Rape under Shariah

[Raymann]

I think what you are doing is illogical here.
You are trying to connect rape to the teachings of Islam, then where the teachings of different brands of Islam reject it you appear to be saying that we should listen to the teachings that accept it and not pay any attention to the ones that don't.

Ok, let me put it this way, I believe many laws in Islam allow rapists to go unpunished. These are religious laws straight from the Quran and Hadith.
Let me ask you a simple question:
If a Muslim woman is raped and as a knowledgeable Muslim this woman won't press any charges against the rapist in fear the Islamic law could end up killing her by stoning.
Don't you think something is wrong here?
She could be charged with adultery by admitting to having sex outside of marriage and not proving it was rape.
The rapist like any other Muslim will realize there is no punishment for rape in reality.
Do you understand my point?
Their own religion is teaching them there is no punishment for rape.
Do you know that to accuse a woman of adultery you need 4 witnesses who actually saw the sex taking place?
What kind of nonsense is that? Really?
In some cases, I don't know who to blame, Muslims or Islam?
I would say Islam has a lot to do with it.
You tell me where am I wrong.

 

[muhammad_isa]

She could be charged with adultery by admitting to having sex outside of marriage and not proving it was rape.
The rapist like any other Muslim will realize there is no punishment for rape in reality.

What .. in Sweden?

Do you know that to accuse a woman of adultery you need 4 witnesses who actually saw the sex taking place?

Now we are changing the subject to adultery, are we?

You tell me where am I wrong.

Do you really care?
You seem to have it all sewn up already.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

First, I agree the OT is horrible.
Second, I think the Quran is much harsher than you're recalling.

But the main point is this one I've copied. To me, you're guilty of soft bigotry here. You're implying that you know better than Muslims what they believe. Now, I *suspect* you're correct. But they are the ones making the bold claim that the Quran is perfect and timeless. Who are you to say "oh, the poor muzzie-wuzzies don't really men it" ?

It's a lot like Christianity. Some believe the Bible is entirely without error and a solid book of accurate history. Likewise, many Muslims view the Quran the same way.
But not all of them. I'm not saying I know better, I'm saying there are indeed some views espoused by both religions that are not actually based in their holy book. Many of them even violate the policies of it. There are many views, many perspectives, but most Muslims and Christians alike tend to opt to gravitate more towards the passages of peaceful coexistences with others. But not all of them, and some do indeed twist things, focus on the violence, and take the slightest offence as an act of hostility and aggression.

 

[icehorse]

It's a lot like Christianity. Some believe the Bible is entirely without error and a solid book of accurate history. Likewise, many Muslims view the Quran the same way.
But not all of them. I'm not saying I know better, I'm saying there are indeed some views espoused by both religions that are not actually based in their holy book. Many of them even violate the policies of it. There are many views, many perspectives, but most Muslims and Christians alike tend to opt to gravitate more towards the passages of peaceful coexistences with others. But not all of them, and some do indeed twist things, focus on the violence, and take the slightest offence as an act of hostility and aggression.

I'm no fan of Christianity. That said, the one difference I see is that Christians have openly split into so many denominations. One positive aspect of that is that it's clearer to the rest of us what members of a particular denomination believe.

Notice how hard it is for Muslims to do the same, take Shia and Sunni for example. Those two sects are high on the list of folks who might just nuke each other, sigh.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I'm no fan of Christianity. That said, the one difference I see is that Christians have openly split into so many denominations. One positive aspect of that is that it's clearer to the rest of us what members of a particular denomination believe.

Notice how hard it is for Muslims to do the same, take Shia and Sunni for example. Those two sects are high on the list of folks who might just nuke each other, sigh.

The vast majority of Muslims are Sunni (up to 90% of them), with a very far in second being Shia's. To call the maybe a few others at most that have existed non-mainstream is giving them a lot of credit.

 

[icehorse]

The vast majority of Muslims are Sunni (up to 90% of them), with a very far in second being Shia's. To call the maybe a few others at most that have existed non-mainstream is giving them a lot of credit.

Agreed. So we have the vast majority of Muslims as Sunni, with no other way to know what they really believe. Because I agree with you, their individual beliefs vary widely.

But all we have to go on is their scripture, sigh.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Agreed. So we have the vast majority of Muslims as Sunni, with no other way to know what they really believe. Because I agree with you, their individual beliefs vary widely.

But all we have to go on is their scripture, sigh.

Or you could meet some, get to know some, etc.

 

[icehorse]

Or you could meet some, get to know some, etc.

Meet 2 billion people?

Individual stories are useful, but not statistically useful.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

Meet 2 billion people?

Individual stories are useful, but not statistically useful.

The statistics have been reflected in the individuals I have met, both from here and abroad.

 

[icehorse]

The statistics have been reflected in the individuals I have met, both from here and abroad.

That's statistically possible, but not reliable

 

[stevecanuck]

All you do is foam at the mouth about Islam and post a bunch of Islamophobic drivel. Such as, thank you so very much for taking out of context things I said those such as yourself take out of context.

If you don't want your gratuitous defenses of Islam rebutted, then perhaps you should stay out of the deep end and try the kiddie pool. Responding with ad-homs is the equivalent of, "IS NOT!!!".

 

[stevecanuck]

It's called actually learning and not accepting bigoted, stupid bull****.

And the tantrum is complete.

 

[stevecanuck]

Maybe it would help to speak about how evil rape is in general, because as you probably know, there are rape taking place in all societies doneby non Muslim and Muslims alike.

It is not by religion they do it, it is by being wrong in their actions no matter if they are religious or not.

I think some people react to your way of often single out Muslims as your "targets"

Religion is indeed involved if a certain holy book explicitly says that sex with captives and slaves is permissible.

 

[stevecanuck]

Or you could meet some, get to know some, etc.

Getting to know individual Muslims will only tell you about them as people. I lived in Egypt for seven years and I could give you a long list of Muslims who I would trust with my life. However, if you want to know about Islam you have to read the book that exists for the sole purpose of creating and defining it.

 

[stevecanuck]

Maybe it would help to speak about how evil rape is in general, because as you probably know, there are rape taking place in all societies doneby non Muslim and Muslims alike.

It is not by religion they do it, it is by being wrong in their actions no matter if they are religious or not.

I think some people react to your way of often single out Muslims as your "targets"

Just to pile on further, verse 2:223 says, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will". So, if a man's wife must quietly submit, what chance does a slave or captive have? You might want to find a Yazidi ex-sex-slave and ask her about it.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Religion is indeed involved if a certain holy book explicitly says that sex with captives and slaves is permissible.

It may say it, but just because it say you "may have it" does not mean "you must have it" Muslims are allowed to use the head you know.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Just to pile on further, verse 2:223 says, "Yusuf Ali: Your wives are as a tilth unto you; so approach your tilth when or how ye will". So, if a man's wife must quietly submit, what chance does a slave or captive have? You might want to find a Yazidi ex-sex-slave and ask her about it.

Again it does not say "you have to or should **** slaves or wife without they agree" a Muslim can say, I want to treat my wife good.

 

[stevecanuck]

It may say it, but just because it say you "may have it" does not mean "you must have it" Muslims are allowed to use the head you know.

Yes, you are 100% correct in that. The Qur'an says you MAY rape your slaves and captives - not you MUST rape your slaves and captives. That makes to SO much better.

 

[stevecanuck]

Again it does not say "you have to or should **** slaves or wife without they agree" a Muslim can say, I want to treat my wife good.

Again correct. A Muslim may indeed choose to treat his wife better than the Qur'an says he can. That you think this somehow amounts to a defense of Islam is mind-boggling. Isn't it obvious that it's the opposite?

 

[Spirit of Light]

Again correct. A Muslim may indeed choose to treat his wife better than the Qur'an says he can. That you think this somehow amounts to a defense of Islam is mind-boggling. Isn't it obvious that it's the opposite?

They also choose to never hurt anyone. A Muslim can actually be a good human being, just like yourself can choose to be good or chose to be an evil *******.

Are you saying a Muslim can't choose to be good? They have to do evil?