Republican Tax Nonsense

[T-Dawg]

What the crap makes you think that?

Um, our exceedingly low voter turnout, the fact that most people (and the media machines) know and care more about obscure "celebrities" than they do about politics, the fact that we have no real leftist party, etc? It's not exactly a secret that Americans are apathetic.

Because people complain about everything. And once the government decided to take one step away, the people shouted do more, do more! But then they wanted to complain when their financial freedom was taken away and their taxes were rising. People want things fixed and they don't know how, so they turn the government and say "do it for me." But it's these people that are taking everyone elses rights away.

I... don't understand your point here? I agree that people don't want to bother to do things themselves. See above.

Also, how was it a disaster? We haven't had a completely laissez-faire economy since like, the 1880s? When the government started regulating Mononpolies.

Exactly, and before we did that, there were monopolies, there was child labor, there were poor working conditions, wages as low as the market could afford, etc.

What? All that means is the same thing I said before - I favor Republicans to Democrats. AKA I'm more Conservative than Liberal.

Exactly, that's what I said. You lean Republican.

Wow. How is it sad and wrong that I'm not sefish?

Because you put your nation and government over yourself no matter what it does. In other words, you appear to think of yourself as a part of the nation rather than as an individual, which is especially bad considering the direction our nation's going. This is actually kind of ironic, seeing as how you seem to hate collectivism.

The only reason that is is because government intervention in the economy wasn't really an issue back then. The framers couldn't predict the future.

Er, but didn't you say that economic regulation was unconstitutional or something? No, wait, that doesn't sound right... How did we get into this conversation?

No, I'm not saving that. I'm saying that these pople (you included) thinking that it surely won't become a Authoritarian society is absurd

It could very well become an authoritarian society. All societies will gravitate towards oligarchy unless the natural trend is actively resisted.

They are an infringement of freedom (financial freedom that is) because it is inequality. And the people that support progressive taxes argue that rich people deserve their money less than the poorer do, which is complete stupidity. Of course the poor need it more, but they don't deserve it any more than the rich do. A fair tax would be a proportional tax. The only reason I'm okay with it at this present time is because the deficit's so stinkin bad, it's the only way we can get rid of it.

It's not stupidity that the lower working class has done more to earn their money than the big businessmen. You also completely ignored my point - you can make the argument that they're an infringement of financial freedom, but to argue that they're an infringement of personal freedom is absurd.
What do you mean by a proportional tax? You mean a flat rate? (Am I going to have to give that lecture again....)

I'm sure you're aware you're twisting my words without me even telling you.

Yes, I'm quite sure you didn't intend your words to be used in the way I took them.

 

[Reverend Rick]

It's not stupidity that the lower working class has done more to earn their money than the big businessmen.

Like getting an education and marketing themselves effectively?

Which is better, to work hard or work smart?

 

[Kathryn]

And yet that's not what you asked. You asked "And are you saying that the rich people who are greedy are all Republicans? Do you really believe that rich, greedy people aren't also often Democrats, Libertarians, and Independents?". There's a big difference between saying "All republicans are greedy, rich people" and "All greedy, rich people are republicans".

Yes - that is what I asked, and I asked it to get some clarification from Smoke about his views.

What's your point?

 

[Magic Man]

Yes - that is what I asked, and I asked it to get some clarification from Smoke about his views.

What's your point?

Let's go over this again.

Smoke - Greedy rich people

You - And are you saying that the rich people who are greedy are all Republicans? Do you really believe that rich, greedy people aren't also often Democrats, Libertarians, and Independents?

Smoke - Now, Kathryn, you know English and logic well enough to know without asking that "Some cats are grey" doesn't mean "Everything grey is a cat."

You - I know English well enough to recognize that you are claiming that all Republicans are bad, racist, homophobic, greedy, psycho, or stupid, or (at the very least) inattentive. Unless they are Reverend Rick.

Your last comment doesn't respond to Smoke's comment. He said you know English well enough to understand why your previous question was absurd, and you responded by saying you know English well enough to understand something else he was saying. An appropriate response would have been "OK, I was just clarifying" or something of that nature.

 

[Kathryn]

Just a note - I think Smoke is entirely capable of fighting any battle that he deems worthy of his time and energy.

Mball, you, on the other hand, seem to respond to ANY of my posts as if I had poured gasoline on your hair and set it on fire.

Weird.

 

[Reverend Rick]

Just a note - I think Smoke is entirely capable of fighting any battle that he deems worthy of his time and energy.

Mball, you, on the other hand, seem to respond to ANY of my posts as if I had poured gasoline on your hair and set it on fire.

Weird.

Now now Kathryn, it must be hard to see your political flash in the pan grow dim.

Just for one moment, imagine having control of the oval office, the house and the senate and be bogged down by your own party, only to see this long awaited opportunity slip through your fingers.

Can you imagine not being reasonably able to blame everything on GWB for much longer either. Being a Liberal right now must be depressing.

I actually feel sorry for our Liberal friends right now. :sad4:

 

[Kathryn]

Rev, you've got a point.

Mball, one of these days you'll be all grown up like the Rev and me, and you'll realize that, well, basically most politicians suck, and they're motivated, not by serving their constituents, but by the tantalizing scent of growing power.

They're not in it for your good, or mine. The sooner you realize this, the better off you'll be.

Then you can quit the chihuahua-on-the-heel bit and spend more time working your *** off to pay your ever-increasing tax load - while your social security benefits slide out the back door without even kissing you goodbye.

 

[Revoltingest]

Mball, one of these days you'll be all grown up like the Rev and me, and you'll realize that, well, basically most politicians suck, and they're motivated, not by serving their constituents, but by the tantalizing scent of growing power.

While I think you're generally right, the most dangerous politicians are the ones who genuinely & truly want to help the common man...& woman...& everyone
in between. Their hearts bleed & they desperately need to control every aspect of our lives for our own good. Their moral superiority is such a great & glowing
thing, that they eschew competence & real world experience as mere superfluous inconveniences. Woe unto the country who votes such fools into office.

 

[Sunstone]

...the most dangerous politicians are the ones who genuinely & truly want to help the common man...& woman...& everyone
in between.

Yeah, like those damn politicians who think better schools and roads will help the common man. They're really dangerous.

 

[Kathryn]

While I think you're generally right, the most dangerous politicians are the ones who genuinely & truly want to help the common man...& woman...& everyone
in between. Their hearts bleed & they desperately need to control every aspect of our lives for our own good. Their moral superiority is such a great & glowing
thing, that they eschew competence & real world experience as mere superfluous inconveniences. Woe unto the country who votes such fools into office.

I notice that generally speaking, even those guys - who tout a classless society and who constantly demonize the "greedy wealthy" and capitalism - seem to envision a world where everyone is equal, except for the politicians in power. The rules for the general public CERTAINLY wouldn't be applied to THEM.

 

[Revoltingest]

Yeah, like those damn politicians who think better schools and roads will help the common man. They're really dangerous.

Clever you are...to sarcastically cite some real public good, without addressing government's rising
cost, increasing power, expanding surveillance, & the creeping cancer of bureaucratic morass.

 

[Magic Man]

Just a note - I think Smoke is entirely capable of fighting any battle that he deems worthy of his time and energy.

Yes, he is.

Mball, you, on the other hand, seem to respond to ANY of my posts as if I had poured gasoline on your hair and set it on fire.

Sorry, just wanted to clear up your misunderstanding. It seems I have to do that quite often.

 

[Magic Man]

Now now Kathryn, it must be hard to see your political flash in the pan grow dim.

Just for one moment, imagine having control of the oval office, the house and the senate and be bogged down by your own party, only to see this long awaited opportunity slip through your fingers.

Can you imagine not being reasonably able to blame everything on GWB for much longer either. Being a Liberal right now must be depressing.

I actually feel sorry for our Liberal friends right now. :sad4:

Your first assumption that I'm truly a democrat is false. I am registered as a democrat, but that means nothing really. It is disappointing to have a president like this who is mediocre, but that's reality. Lastly, your assumption that I want to blame everything on Bush is just stupid, but there is a lot of bad stuff W is responsible for.

 

[Magic Man]

Rev, you've got a point.

Mball, one of these days you'll be all grown up like the Rev and me, and you'll realize that, well, basically most politicians suck, and they're motivated, not by serving their constituents, but by the tantalizing scent of growing power.

Thanks. I already know that. I'm sure I'll learn more over the next 30 years, but those things aren't going to turn me into you guys. They'll keep me a reasonable, rational person.

They're not in it for your good, or mine. The sooner you realize this, the better off you'll be.

Thanks for trying, but your problem is assuming I don't know this.

Then you can quit the chihuahua-on-the-heel bit and spend more time working your *** off to pay your ever-increasing tax load - while your social security benefits slide out the back door without even kissing you goodbye.

I'll tell you what: I'll stop correcting your posts when you stop making silly mistakes. For the time being I'll have to continue, though. For instance, there is no "ever-increasing taxload". Look at our taxes over the past few decades, and see where we stand right now. Of course that would require you to use facts to form your opinion, and we know how much you hate that.

 

[Magic Man]

Clever you are...to sarcastically cite some real public good, without addressing government's rising
cost, increasing power, expanding surveillance, & the creeping cancer of bureaucratic morass.

And what does any of that have to do with your previous comment?

 

[Sunstone]

Clever you are...to sarcastically cite some real public good, without addressing government's rising
cost, increasing power, expanding surveillance, & the creeping cancer of bureaucratic morass.

No one is denying those things. But your simplistic glosses are just too much.

 

[Revoltingest]

And what does any of that have to do with your previous comment?

Try reading carefully. It's there.

 

[Revoltingest]

No one is denying those things. But your simplistic glosses are just too much.

Touchy, touchy...you confuse "simplistic" with "simple".

 

[Magic Man]

Try reading carefully. It's there.

I'll take that as a "It has nothing to do with my previous comment, but I'll just play it vague and pretend it does". Well done.

 

[Revoltingest]

I'll take that as a "It has nothing to do with my previous comment, but I'll just play it vague and pretend it does".

That's easier than reading.