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Really can you eat meat?

Druidus

Druidus

Keeper of the Grove
<LI>Singer, Professor Peter
Southey, Robert ?? (1774-1843)
Spencer, Colin
Theroux, Paul ??
Thomas, Dilip, Writer, source: Amazon.com
<LI>Thoreau, Henry David (1817-1862)
Thiruvalluvar, poet patron saint of the State of Tamil Nadu India, source: His couplets the thirukural
Thomas, Rev.Dr. Donald (1953- )
<LI>Tolstoy, Leo Nikolayevich (1828-1910)
Tryon, Thomas (1634-1703)
Voltaire ?? (1694-1778)
Walker, Alice vegan Source: Her autobiographical text Everything We Love Can Be Saved
Wynne-Tyson, Jon
Zephaniah, Benjamin Poet source: Vegan Magazine, www.benjaminzephaniah.com
[font=helvetica,arial]Religious Leaders & Mystics[/font] :





 
Druidus

Druidus

Keeper of the Grove
Scientists, Physicians & Healthcare Professionals :
 
Druidus

Druidus

Keeper of the Grove
Even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath, so that a man hath no pre-eminence above a beast.

Ecclesiastes 3:19

The unnatural eating of flesh-meats is as polluting as the heathen worship of devils, with its sacrifices and its unpure feasts, through participation in which a man becomes a fellow-eater with devils.
Clementine Homilies (Second Century AD)

The saints are exceedingly loving and gentle to mankind, and even to brute beasts ... Surely we ought to show them [animals] great kindness and gentleness for many reasons, but, above all, because they are of the same origin as ourselves.
St.John Chrysostom (c.347-407)

It should not be believed that all beings exist for the sake of the existence of man. On the contrary, all the other beings too have been intended for their own sakes and not for the sake of anything else.
Rabbi Moses ben Maimon (1135-1204)

[Regarding animals and their offspring], there is no difference between the pain of humans and the pain of other living beings, since the love and tenderness of the mother for the young are not produced by reasoning, but by feeling, and this faculty exists not only in humans but in most living beings.
Rabbi Moses ben Maimon (1135-1204)

If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who deal likewise with their fellow men.
St.Francis of Assisi (1181-1226)

Not to hurt our humble brethren is our first duty to them, but to stop there is not enough. We have a higher mission - to be of service to them wherever they require it.
St.Francis of Assisi (1181-1226)

You, who are innocent, what have you done worthy of death! (On seeing animals being killed for food)
Richard of Wyche, Bishop of Chichester (1197-1253)

I am to ask your Lordships, in the name of that God who gave to man his dominion over the lower world, to acknowledge and recognise that dominion to be a moral trust.
Lord (Thomas) Erskine (1750-1823)
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A few quotes.
 
jewscout

jewscout

Religious Zionist
Druidus all of that was very enlightening, but i will say that i had no problem with your previous postings...or these for that matter. I respect your choice in diet, it was maike's post that got me. To equate eating meat with Black slavery or that those of us who choose to eat meat don't care about the starving or hungry in the world and vegetarians have some moral high ground is ridiculous.

But then that's just my humble opinion.
 
maike

maike

Member
jewscout said:
Hey get off your high horse man....let me give you some learning:
HITLER WAS A VEGETARIAN!
ooo you like that don't ya?
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WOW..........Your begging for a reply that would be taken down real quick there arn't you.
 
jewscout

jewscout

Religious Zionist
maike said:
WOW..........Your begging for a reply that would be taken down real quick there arn't you.
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Hey he was a vegetarian and was against hunting as well, was he not?
But Druidus has pointed out many vegetarians throughout history, thanks for the info Druidus!:jiggy: (i'm being sincere on that too Druidus:D )

Maike i still fail to see how you can equate eating a hamburger with Chattel Slavery or canabalism. Ok so you disagree with slaughter practices in many slaughterhouses, fine. Actually i don't like it much either, nor the way that animals aren't allowed to roam and are kept pinned up.
I just like eating meat, period.
I'd still like to see your source for this statement
A couple of hundred years ago American Christians had dominance over Negros kidnapped from africa, i bet in times of famine they were eaten too, guess the priests were ok with that then.
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And do you still believe that people who choose to eat meat care less about the starving than you?
 
H

huajiro

Well-Known Member
jewscout said:
Druidus all of that was very enlightening, but i will say that i had no problem with your previous postings...or these for that matter. I respect your choice in diet, it was maike's post that got me. To equate eating meat with Black slavery or that those of us who choose to eat meat don't care about the starving or hungry in the world and vegetarians have some moral high ground is ridiculous.

But then that's just my humble opinion.
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Please keep in mind that to some of us, it is not just a dietary choice....it is a moral issue. Imagine those white Americans who defended the opressed slaves.....they had a certain enlightenment that others didnt want to see. Just stop and think about what is being said and you will understand.
 
jewscout

jewscout

Religious Zionist
huajiro said:
Please keep in mind that to some of us, it is not just a dietary choice....it is a moral issue. Imagine those white Americans who defended the opressed slaves.....they had a certain enlightenment that others didnt want to see. Just stop and think about what is being said and you will understand.
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ok i see your point huajiro on the moral issue and i understand.
But does that give certain people the right to say that i'm some how less sensative or enlightened because i choose to include meat in my diet? That i don't care about people who are less fortunate than me?
Or does that give people the right to make baseless remarks on something they obviously know little about?
 
H

huajiro

Well-Known Member
Just remember that you are not being judged because you do eat meat....from what I have seen you are a great person....I think vegetarians tend to get defensive.....we deal with some real crap.
 
jewscout

jewscout

Religious Zionist
huajiro said:
Just remember that you are not being judged because you do eat meat....from what I have seen you are a great person....I think vegetarians tend to get defensive.....we deal with some real crap.
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I hear ya huajiro and i've tried to be nice....but...not to sound like baby...maike started it lol:D
I just wanted to open the discussion up from another thread that wasn't open to all to discuss
 
H

huajiro

Well-Known Member
lol, it is not easy to keep quiet about something you feel so strongly about, I understand that completely
 
Isis-Astoroth

Isis-Astoroth

Member
huajiro said:
Humans only think we are superior beings when it works to our advantage....part of being a "superior" being is our ability to reason. You have no problem putting yourself in the food chain when you think you are on the top.....I would love to see what you'd say if that lion were allowed to take you to the check out line at the local supermarket.
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When did I say I thought I was on top. I said I eat meat, not that i'm top of the food chain. I'm sure that there are several animals that, given the chance, would happily eat me. I may not agree with you on this subject, but that does not mean you have the right to talk to me as if I am some sort of heretic to life. I respect your decision not to eat meat, so please respect my decision to eat meat. Thankyou.
 
H

huajiro

Well-Known Member
Isis-Astoroth said:
When did I say I thought I was on top. I said I eat meat, not that i'm top of the food chain. I'm sure that there are several animals that, given the chance, would happily eat me. I may not agree with you on this subject, but that does not mean you have the right to talk to me as if I am some sort of heretic to life. I respect your decision not to eat meat, so please respect my decision to eat meat. Thankyou.
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I am sorry, you are right. I did throw you on the bandwagon with others....assuming that you felt the same way....forgive me.
 
Bastet

Bastet

Vile Stove-Toucher
maike said:
I would like to see all meat eating people slaughter their own creatures for meat. Look into the beasts eye as you slit its throat and see if you see your compassionate god there. look into the eyes of your faithful dog and ask yourself if your could butcher chop up and eat him or her. A pig has as much or more inteligence as a dog.
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I grew up on a farm, and for many years we were almost entirely self-sufficient. We grew our own fruit and veggies, and had various animals to provide meat, milk and eggs. From my experience, the meat from our own animals (and the entire family was involved in the slaughter and butchering), tasted much better than the stuff you buy from the supermarket on polystyrene trays wrapped in plastic. Given the opportunity, I would live this way again.
I was vegetarian for about 6 months earlier this year, and, while I had no trouble finding tasty and nutritionally fulfilling meals to eat instead, the cost of not eating meat actually turned out to be greater than when I was eating meat, and was sending me broke. I just couldn't afford it. It got to the point where I was living on pasta and potatoes - not a particularly nutritious diet for anyone. Since I am no longer denying myself meat, I am actually eating more fruit and veg than I did in the last couple of months I was vegetarian. It is not a viable dietary choice for everyone. I'm not saying that everyone should be omnivorous, any more than others are saying everyone should be vegetarian. I'm just saying that at this particular point in time, being vegetarian is not suitable for me. Big deal. Each diet is suited to different people...eat what you freaking want, just don't go around trying to 'convert' others. People will come to their own conclusions on what is right for them. The majority of people aren't even going to bother reading post after post of cut-and-pasted quotes and links. They'll skim through and post what they think at the end.

BTW, it is possible to have a 'cruelty free' diet, and still eat meat. It just takes a little extra looking. ;)

maike said:
Does God want his temple full of fat, blood, grissle, cancer, diabetes, heart disease, colesterol ????)
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You need to brush up on your anatomy, luv. Fat, blood, gristle, and cholesterol, are all part of a normally functioning body. I'd love to see how you live without blood. :p Cancer, diabetes and heart disease are caused by inbalances and/or excesses...you can't seriously believe that everyone who eats meat will automatically suffer these diseases. It's all a matter of moderation.
 
maike

maike

Member
jewscout said:
i dare you to find me a credible source that says that!:tsk:
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I said "I Bet", it wasnt a quote from a text book, it was a personal view on the morals of humans. Not all that happens gets written down in history books jew scout. Cannibalism has occured for thousands of years and still happens today. My point in saying that was the greed and selfishness of the meateater would cause him/her to eat the next best thing to an animal, depending on who the persecuted group was at that time . Do some research and you'll find that might makes right and the eaten would be those controlled by the stronger party, as animals are.


jewscout said:
Hey get off your high horse man....let me give you some learning:
HITLER WAS A VEGETARIAN!
Click to expand...

One other on the "For" list that I will take issue with is the "Hitler was a vegetarian" I have seen this statement take surprising upswing in the last few years as people lash back at the vegetarian trend. Hitler was not in fact a vegetarian. The Nazi's implimented many health plans, one of which discovered that reducing meat in the diet also reduced the chances of cancer (which is largely accepted in today's medical journals).



The continual allegation that Hitler was a vegetarian is usually motivated by a wish to discredit vegetarianism by those who oppose it.... However, the allegation that Hitler was a vegetarian is so qualified that one can only call Hitler a "vegetarian" by excluding from the definition of "meat" food such as ham and sausages, which he ate all his life. Robert Proctor calls Hitler a vegetarian "of sorts" (The Nazi War on Cancer, p. 134), which is the most that one can say of his vegetarianism.


jewscout said:
ooo you like that don't ya?
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I take it that you are saying I would be happy to think that Hitler supported something I supported ??? Or are you fishing for anti semetic comments ???

Hitler had his good and bad points just like any other person that has lived, be they German, Arab, American, Asian, or Jewish. I dont ascribe evil to one group of people, eg Jew = good arab = bad, i believe all people are inheritantly evil, some individuals are able to lessen the extent of their evilness to a degree.
 
maike

maike

Member
jewscout said:
I'd still like to see your source for this statement
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"Even in texts in which the pathos of shipwrecks is the subject, eating black people is acceptable"

quoted from 'Slavery, Insurance and the Black Atlantic'

thats only one but it didnt take long to find
 
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