Science is Magic!

[Absolutely Frank]

No matter how people spin it, science isn't just about studying nature and its phenomena. It's also fundamentally about control. The drive to know everything stems from a deep-seated fear of an uncontrollable and chaotic natural world that threatens us with extinction at every turn. Some so-called geniuses in the transhumanist wing of the cult of scientific progress even aspire to conquer death by turning themselves into immortal mega-robots. And astonishingly, some people actually cheer for these delusional and unhinged prophets of modern technology, failing to see the truth—science has become like Harry Potter. That’s right. Science now dreams of the irrational and claims that anything is possible. Some science enthusiasts don't even recognize the absurdity of flying cars and warp drives—they genuinely believe in them because, to them, SCIENCE IS MAGIC!

They actually buy into Arthur C. Clarke's misguided and obviously problematic quip, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic," as if it were a serious truth. But this kind of magical thinking is nothing new to science—its roots are deeply entwined with the irrational. Science didn’t descend from the heavens like some alien Prometheus bringing us the Fire of Knowledge. The dirty little secret is that science was nurtured at the breast of the irrational. Science’s roots are in magic, and the fruit doesn’t fall far from the tree. Consider these examples:

• Alchemy birthed chemistry.
• Pythagorean mathematics laid the foundation for modern mathematics.
• Hermeticism heavily influenced Newton and other early scientists' views on the universe.
• Astrology evolved into modern astronomy.
• Sympathetic magic and theurgy focused on classifying, quantifying, and taxonomy.

So, are we willing to face the truth that science, for all its advancements, is still deeply rooted in the mystical and irrational? Or will we continue to indulge in magical thinking disguised as progress, ignoring the fact that our quest for control and understanding might just be an extension of the very enchantments we once sought to overcome? Looks like the line between magic and science is not as clear as people like to think.

 

[The Hammer]

Ok

 

[Shadow Wolf]

's also fundamentally about control. The drive to know everything stems from a deep-seated fear of an uncontrollable and chaotic natural world that threatens us with extinction at every turn.

Then why did so many early scientist believe their studies honored their god (Jehovah) by studying his creation and learning how it works?
And past practices don't really have a bearing on the present. Science thrives by disproving older ideas and replacing them with newer, more accurate information. This is why alchemy has been discarded and the field of astronomy created.

 

[RestlessSoul]

James Webb does magic

 

[RestlessSoul]

Caption​

This “penguin party” is loud! The distorted spiral galaxy at center, the Penguin, and the compact elliptical galaxy at left, the Egg, are locked in an active embrace. A new near- and mid-infrared image from the James Webb Space Telescope, taken to mark its second year of science, shows that their interaction is marked by a faint upside-down U-shaped blue glow.

The pair, known jointly as Arp 142, made their first pass between 25 and 75 million years ago — causing “fireworks,” or new star formation, in the Penguin. In the most extreme cases, mergers can cause galaxies to form thousands of new stars per year, for a few million years. For the Penguin, research has shown that about 100 to 200 stars have formed per year. By comparison, our Milky Way galaxy (which is not interacting with a galaxy of the same size) forms roughly six to seven new stars per year.

This gravitational shimmy also remade the Penguin’s appearance. Its coiled spiral arms unwound, and gas and dust were pulled in an array of directions, like it was releasing confetti. It is rare for individual stars to collide when galaxies interact (space is vast), but galaxies’ mingling disrupts stars’ orbits.

Today, the Penguin’s galactic center looks like an eye set within a head, and the galaxy has prominent star trails that take the shape of a beak, backbone, and fanned-out tail. A faint, but prominent dust lane extends from its beak down to its tail.

Despite the Penguin appearing far larger than the Egg, these galaxies have approximately the same mass. This is one reason why the smaller-looking Egg hasn’t yet merged with the Penguin. (If one was less massive, it may have merged earlier.)

The oval Egg is filled with old stars, and little gas and dust, which is why it isn’t sending out “streamers” or tidal tails of its own and instead has maintained a compact oval shape. If you look closely, the Egg has four prominent diffraction spikes — the galaxy’s stars are so concentrated that it gleams.

Now, find the bright, edge-on galaxy at top right. It may look like a party crasher, but it’s not nearby. Cataloged PGC 1237172, it lies 100 million light-years closer to Earth. It is relatively young and isn’t overflowing with dust, which is why it practically disappears in Webb’s mid-infrared view.

The background of this image is overflowing with far more distant galaxies. This is a testament to the sensitivity and resolution of Webb’s infrared cameras.

Additional images of Arp 142 are available at left, under the Download Options, including a cropped image (like the one above) that features only near-infrared light, and a wider near-infrared field of view, which features an even greater number of distant galaxies.

Arp 142 lies 326 million light-years from Earth in the constellation Hyd

 

[HonestJoe]

So, are we willing to face the truth that science, for all its advancements, is still deeply rooted in the mystical and irrational?

It isn't science that is rooted in these things, it is human beings. Scientific method is about overcoming and moving beyond those human instincts, though it can only do so much. Pretty much everything human beings do, and every way we (try to) do them, is about making sense out of chaos, understanding and controlling. It's just that science is one of the more effective, albeit more difficult and scarier, ways of succeeding in those aims.

Looks like the line between magic and science is not as clear as people like to think.

The line is very clear; Science is fact and magic is fictional. Something scientific looking like magic (especially to laypeople) doesn't mean it's any closer to actual magic, it's just another demonstration of how bad we are at making the distinction.

 

[Eli G]

On the other hand, if we could travel back in time to any time before the 15th century and we had an iPhone, this device that is so common these days (although few know how it really works) would be pure magic.

Humans of the future will most likely laugh at the fact that many people once thought we came from apes, just as young people today laugh at VCRs and record players.

 

[Pogo]

On the other hand, if we could travel back in time to any time before the 15th century and we had an iPhone, this device that is so common these days (although few know how it really works) would be pure magic.

Humans of the future will most likely laugh at the fact that many people once thought we came from apes, just as young people today laugh at VCRs and record players.

Except that we are apes and always will be, here is a case where you are already in the dark ignorant past.

 

[Audie]

No matter how people spin it, science isn't just about studying nature and its phenomena. It's also fundamentally about control. The drive to know everything stems from a deep-seated fear of an uncontrollable and chaotic natural world that threatens us with extinction at every turn. Some so-called geniuses in the transhumanist wing of the cult of scientific progress even aspire to conquer death by turning themselves into immortal mega-robots. And astonishingly, some people actually cheer for these delusional and unhinged prophets of modern technology, failing to see the truth—science has become like Harry Potter. That’s right. Science now dreams of the irrational and claims that anything is possible. Some science enthusiasts don't even recognize the absurdity of flying cars and warp drives—they genuinely believe in them because, to them, SCIENCE IS MAGIC!

They actually buy into Arthur C. Clarke's misguided and obviously problematic quip, "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic," as if it were a serious truth. But this kind of magical thinking is nothing new to science—its roots are deeply entwined with the irrational. Science didn’t descend from the heavens like some alien Prometheus bringing us the Fire of Knowledge. The dirty little secret is that science was nurtured at the breast of the irrational. Science’s roots are in magic, and the fruit doesn’t fall far from the tree. Consider these examples:

• Alchemy birthed chemistry.
• Pythagorean mathematics laid the foundation for modern mathematics.
• Hermeticism heavily influenced Newton and other early scientists' views on the universe.
• Astrology evolved into modern astronomy.
• Sympathetic magic and theurgy focused on classifying, quantifying, and taxonomy.

So, are we willing to face the truth that science, for all its advancements, is still deeply rooted in the mystical and irrational? Or will we continue to indulge in magical thinking disguised as progress, ignoring the fact that our quest for control and understanding might just be an extension of the very enchantments we once sought to overcome? Looks like the line between magic and science is not as clear as people like to think.

Its your thinking that has the clarity issue.

 

[Madsaac]

I don't really see what you are trying to say, that science enables us to dare to dream for a better world?

Yes science may be have been inspired by the mystical & irrational but what science does, is it turns something that was once considered magic into truth and reality. And it must prove this change.

There are countless examples where this has occurred.

Compared to for example, turning wine into blood, it has never or will occur. Cause there is no proof. It would have to magical or part of a super natural world for this to happen.

There are countless examples where this has occurred in religion.

So therefore RELIGION IS MAGIC

Magic Definition - The power of using supernatural or other unseen forces to apparently influence events or human behaviour. Oxford Reference

 

[Audie]

So therefore RELIGION IS MAGIC

Exceptin' it dont work.

 

[gnostic]

Compared to for example, turning wine into blood, it has never or will occur. Cause there is no proof. It would have to magical or part of a super natural world for this to happen.

Nor water into wine.

water have no sugar that exist naturally in fruit. Wine does have sugar in the grapes. It is these sugar in the grape juice that are turned into alcohol, when fermented by unicellular fungi, some species of yeasts. Yeasts feed on sugar. Cereal grain can turn into malt, and the starches (sugar) within the malt, can be fermented, likewise by yeasts, which will in turn, turns into alcohol for beer or for whisky. Honey also can be fermented to produce beer.

There are no sugar in H2O water to ferment.

for water to into wine, would require magic or miracle, hence it will be categorised as the supernatural event.

 

[Audie]

Nor water into wine.

water have no sugar that exist naturally in fruit. Wine does have sugar in the grapes. It is these sugar in the grape juice that are turned into alcohol, when fermented by unicellular fungi, some species of yeasts. Yeasts feed on sugar. Cereal grain can turn into malt, and the starches (sugar) within the malt, can be fermented, likewise by yeasts, which will in turn, turns into alcohol for beer or for whisky. Honey also can be fermented to produce beer.

There are no sugar in H2O water to ferment.

for water to into wine, would require magic or miracle, hence it will be categorised as the supernatural event.

Gotta have carbon. None in water.
So magic is needed.

 

[VoidCat]

Some science enthusiasts don't even recognize the absurdity of flying cars

I dont know what a warp drive is but flying cars exist. Terrafugia is one. Heck the first concept of a flying car that I know of was built was in 1917 the Curtiss Autoplane...it was never flown however. The first flown one i can think of off hand was Waterman Arrowbile made in 1935. Only 5 of those were made

 

[Audie]

I dont know what a warp drive is but flying cars exist. Terrafugia is one. Heck the first concept of a flying car that I know of was built was in 1917 the Curtiss Autoplane...it was never flown however. The first flown one i can think of off hand was Waterman Arrowbile made in 1935. Only 5 of those were made

Absurdly impractical.

 

[VoidCat]

Absurdly impractical.

Hey i didn't say they were widely produced or should be. As bad as humans are at driving i don't think flying cars should be widely produced. But there's several companies that make them. They extremely expensive hence why they are not widely made.

Im just pointing out that they exist. Frank said

Some science enthusiasts don't even recognize the absurdity of flying cars and warp drives—they genuinely believe in them because, to them, SCIENCE IS MAGIC!

That implies warp drives and flying cars dont exist. I don't know what a warp drive is googling it seems to be a space travel device that doesnt exist tho there's theories on how they can be made. Flying cars however do exist. It's a really cool rabbit hole to read up on.

 

[VoidCat]

I do wonder if it would be good to have flying cars not for the general public but for emergency personal. Like firefighters and ambulances. Since they would move quicker then a regular car. I'm not sure tho it could be helicopters are more practical

 

[Audie]

Hey i didn't say they were widely produced or should be. As bad as humans are at driving i don't think flying cars should be widely produced. But there's several companies that make them. They extremely expensive hence why they are not widely made.

Im just pointing out that they exist. Frank said


That implies warp drives and flying cars dont exist. I don't know what a warp drive is googling it seems to be a space travel device that doesnt exist tho there's theories on how they can be made. Flying cars however do exist. It's a really cool rabbit hole to read up on.

The word was "absurd" which, you were contradicting

 

[Pogo]

Gotta have carbon. None in water.
So magic is needed.

But if you started with just the hydrogen and enough of it, then you could get carbon and water though you probably wouldn't be around to see it.

 

[Pogo]

Absurdly impractical.

so are wood fired cars, but like helicopters they have their applications. The newer ones seem to all be based on Saab's and Volvos. LOL