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same sex marriage and paul's letter to romans

waitasec

waitasec

Veteran Member
9-10ths_Penguin said:
I'm not sure how it challenges Obama to go against same-sex marriage. While he's come out in favour of it personally, he has left room for people to take other positions.

Also, if we're assuming that Obama's authority was instituted by God, then presumably, the fact that a President's opinion given in an interview carries no legal weight at all was also God's doing.
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well thank for placing a big fat foreclosure sign on my thread...


edit:
i'm not talking about laws
 
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BummerBeavis

Member
waitasec said:
this thread is only for those who believe the bible is just as relevant today as it was then, that it's infallible, and who are defiant towards obama's stance on gay marriage.

when paul wrote the letter to romans, nero was in charge... a pretty shady character in history...yet he says this in the 13th chapter

13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.


so isn't there a disconnect here? why are you rebelling against an authority god established? by challenging obama's position, you are in essence challenging god.


what say you?
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well lets examine Paul. He was a self proclaimed apostle, who never knew Yeshua, who was never called an apostle by the real apostles or Yeshua, he attempted to murder James,Yeshua's brother, he murdered other people, He lied when the Jews brought him to trial, his conversion story changed every time he wrote about it, he was rejected by the whole church as per his own testimony, and in rev 2 Yeshua commended the churches who rejected him. His Gospel is way different from what Yeshua andhis apostles when it comes to keeping the 10 commandments. He claimed to be a "wise master builder" aka mason, then he and Thecula when around destroying marriages and engagements by telling people to stop having sex and they should remain virgins. I am sure he is burning in hell with all of his followers. I reject him as a false apostle
 
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BummerBeavis

Member
idav said:
That verse is a pretty slippery slope. If a person rebels against the government and succeeds in becoming the government then it means god ordained the rebellion. Nobody can tell what god has ordained except to hope god is on their side this time.

Well anyhow I guess I'm not one of those who believes the bible is infallible.
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considering all governments are DeFacto, under Roman law, being administered by politicians who are Knights of the Vatican, vatis=divining can=serpent, and they bow to The Vicarious filii dei, which means "the substitute for the son of god" and in roman numerals adds to 666, the antichrist. I think this proves Paul was a liar. BY the way Federal is Roman. there has only been 4 world empires and the catholic church is the continuation of the Roman empire. Satan's kingdom is not divided like the bible says. Yeshua said in Luke 22.36 buy a sword and that was illegal in Rome
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
james2ko said:
Paul would never write "baseless scriptures" :). We are to honor and respect authority and submit to every ordinance of man. Only when obedience to human rules and regulations violate the laws of God should we decline to obey, as evidenced throughout scripture. But even then, we must respectfully submit to the law's penalty (1 Pet 2:13). Daniel, his three friends, Peter and John did not resist the authorities. They all submitted to the penalty imposed by their actions. This is inline with Paul's admonition in Rom 13:1-2.
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Yes Paul want's you to obey the antichrist and his satanic papal kingdom because he was a self proclaimed apostle and a wicked sinner
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
waitasec said:
this doesn't make any sense.

13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves. 3 For rulers hold no terror for those who do right, but for those who do wrong. Do you want to be free from fear of the one in authority? Then do what is right and you will be commended. 4 For the one in authority is God’s servant for your good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for rulers do not bear the sword for no reason. They are God’s servants, agents of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. 5 Therefore, it is necessary to submit to the authorities, not only because of possible punishment but also as a matter of conscience.

6 This is also why you pay taxes, for the authorities are God’s servants, who give their full time to governing. 7 Give to everyone what you owe them: If you owe taxes, pay taxes; if revenue, then revenue; if respect, then respect; if honor, then honor.


quite a leap you took....
:rolleyes:

can you provide any passages that supports this leap of faith?
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yep and the hundreds of millions of christians were tortured and murdered over the last 2k years because many were led astray by this Self Proclaimed Apostle, who never knew Yeshua. Yep Biw down like good slaves to the Papal antichrist and his satanic Roman theocracy here on earth. See how that works for you. Yeshua said buy a gun Luke 22.36
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
Nakosis said:
I suspect Paul was trying to reign in a newly formed religion who's followers thought the world would end soon and they all be taken to heaven.

"Why pay taxes", "Why recognize earthly authority", ...etc.

A bunch of "Christians" running amok. Paul had his hands full trying to keep them out of trouble. Same reason he tried to discourage homosexuality. Them there Christians were probably nailing everything that moved. The world was ending, what would you do?

Paul, a leader of the church was trying to keep the Christians in-line. He wrote letters not of divine authority but of church leadership. Stop screwing your fellow disciples, stop getting into trouble with the authorities. He was reacting to the problems being created by this new church. I suspect he was setting down rules for Christians because Christians were terrorizing the place.

Paul's letters were relevant to a newly forming church for which he was trying to establish his own leadership.

While I don't agree with Paul's advise, I give him some leeway because I suspect he had his hands full trying to deal with a bunch of people who thought the world was going to end soon.
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yep Paul helped the satnic rulers of their de facto Papal gov to really destroy humanity
 
T

Theodore A. Jones

Active Member
waitasec said:
this thread is only for those who believe the bible is just as relevant today as it was then, that it's infallible, and who are defiant towards obama's stance on gay marriage.

when paul wrote the letter to romans, nero was in charge... a pretty shady character in history...yet he says this in the 13th chapter

13 Let everyone be subject to the governing authorities, for there is no authority except that which God has established. The authorities that exist have been established by God. 2 Consequently, whoever rebels against the authority is rebelling against what God has instituted, and those who do so will bring judgment on themselves.


so isn't there a disconnect here? why are you rebelling against an authority god established? by challenging obama's position, you are in essence challenging god.


what say you?
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Aren't you assuming that he is referncing governmental authorities?
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
waitasec said:
but he is our president who was "ordained" by god simply for the fact that he is president...and if the president says same sex couples should have the same rights then why challenge it?



This could definitely get them riled up ... hopefully," said Caryl Scales, a member of Hampton Road Baptist Church in DeSoto, Texas. "I'm not happy with it. I believe scripture. God's word says gay marriage is wrong."
National religious leaders with a weightier voice also came down against Obama.


Cardinal Timothy Dolan, president of the U.S. Conference of Catholic Bishops, called Obama's remarks "deeply saddening.

Christians rejoice, frown at Obama gay marriage stance - politics - msnbc.com

if he believes in scripture then why is he ignoring what the bible says about the authority that was established by god?
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the reason tyranny abounds is not because the 2 or 3% who are gay, it is because the so called christian church is neither christian or a church. it is Babylonian sun worship .INC The bride of christ is not a corporation
 
C

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
Yes, the RCC most certainly is christian.

It is ancient and drags along with the heritage the crimes. But without it Christianity would be in the same place as Mithraism and other similar religions.

Barely remembered.

Tom
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
columbus said:
Yes, the RCC most certainly is christian.

It is ancient and drags along with the heritage the crimes. But without it Christianity would be in the same place as Mithraism and other similar religions.

Barely remembered.

Tom
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dude your roman catholic church is the whore of Babylon as per revelation17.
 
B

BummerBeavis

Member
gsaseeker said:
The largest Christian church is not Christian? By what measures?
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well lets start with its name Vatican vatis=divining can=serpent. then Vicarious filii dei "the substitute for the son of god" which in roman numerals adds to 666. not to mention the hundreds of millions of people your antichrist popes with its whore clothed in purple and scarlet with a golden cup as per rev 17, have murdered. also its trinity god is not the monotheistic god of Torah. then the papal crest is a dragon. i can go on but if your emotions blind you to whats right before your eyes, your screwed
 
N

Nietzsche

The Last Prussian
Premium Member
BummerBeavis said:
considering all governments are DeFacto, under Roman law, being administered by politicians who are Knights of the Vatican, vatis=divining can=serpent, and they bow to The Vicarious filii dei, which means "the substitute for the son of god" and in roman numerals adds to 666, the antichrist. I think this proves Paul was a liar. BY the way Federal is Roman. there has only been 4 world empires and the catholic church is the continuation of the Roman empire. Satan's kingdom is not divided like the bible says. Yeshua said in Luke 22.36 buy a sword and that was illegal in Rome
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You never took...any language courses, did you? Because you're trying to equate words hundreds, maybe thousands of years apart, and you're still doing a ****-poor job of it.
 
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