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Rambling on Tumblr about Hinduism

DeviChaaya

Jai Ambe Gauri
Premium Member
Just thought I'd post this here as well - see what everyone has to say. I was asked a question by a lovely girl over on Tumblr and you can see my response below.

Hi. I think it's amazing that you do more than I do as someone who was born into Hinduism. Anyways I was reading your blog and came across something you'd said. "And yes, my spirituality IS better than Christianity and Islam." I think this is wrong. One of the most redeeming qualities of hinduism is that it doesn't seek to be the superior religion like most religions today. The best part is the minimal amount of of stress on convincing others to convert. Hinduism aims to be a way of life.
Thank you for the ask. Let me explain what I meant when I said my religion was better. Amongst people who do not know very much about our Dharma (it’s there’s as well) there is the mistaken belief that Hinduism accepts all religions as equal pathways to realisation. This belief was spread by such people as Paramhamsa Yoganada and Swami Vivekanda, both of whom taught rather extreme universalism. I am not a universalist. Universalism weakens our foundations and was a necessary step, I believe, in bringing Hinduism to the West but many Hindus and the majority of our texts do not support it. Yes, there are a few lines in the Vedas such as ‘truth is one, sages call it by many names’ but there are also many verses that refute that.

While I often do not agree with what he says, the founder of ISKCON A.C Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada, had a point when he said the only way to Godhead was by sincerely worshipping Krishna. He was a product of his times so there are many things that I disagree with that he said and he is the main reason I have never successfully read the Gita but a friend who was born into ISKCON recently explained some of it and helped restore my respect in the man.

The founder of Gaudiya Vaishnavism, Shri Chaitanya, taught something called one pointedness. Whereby it is foolish to go around worshipping all the Gods. Stick to just Krishna (or in my case, Devi Mata ji). Don’t let your mind wander from their lotus feet.

But back to why I believe Hinduism is better than most of the world religions. It is the oldest continuing tradition on Earth and while it is an umbrella term that encompasses a huge majority of different religions there are several things that connect them and allow them to stand under that wide umbrella. The belief in karma, samsara, rebirth and the Vedas are what links all these great traditions together. But beyond even that their ability to adapt after invasion after invasion and not only adapt but to THRIVE is something you don’t see in many traditions.

Both Christianity and Islam have been responsible for the deaths of hundreds, if not thousands, of local traditions and yet when they came to holy Bharat Mata they met something they just could not beat. First Islam tried foolishly to eradicate Dharma and couldn’t. Hindus of the north took on some traits of the Muslim invaders - their women started covering their heads and instead of the traditional sari they began wearing shalwar kameez, and the practise of isolating the Brahmin women, and I believe any high caste woman, from the prying eyes of men was implemented. The Hindus of the south did not adopt many of these traits simply because Islam failed to really spread that far. That is one of the huge differences between North and South temples actually. You enter a Northern temple and it doesn’t matter if you are male or female, you cover your head. You enter a Southern temple and cover your head and if it’s a small temple the priest is going to tell you off!

Christianity came later but I believe it’s effects were more insidious. There had for a long time been a small community of Christians living in India but when the British and Spanish arrived things changed. Those who were once content to go about their lives unmolested suddenly decided to join in the persecution. But the British and Spanish leaders wanted desperately to Christianise India and many Churches today still do. They use insidious tactics to convert people but one of the worst in the bad old days consisted of men running up to good Hindu men and women and smearing their lips with raw steak. These men and women, having now tasted sacred GoMata believed that they would never be accepted back by their families, friends and castes and so were forced to convert to Christianity. Not to speak of the Goan Inquisition.

Even today Christian priests, monks and laymen dress up as sadhus and pretend to be holy men in order to convert the Hindu masses.

There are a few isolated cases of extremists who go around ‘recovering’ lost souls to Hinduism and the way they do it is simply deplorable BUT these are isolated cases, unlike the systemic conversion attempts and constant violence of Muslims and Christians.

Did you know that most people today convert not because they believe in Allah or Christ but because they are offered significant monetary and other similar incentives?

Hinduism, no matter which branch of it you follow, doesn’t. Do. This. At all. It is the first missionary religion but it is not the first proselytising religion. I say missionary because countries like Cambodia, Vietnam and Indonesia all were once majority Hindu communities not because of forced conversion but because of the good acts of the Hindu traders and Kings that they interacted with!

And there are many passages in many varied texts within Hinduism that say it is the best way (again depending on your branch. The Shaiva texts will invariably say they’re the best and the Vaishnava the same, so too the Shakta texts) and in some cases them ONLY way to moksha. (As an aside I just tried to spell only as OMly!)

Hinduism is one of the only religions on the face of the planet today that has survived multiple Islamic conquests and the hard times of the British and Spanish occupations. But the British Christian front worked very hard back in the days of the British Raj to undermine the foundations of Hinduism and that is one of the reasons that today we find many people who believe ‘conversion’ (which probably isn’t the best word to use) is wrong. It wasn’t the Hindu schools of thought that taught that it was wrong it was British agents translating great works of Hindu thought and knowledge and twisting the words around.

Another did you know - it is believed in certain South Indian circles that if you cross the sea you lose your caste and thereby can not be Hindu. I don’t know when this became a common belief but who wants to bet that it was encouraged by the British?

But I agree with you, Hinduism IS a way of life. A way of life that can be adopted by people who did not have the chance to be born into a family knowledgable of the Truth. A way of life that is not restricted to only people born into it but that welcomes EVERYONE. You may have noticed I deleted the original post that caused the kerfuffle. I’m not going to apologise for it - we all have our slip ups - and neither am I going to stop being Hindu just because some ignorant people believe that the only people who can be Hindu are those born into the tradition. Not gonna stop wearing the clothes either. They help me feel, in some ways, closer to God.

Wow, that went on for a loooong time! Gonna go get dressed and ready to meet some friends. I’ll also be going to temple tomorrow as well! Might see if a friend wants to go to the ISKCON temple for the feast in the evening as well!
 

Wannabe Yogi

Well-Known Member
This belief was spread by such people as Paramhamsa Yoganada and Swami Vivekanda, both of whom taught rather extreme universalism.

Just to let you know Swami Vivekananda teachings are very misunderstood. Those who like to attack his Idea's rarely read him. I think this is due In main part to his extreme popularity (His Birthday is an national holiday in India, it is called National Youthday). I believe that this argument at least when it comes to him, is a straw man argument.

One of Swami's main teachings on the subject is that man moves not from false hood to truth, But Lower truth to Higher Truth. Sounds like modern Universalism to you ? There is a difference in faiths, in the Philosophy of Swami Vivekananda. Monism is the Highest. Also if you pay attention to what He says you will find at his very core Shakta beliefs.

A few years ago, in Hinduism today, ran an article (by a Hindu Fundamentalist) attacking Swami Vivekananda on this issue. They had a huge response(they said the biggest they ever got) and some of it was published in the next magazine. It showed that much of what was said is just untrue. Still, this just does not still seem to stop some of these people. Low regard for the truth I think.

Another did you know - it is believed in certain South Indian circles that if you cross the sea you lose your caste and thereby can not be Hindu. I don’t know when this became a common belief but who wants to bet that it was encouraged by the British?

This did not start from from the British it came from the smirit. In fact this charge leveled against Swami Vivekananda by north Indians during his lifetime.
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
A few years ago, in Hinduism today, ran an article (by a Hindu Fundamentalist) attacking Swami Vivekananda on this issue.

And it (this controversy) doesn't go away. In a much more recent issue (first quarter this year I think) to celebrate the centenary of his coming to America, they (Hinduism Today) did another long story looking at both sides. Love him or hate him, there is no denying he had an impact on Hinduism coming to the west.
 

Wannabe Yogi

Well-Known Member
Even today Christian priests, monks and laymen dress up as sadhus and pretend to be holy men in order to convert the Hindu masses.

There are a few isolated cases of extremists who go around ‘recovering’ lost souls to Hinduism and the way they do it is simply deplorable BUT these are isolated cases, unlike the systemic conversion attempts and constant violence of Muslims and Christians.

Among Hindu's some of the most successful folks to counter act the attempt to use unfair means to make converts are Swami Vivekananda followers. Just to give one example. In Assam in the 1980s there was a huge attempt to convert. The Christians started building schools to convert Hindu's to Christianity. The local Hindu community came to the order to complain. In stead of rioting or the use of violence like some Hindu groups use. (This order has no problems with Christians just unethical conversation tactics) They started to build schools in Assam. The local Hindu's started taking there kids out of the Christian Schools and putting them in the Ramakrishna schools.(There are huge numbers of these schools all over India. They have great reputations while having the highest standards in education) Some terrorists responded by even planting a bomb in one of the Orders temples in Assam. The explosion injured the head Swami. (I personal know this Swami He never talks about this. I learned about it in Hinduism today.) I have talked to 3 Hindu's here in the west (who now have no ties with the order) who stayed with in Hinduism because of the followers of Swami Vivekananda.
 

Wannabe Yogi

Well-Known Member
And it (this controversy) doesn't go away. In a much more recent issue (first quarter this year I think) to celebrate the centenary of his coming to America, they (Hinduism Today) did another long story looking at both sides. Love him or hate him, there is no denying he had an impact on Hinduism coming to the west.

Very True! He also stopped the hemorrhaging of educated Hindus converting to western ideas in India it self. He gave Indians pride in there own religion. He was also an unmatched debater. When he went to visit Harvard it is said that he could win a debate on any subject with the experts on that subject. An example of this, in physics he attacked the science of the day. A few years later Albert Einstein put the nails in the coffin of the old physics. Solving many of the problems that Swamji brought up to the scientists of his day. His life is extremely well documented by news papers and writings from the western intellectuals of his day.

In general I see this controversy as a very good thing. I started off being a big fan of Swami Vivekananda. Then I just had had huge problems with him for years. He was just not "Hindu" enough for my taste I use to tell people. Now I am back to being a huge fan. Because I learned that much of my problems were the misuse of his ideas that are tied to modern world views.

One of my favorite quotes about him is from a modern Islamic scholar Frithjof Schuon who said He doesn't know if Swami Vivekananda modernized Hinduism or Hinduised modernism. For me both statements seem to be true.
 
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Vinayaka

devotee
Premium Member
I'm still on the fence, as per the Hinduism Today article. I see the good, but also the trend to liberalising, although I don't really put the blame on him. I almost went to his 'House' in Thousand Island Park once though. It's a memorial museum sort of thing, from what I understand. Beautiful scenery too.
 

DeviChaaya

Jai Ambe Gauri
Premium Member
Thank you so much, Wannabe Yogi! This is why I posted this here. I have only heard the common straw man argument and so it is all I know. If you could recommend a few books by Swami Vivekananda I would be most pleased to read them.
 
I don't think the Spanish wielded a lot of power and influence over India. The Portuguese though... they've probably shaped much of Goan culture even to this day. Many of them have been Christian for generations because of Portuguese rule!
 

Wannabe Yogi

Well-Known Member
Thank you so much, Wannabe Yogi! This is why I posted this here. I have only heard the common straw man argument and so it is all I know. If you could recommend a few books by Swami Vivekananda I would be most pleased to read them.

Good place to start.

[youtube]Ebs-FZVmaeE[/youtube]
Swami Vivekananda - Life Story - YouTube

A short life story

http://www.belurmath.org/pdf_files/A_Short_Life_o_Sri_Swami_Vivekananda.pdf


His complete works. You can pick what parts you want to read.

Complete Works - Index - Volumes

If you want to read about his Guru the saint who lived in a Kali temple.

Sri Ramakrishna and Swami Vivekananda
 
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