ScottySatan
Well-Known Member
Satanism doesn't have a moral code. LaVey didn't write that for a moral reason.
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Satanism and Sex
- Thread starter Rex
- Start date
Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
It sounds like LHP philosophy?
blackout
Violet.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!
Thank you for my morning laugh!
*is glad she wasn't drinking her coffee*
Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
Maybe moral is the wrong word. It is a restriction on inter-relational behavior that is functionally similar to Christian restrictions on behavior, and before this discussion, I didn't think Satanism included directives like this.
ScottySatan
Well-Known Member
Well, Satanism is a religion of self-discipline. One of the big sayings is "responsibility to the responsible".
While you were reading this all from second-hand sources, a couple of key things have gone unsaid so far.
1) The primary reason not to have non-consentual sex is that it's ILLEGAL.
2) A lot of things in the Satanic literature come off as sounding like virtues. However, these "Satanic virtues" are not things anyone should attempt, they are things that a Satanist does by his nature. Otherwise, you are not a Satanist. It's therefore not a code to follow, it's an observation of animal behaviour. The behaviour always has a pragmatic reason behind it.
You have been misled here in part because you assumed that your questions were being answered by LaVeyan Satanists. If you want to know what LaVey said, why not just read what he said?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
:areyoucraThat comes straight from the Bible, which makes it RHP expectations. In the LHP to force yourself sexually upon someone (which includes expecting your partner to be sexually submissive) is to violates that persons freedom, and is also illegal, and something that even LeVay wrote against.
Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
That depends on what kind of Christian you're talking about. I consider the Bible to be an error-prone historical document with a lot of bad information that is not true RHP philosophy. I really only trust the quotations in the Gospels.
As I've learned in the other thread that I started, the Order of Nine Angels would probably not have these kind of restrictions. The fact that it's against the law would only be relevant until one has enough power that they're above the law and can change it as they see fit.
The idea of being "consensual" also is not a black and white issue. What about telling big lies to someone to get them to consent to sex? What about drugging or casting spells or brain washing to cause someone's consent? Does "consent" mean that cheating on your partner without them knowing is prohibited?
Shadow Wolf
Certified People sTabber & Business Owner
I personally would not consider using deception or drugs to be consensual. As for cheating on a partner, not necessarily prohibited but such dishonesty is a sign of cowardice and a sign the lines of communication of broken within the relationship.
Each group and individual has their own views. However as far as the law goes I don't know why I brought it up because it is irrelevant. There are many things that are illegal that people do anyways. Illicit drug use, speeding, and some states even have laws on the books banning certain sexual acts are just a few examples of laws that many people do not bother with adhering to, for whatever reason they have.
Hexavibrongal, there is something you've just got to understand, not all LHPathers or individual members of a certain LHP group necesserily subscribe to the same exact philosophies, tenets, or creeds of one another. That would make us no better than the sheeple of the world who surround us every day of our mundane lives. We are extreme individuals who must walk the path of our own individual true will in Life. That's why on this DIR you're going to find multiple definitions and views on the Realms of the Forces/Powers of Darkness.
Reyn Til Runa= "Seek After the Mysteries".
/Adramelek\
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Furthermore, I will say this, on the LHP, even though there is no specific religious doctrine or dogma, some of us are in a sense like-minded individuals else we would not gravitate towards one another. You know - "great minds think alike"?
Xeper.
/Adramelek\
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Tiberius
Well-Known Member
You're right, it doesn't need to be. I hope you find this out in a dark alley with a man 7 feet tall, built like a ton of bricks and with a penis like a sock full of sand who wants you to be his "Sweet Patootie".
Then we'll see how much you value consent.
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Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
Hmm, based on my research and this thread there actually does seem to be doctrine/dogma -- what about Lavey's writing or the writing on the ONA site? One of the most given reasons so far in this discussion against non-consensual sex is that Lavey wrote against it.
I personally am not a LaVeyan Satanist nor am I a member of the ONA so I can't speak for them. I'm really not that familiar with the ONA philosophy but I have studied LaVey's works, some of which can be seen as dogmatic. However, as a Setian LHPather I can say that there is no real dogma in Setian philosophy or Magic. Neither Anton LaVey nor the ONA nor the Temple of Set or the Church of Satan speak for all LHPathers. Again, we LHPathers are born extreme individualists, and even though we might gravitate toward one another (at least some of us do) I am actually surprised that we get along as well as we do. In Setian Magic the practicing Magician is encouraged to compose his own Magical rites and not just rely on the text of another which would be an affront to the Self.
Xeper.
/Adramelek\
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Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
So you don't read or study anything? You only do introspective meditation?
No.
Forget for a moment the definitions of dogma and doctrine, my form of Magic requires study, practice, and self-introspection, but it does not require worship. Though I do work with some select and differing magical techniques of other times and other magicians, on the Left-Hand Path there are no gospels and nothing is written in stone. Each individual magician tends to study and practice those magical techniques that work best for him or her, and through there practice we begin to remanifest them in accordance with our own understanding and will - creating our own unique magical formulae for Life. Xeper.
/Adramelek\
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Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
No.
But what do you study and how do you know what to study if there's no doctrine?
I suggest you re-read my finished post #39 on this thread. I will also say that we magicians do learn a great deal from one another, but never is said "this way, or that way is the only way." No magicians' path or quest is equal to or exactly the same as anothers - if you want to define that as some kind of doctrine then be my guest.
Xeper.
/Adramelek\
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Hexavibrongal
Soulmaster
No magicians' path or quest is equal to or exactly the same as anothers - if you want to define that as some kind of doctrine then be my guest.
Yes, I will!
This does seem to be a consistent idea within the LHP forums.