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Representation blues

Galateasdream

Active Member
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
They're movies. It's acting. Things have always been funny, weird, odd, and unusual for thespians.
I get more peeved about people who expect art to live up to their standards of what it should be and get peeved because it doesn't.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
Now, with that said, I do want to punt-kick Warner Brother executives in the nuts (or tits if a couple don't have nuts) for taking the transgender character out of the Matrix.
 

Samael_Khan

Qigong / Yang Style Taijiquan / 7 Star Mantis
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)

It bugs me when people associate africa with traditional african drum music and wildlife, as if that is what Africa is all about. Or that it is wartorn. Never mind that one of the greatest and most influential civilisations in history, Egypt, is an African civilisation. It seems like Africa is still plagued by the stereotype that it is primitive.
 

ImmortalFlame

Woke gremlin
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)
I think things are getting better, gradually, but there is still a long way to go.

A recent example that bugged me a lot was the movie Mortal Engines, which was based on the book of the same name. I loved the book, and was a particular fan of the writer's work, and of the central character - Hester Shaw. She struck me in particular because she's got the kind of personality that female characters are generally dissuaded from having in a lot of writing; she was violent, hot-tempered (though not clumsy or emotional), capable, individualistic and driven, and actually had a powerful motivation (revenge) and an excellent character arc (learning to allow herself to rely on others, fall in love, let go of revenge, and be happy). And while her development did center on her relationship and eventual romance with a male character, the way it was framed in the story was that Tom - her love interest - was in need of her protection, and she learned to lower her guard around him and make herself vulnerable to love and protect him, which is generally an arc you only ever see men go through.

She was also unfathomably ugly.

This may seem like a small thing, but it isn't. See, Hester's whole motivation is driven (at least, in the first book) by her desire to enact revenge on a man who killed her parents and horribly disfigured her with a sword. She is described as having a horrible scar all the way across her face, going from her chin, through her lips (giving her a "permanent sneer"), severing her nose (making it look like a "mashed snout") and up through one of her eyes (so she only has one). Most of the time she hides this behind a scarf, but her outward appearance is a significant source of her character's trauma, with people regularly horrified just to look at her, and Hester regularly being treated with disgust and disdain from her appearance alone. It was a permanent marker of the wrongs done to her, and a physical display of the trauma that changed her life and she her on a path to revenge.

To me, this is an extremely important part of the character. Sure, she doesn't need the facial scar in order to be a positive, driven character. But the scar fundamentally changes and informs her role within the world. Fact is, a woman who is horribly disfigured will always be treated and looked upon extremely differently to a woman who isn't. It is just a fact that a Hester who has lived with these scars would have had a significantly different life experience than a Hester who wouldn't, and I felt this represented a very specific group who are very often overlooked - not just the non-conventionally attractive, but the actually disfigured. She was a positive representation not just of a woman, but of a woman horribly disfigured and able to not let her condition define or restrict her. In many ways, the scar is a defining trait of the character. She physically cannot smile. She is missing an eye. People look at her and their first thought isn't "scarred human" - it's "monster".

So, when it came time to cast the movie adaptation, how did they make the character look?

maxresdefault.jpg

I have refused to watch the movie since I first saw how Hester looked, and from what I've read and seen I haven't missed much. What made it worse was the book's writer's response to the change. I've met him, and greatly admired a lot of his work, but when he wrote about the change he basically said "I didn't want them to change it, but they told me that her being so badly disfigured would make her unlikeable, and so I agreed".

I mean, think about that for a second.

The movie executives in charge of this movie basically said that disfigured people don't deserve representation, because their disfigurement makes them harder to like.

It doesn't matter if there are a few kids out there who are disfigured, or differently-abled, or just not conventionally attractive who would have felt a little better about themselves by having a character on screen who shows them that they can kick ***, find love and can be accepted for who they are. Those people don't deserve it. You know who needs this more? The people who will only sympathize with her as long as she ISN'T disfigured, differently-able or anything other than conventionally attractive. Those are the people we need filling our cinemas.

Of course, the executives were wrong, and the movie tanked horribly.

Still, doesn't reinstate my faith in humanity.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)
The way I see it, movies are entertainment you should be able to laugh at yourself.

Exaggerated stereotypes don't have to be offensive or controversial if done right.
 

Galateasdream

Active Member
I'd like to see more positive representations of objectums and otherkin, rather than nearly always portraying them having something that needs 'fixing'.
 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)
Well I mean, there is the “older stuff” that I sometimes find a bit “yikesy.”

Art is supposed to be a reflection of humanity (in terms movies, I guess.) So I view representation as sort of a work in progress. As our ideas and philosophy evolves so too will representation.
It will never reach the lofty expectations of everyone, but that’s okay. It’s also okay to constantly ask for better more nuanced representation going forward. Criticism is how we improve.

This is not really a peeve of mine, per se. But I never liked it in Buffy when Willow, let’s say, “moved on” with Kennedy after Tara. The whole 7th season was rushed imo. But anyway, for a show that was unflinching and even nuanced (for the time) about showcasing a queer couple, it seemed a little desperate to reestablish the character’s sexuality. Like she couldn’t be bisexual.

Though not being in either group, perhaps I’m not the best person to ask. Still, Willow and Tara OTP!!!
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Do you have any pet peeves about representation in movies?

Do you dislike how older people, or women, or gays, trans folk, or Latinos are portrayed?
Do you think that there's under-representation of a certain gender or ethnicity or disability group?
Do certain stereotypes bug you when they come up?

Tell us about such representation bug bears here :)
Only one really: why, in Hollywood movies, is the villain given an English accent?

Although, thinking about it, the stage Scotsman is a rather irritating stereotype, too. Think Mr "Scotty" Scott, the Scottish Chief Engineer ("I am Scottish, by the way") in Star Trek. Played by a Canadian, naturally......:rolleyes:

There. That should put 50p in @Revoltingest's slot.:D
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
The way I see it, movies are entertainment you should be able to laugh at yourself.

Exaggerated stereotypes don't have to be offensive or controversial if done right.
Someone needs to dock @Wu Wei a days pay for all those naps he takes on the job here and always talking how he's going to bed.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
That describes a very massive chunk of the comedy in Family Guy and South Park. Or Blazing Saddles.

"Blazing Saddles"--probably the best western ever made. BTW, I've read that they didn't tell Frankie Lane, who sang the theme song, that it was a comedy; he thought it was a real western when he sang the song.
 

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
"Blazing Saddles"--probably the best western ever made. BTW, I've read that they didn't tell Frankie Lane, who sang the theme song, that it was a comedy; he thought it was a real western when he sang the song.
I've always loved how it is very blunt and upfront that it is literally a movie taking place on a movie set. :laughing:
I do wish we could get just one more movie from Mel Brooks before he dies, which probably isn't too far away. :(
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
I've always loved how it is very blunt and upfront that it is literally a movie taking place on a movie set. :laughing:
I do wish we could get just one more movie from Mel Brooks before he dies, which probably isn't too far away. :(
 
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