought but paying respect.

My African Studies professor taught me that

 

[gnomon]

I have no idea what this thread is about.

 

[jamaesi]

Wow. As much as I have issues with Tim Wise, he might be a little more palatable for everyone in this thread. What kind of a card is race? (Article is under fundraising appeal)

 

[fallingblood]

I have no idea what this thread is about.

I think it is about taking a step back in progress. We aren't progressing fast enough, so to hell with it. At least that is somewhat of what I'm seeing in this thread now.

 

[fallingblood]

That maybe true but the shedding of these histories wont happen for a very very very long time

It's happening now.

Many colleges are requiring that one takes diversity classes, so they can see from other people's perspectives. High schools are slowly introducing new history to be taught and shedding a lot of the old stuff.

In a few generations, much of the old history will be shed, as the older teachers will also be gone and new ones will take their places. And these new teachers, for the most part, are being taught better history. The Eurocentric perspective is being acknowledged, and taken into consideration, so that it doesn't create such biases. History is being looked at more objectively.

 

[GabrielWithoutWings]

Second, it is greatly possible that Africans even black Africans sailed to the new world before Columbus.

This is the second time you've stated this. I've never heard of this at all. Do you have any references or sources for this?

 

[-Peacemaker-]

What do you mean compare? Explain....

The only thing I can think of is that African-Americans in comparison to let's say Mexicans don't know their true language since my ancestors were cut off from their respective tribes. In comparison to the Chinese, African-Americans don't know which country their ancestors came from (in Africa). In comparison to the Jews, African-Americans don't know the "true" religion of their ancestors. We have knowledge of the religions of the slaves but myself along with millions of others cannot trace back to the religion of my forefathers.

In the African Studies curriculum I saw a constant attempt to keep comparing African acheivements to those of other races in order to say "look we're as good as them, we can do anything they can do." The whole think just reeked of a superficial value system in which a human life's worth is determined by his accomplishments and not by the fact he's made in the image of God.

 

[Quagmire]

If they gave up on it why are we still celebrating it?

Because most people aren't scholars.

Why is Columbus Day a paid holiday?

You can thank my ancestors, the Italians, for that.

 

[Averroes]

It's happening now.

Many colleges are requiring that one takes diversity classes, so they can see from other people's perspectives. High schools are slowly introducing new history to be taught and shedding a lot of the old stuff.

In a few generations, much of the old history will be shed, as the older teachers will also be gone and new ones will take their places. And these new teachers, for the most part, are being taught better history. The Eurocentric perspective is being acknowledged, and taken into consideration, so that it doesn't create such biases. History is being looked at more objectively.

Um, when I went to college taking cultural pluralism classes is not required it was an option. You can't force students to take those subjects. For myself, since I double majored in Philosophy and Psychology, I not only took Cultural Pluralism, but also Africa and African diaspora as well. Of course those two courses were optional.

Colleges still have some segregation. Look at fraternities. For instance I am a member of Omega Psi Phi, which is largely considered a "black fraternity." We don't intentionally make it that way, its just that the culture and different students that gravitate to our fraternity.

Just as there are other fraternities that are predominantly white and Hispanic, or Asian.

And what about high schools?

Still segregated to a certain extent. Black kids gravitate to black kids, white kids with white, asians with asians and so on and so forth.

 

[Averroes]

This is the second time you've stated this. I've never heard of this at all. Do you have any references or sources for this?

Muslims in the Americas before Columbus

Critique of transatlantic interaction

Pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

More info

The Melungeons: Muslims in USA before Columbus After Spanish Inquisition | Islamabad Globe

Edit**** I meant trans-oceanic

 

[Averroes]

The majority of Mexicans are a mix of Spanish and Indigenous peoples. They have no knowledge of their "true" indigenous languages.
As for me, I can't speak any Swedish.

Due to the method in which the majority of African-Americans were forced to migrate, I can see how this would be difficult.

Besides those of Jewish descent, who does know the "true" religion of their ancestors?

Again, who does know the "true" religion of their ancestors?
Is my "true" religion based on my ancestors Norse polytheism? Or the later Christian beliefs? Or even earlier primitive beliefs?
What exactly is a persons ancestral "true" religion? And should it influence what you believe today?

Without going piece by piece let me comment on two key things: "Mexicans" and "true religion"

Mexicans at least know their lineage descends from the Mechican (MEH-SHEE-CAN) who of course either spoke a dialect of the aztecs.

If you have been to Mexico (like I have) you do have a large indigenous population especially in Mexico City that do not speak just spanish, they also speak a language of that of their ancestors.

Also, when referring to "true religion" I am referring to ancestral religion.

 

[Averroes]

I think it is about taking a step back in progress. We aren't progressing fast enough, so to hell with it. At least that is somewhat of what I'm seeing in this thread now.

Now if you are implying that the discussion of race, and racism is taking a step back in progression I would say that is an idiotic notion.

 

[GabrielWithoutWings]

Muslims in the Americas before Columbus

Critique of transatlantic interaction

Pre-Columbian trans-oceanic contact - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

More info

The Melungeons: Muslims in USA before Columbus After Spanish Inquisition | Islamabad Globe

Danke.

 

[Rakhel]

Mexicans at least know their lineage descends from the Mechican (MEH-SHEE-CAN) who of course either spoke a dialect of the aztecs.
.

Or?