rapture QUESTIONS

[Muffled]

The rapture isn't that difficult to figure out. The rapture happens in Revelation 14.

One reason for the rapture could be to prevent, "friendly fire."

We know from scripture and by the Words of Jesus that...

The rapture will occur in the clouds of the sky.
That the angels would do the gathering.
It would occur at the sound of a trumpet.
According to Jesus it would occur at the end of tribulation.
And that the righteous dead are resurrected first.

Immediately after the tribulation of those days....And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven.... and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory......And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

God's 'elect' always refers to Christians in the New Testament. Proof of this is in the following scriptures....
Matthew 20:16, John 13:18, 15:16, Acts 15:22, 15:25, Romans 8:33, 16:13, 1 Corinthians 1:27-28, Ephesians 1:4, Colossians 3:12, James 2:5, 2 Timothy 2:10, Titus 1:1, 1 Peter 1:2, 2:9, 5:13, Revelation 17:14.

We know it will occur at the sound of a trumpet of God, SPECIFICALLY THE LAST and SEVENTH TRUMPET. (I Thess. 4:16; I Cor. 15:23; Rev. 11:15, Mt. 24:31).

The seventh trump sounds here....
Revelation 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

The seventh trumpet covers a great expanse of scripture going from Revelation 11:15 up the chapter 15.

We know that the angels do the gathering of Christians (Matt. 13:30, 39. Mathew 24:31.)

The rapture and the resurrection is a time of reaping and harvest.

Matthew 13:30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

Matthew 13:39 The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels.

Mark 4:28-29 For the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself; first the blade, then the ear, after that the full corn in the ear. But when the fruit is brought forth, immediately he putteth in the sickle, because the harvest is come.

The gathering will take place in the the clouds of the sky (Mt. 24:30; 1 Thess. 4:17).

Matthew 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord.

Before the rapture Christ first raises the righteous dead.
1 Thessalonians 4:16-18 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. Wherefore comfort one another with these words.

Pre-tribulationists would lead you to believe the gathering in Mathew 24:31 is anything but the rapture of the Church. Why? Because the text clearly shows the event to be "after" the tribulation."

Revelation 14:14......here is the resurrection of the dead and the gathering of the living righteous.

Jesus resurrects the dead. A sickle is an instrument of harvest.
14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.

15 And another angel came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe.

16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped.

Here is the rapture where the angels do the harvesting.

17 And another angel came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle.

18 And another angel came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him (an angel) that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe.

19 And the angel thrust in his sickle into the earth, and gathered the vine of the earth, and cast it into the great winepress of the wrath of God.
The great winepress is another topic all it's own.

I believe this is a first fruit rapture of the 144,000 jews.

I believe the concept of the tribulation as a single event is highly unlikely. I believe there will be many troubles before the Rapture and there is much that is troubling even in our time.

 

[InChrist]

Well, the Rapture is nowhere mentioned in the Bible, for starters...

Those who said that the Rapture is a belief that started in the 1800's are spot-on.

There is evidence that the doctrine of the rapture of the church was believed by Christians well before the 1900's.

"One of the most often cited objections to pretribulationism is that it is a new teaching in church history having only come on the scene in the 1830s. It is often argued that if the pre-trib rapture were biblical then it would have been taught earlier and throughout church history. In the last decade, individuals have found a number of pre-1830 references to a pre-trib rapture. Here is a summary of that evidence."

"I have heard from another scholar who is reading through many Latin manuscripts of previously unpublished documents that he has found a number of previously unknown pre-trib rapture statements from pre-nineteenth century Christendom. He is planning on publishing his material in a few years. What these pre-Darby rapture statements prove, if nothing else, is that indeed others did see the rapture taught in Scripture similar to the way that pretribulationists in our own day teach. Thus, the argument that no one ever taught pretribulationism until J. N. Darby in 1830 is just not historically true and it is becoming increasingly clear with each passing year. Maranatha!"

Pre-Trib Research Center -

 

[kaoticprofit]

I believe this is a first fruit rapture of the 144,000 jews.

I believe the concept of the tribulation as a single event is highly unlikely. I believe there will be many troubles before the Rapture and there is much that is troubling even in our time.

First of all even though they may be.....there's no proof these 144,000 of Chapter 14 are Jews anyway! Are they the same 144,000 of Revelation 7:4 or are they two different groups?

Revelation 14:1 *And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads.

If the 144,000 mentioned in Revelation 14:1 are part of the rapture, that doesn't mean that the others of "Gods Elect" don't go in the rapture of Revelation 14 too! You cannot prove that these 144,00 are the only ones being raptured here.

Christians ARE Gods Elect and verse 6 says....
Revelation 14:6 *And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people,