Refuting the Christian Rationalizations of God Sending People to Hell

[TagliatelliMonster]

On the contrary, modern history is full of horrific things done in an attempt to stamp out religion.

1. atheism is not an "attempt to stamp out religion".

2. I'm positive that whatever example you can come up with, other things will be the real motivation of the actions, because "not believing X" never is a motivation for anything.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

we end up alongside others like ourselves

could be heaven

could be hell

but how else to be happy?
how else to be fair?

"fair" would be to judge people according to how they actually behaved, instead of what they were (mostly culturally) made to merely believe with the information at their particular disposal.


Like someone else here said... if you don't provide someone with the information required to be able to figure out that 3 times 9 is 27, it is anything but "fair" to then punish them for not being able to figure it out.

 

[Darkforbid]

1. atheism is not an "attempt to stamp out religion".

2. I'm positive that whatever example you can come up with, other things will be the real motivation of the actions, because "not believing X" never is a motivation for anything.

 

[night912]

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Nope, your actually wrong. His motivation wasn't because he didn't believe god. It was because of sexual desires.

 

[Darkforbid]

Nope, your actually wrong. His motivation wasn't because he didn't believe god. It was because of sexual desires.

 

[shunyadragon]

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The fact is all cultures have acceptable ranges of morals and ethics that by far most people adhere to. There are as many if a bit more Christians involved in mass murders, crime, and other violent behavior rape, and worse.

 

[Thief]

"fair" would be to judge people according to how they actually behaved, instead of what they were (mostly culturally) made to merely believe with the information at their particular disposal.


Like someone else here said... if you don't provide someone with the information required to be able to figure out that 3 times 9 is 27, it is anything but "fair" to then punish them for not being able to figure it out.

and so it is written......Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

because it will be done unto you as you have done unto others

but maybe you noticed?......the golden rule is Proactive
you first

do unto others.....as you WOULD have them do unto you

that puts your intent up front....BEFORE....your action takes hold

so if the intent falls short the action won't be there

kinda like teaching math to someone who doesn't like numbers

 

[Astravalon]

The fact is all cultures have acceptable ranges of morals and ethics that by far most people adhere to. There are as many if a bit more Christians involved in mass murders, crime, and other violent behavior rape, and worse.

Catholic priests also come to mind, what with the
scandals they've been involved in. So, thinking
that there's a God to be accountable to isn't the
panacea some would wish it to be.

Empathy is a far better motivator for treating others
right, imo.

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[TagliatelliMonster]

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The point of behaving morally is living in a stable, peacefull, safe and cooperative society.

Also, I'm pretty sure that next to "serial killer, cannibal, atheist", other words describe the dude as well. Like "psyhopath" or "sociopath" or both.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

and so it is written......Do unto others as you would have them do unto you

A nice, yet inadequate / insufficient, idea. Which is as old as society itself (and not at all original to abrahamic religion)

because it will be done unto you as you have done unto others

That is just not a true-ism. Nore is it the point of the idea.

but maybe you noticed?......the golden rule is Proactive
you first

No, you first. And boom, impasse. Here's that inadequacy / insufficiency that is showing.

do unto others.....as you WOULD have them do unto you
that puts your intent up front....BEFORE....your action takes hold

What if you are into SM and like to have people hurt you?

 

[Thief]

A nice, yet inadequate / insufficient, idea. Which is as old as society itself (and not at all original to abrahamic religion)



That is just not a true-ism. Nore is it the point of the idea.



No, you first. And boom, impasse. Here's that inadequacy / insufficiency that is showing.



What if you are into SM and like to have people hurt you?

each ploy you presented ….I have heard before

none of which reduce my sayings

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

each ploy you presented ….I have heard before

Did you ignore / dodge it every time you encountered it then as well, like you do now?

none of which reduce my sayings

Sure. If you ignore criticism, then it doesn't "reduce" your sayings.

 

[Thief]

Did you ignore / dodge it every time you encountered it then as well, like you do now?



Sure. If you ignore criticism, then it doesn't "reduce" your sayings.

and which ploy do you think is greater?

spot a scheme of reason...…..go for it

 

[Muffled]

Whenever someone brings up the fact that a being who sends people to hell must be a moral monster, the typical response by Christians is something along the lines of "God gives people a choice to accept his offer of salvation or not, and God is just giving those who don't accept his offer what they want by not saving them since they never asked to be saved." However, this rationalization fails miserably and still makes the Christian god out to be a monster. For an analogy, consider a parent who is watching their child swim in a lake and can see that the child is drowning. Now suppose that the child does not ask to be saved or even outright rejects the parent's offers for help, and says "I don't need you, I can save myself!" Would a loving and benevolent parent who KNEW the child could not save themself sit back, watch the child drown and say "Fine. I won't save you because you rejected my offer" or would the parent save the child anyway? The parent who lets the child drown simply because the child rejected the offer for help is of course evil, and if this scenario happened in real life, we would immediately demand that the parent face prison time. Yet when Christians imagine their god doing the same thing, they call him "loving", "fair", and "just." Pretty ironic, isn't it?

The analogy doesn't work. We are not children we are adults. I had this discussion once with a dad who wanted to save his child from drugs. The truth is you can prevent them from using drugs if you lock them away but a person who wants drugs will seek them whenever he is able. It is somewhat similar for those who choose Hell. They want sin and the only way to keep them from it is to lock them up. That is basically what Hell is: a prison.

 

[Muffled]

Religions based on ancient mythology and beliefs are easy to refute. The value and context in the progressive Revelation for these religions anchored in past beliefs and tribalism has long past.

I believe you are brainwashed. God knows everything from beginning to end and reveals what He wishes when He wishes. To be frank I think you are in a regressive religion.

 

[Muffled]

But why hell? Just give them an alternate afterlife where they can be happy, just without You, even though You're "omnipresent" and thus really there is NO "away from You."


But why do evil people go to heaven while some unbeliever goes to hell when the latter was more moral?


It is when the person isn't being punished for anything more than not massaging God's ego.


Not as sad as theists who need to rescue poor God from those meanies. Need to rename God Princess Peach.

I believe if there were an alternative that I would give it to you.

 

[Wandering Monk]

God gives people choices. If someone ends up being punished it is because that person made the wrong choice. God is not to blame when a person is punished, the person is to blame

I am a non-believer. According to your god, non-believers deserve eternal torture. Do you agree with your god that I deserve eternal torture?

 

[Wandering Monk]

Worth your time. Start at the 15 minute mark:

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

I am a non-believer. According to your god, non-believers deserve eternal torture. Do you agree with your god that I deserve eternal torture?

NO NO NO !!! People have it all wrong. No one is tortured forever. Those who are not willing to follow God's rules will not have a place in his kingdom. Everyone will have a chance to accept God's rules - even non-believers. No one will be excluded without a full and fair chance to believe and agree. So called Christians try to scare people into believing but God does not use fear. Some day everyone, including yourself will be shown the truth. But you will not face rorture, only exclusion.

 

[Astravalon]

But "prison" and "exclusion" -- two words I've seen
used in this discussion -- are man's ways of dealing
with things. God's ways are (reportedly) *higher* than
man's ways.

An all-powerful God can be expected to deal with
issues more competently and constructively than a
human with limited power can be.

This is, of course, assuming that there's any 'hell'
to be concerned about in the first place. Personally,
I'm about as worried about a hell as I am about
monsters under my bed, at this point.


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