Seventy weeks (490) in Daniel 9:24-27

[Ben Avraham]

I don't want to go into it, but the Seventh Day Adventist have a really good interpretation on Daniels prophesy, the best I have ever heard.

I also read the Seventh-Day Adventist interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27. The same old Christian forgery in the other Christian interpretations. 490 years when the Jewish exile was historically of only 70 years. God Almighty! When will the Gentiles ever stop incurring into Judaism!

 

[Dawnofhope]

No, the only place where one week means one year is in Daniel 9:24, and the Christian claim of 490 years fits nowhere in the Tanach. You guys have to separate the NT from the Tanach. The NT is Hellenistic and the Tanach is Jewish. That's quite two different realms. To keep mingling them together is the cause for vandalism of the Tanach by the NT. The seven seventies has nothing to do with the prophecy of Daniel 9:24. Jesus did not refer to Daniel 9:26,27. That's an act of Christian forgery into the book of Daniel.

Maybe it is, but the Christians have been around for a long time and so has the Christian bible. You can see why Daniel 9:24-27 would be such an important verse for Christians and why many have commented on it. It is the only Tanakh verse that I can think of where Christ (forgery or otherwise) has made two references. Many of the other references to prophecy are through the authors of the gospels, rather than Christ.

I agree that Jeremiah 31:31-34 can't possibly refer to Jesus in its entirety as the last two verses have not happened. I like much of what you have said. You will note from another thread I started that Baha'is do not believe Jesus was physically resurrected.

 

[psychoslice]

I also read the Seventh-Day Adventist interpretation of Daniel 9:24-27. The same old Christian forgery in the other Christian interpretations. 490 years when the Jewish exile was historically of only 70 years. God Almighty! When will the Gentiles ever stop incurring into Judaism!

Ha, yes it must be frustrating for you.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Yes I think your right, Buddhism especially made much more sense than Christianity, but that's my opinion, I really see no need for any religion, If you are a naturally a good person, why the hell do you need religion ??>

If religion assists to makes us better people then I'm all for it. If it makes us into unhappy, bigoted, and confused then probably best to be without it.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Ha, yes it must be frustrating for you.

You surely ain't kidding!

 

[Dawnofhope]

You surely ain't kidding!

The Tanakh is the most precious of all things, so everyone wants to claim it as their own.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Maybe it is, but the Christians have been around for a long time and so has the Christian bible. You can see why Daniel 9:24-27 would be such an important verse for Christians and why many have commented on it. It is the only Tanakh verse that I can think of where Christ (forgery or otherwise) has made two references. Many of the other references to prophecy are through the authors of the gospels, rather than Christ.

I agree that Jeremiah 31:31-34 can't possibly refer to Jesus in its entirety as the last two verses have not happened. I like much of what you have said. You will note from another thread I started that Baha'is do not believe Jesus was physically resurrected.

No, I can't! If at least there was a Christian reference in Daniel, perhaps, but one has to be a Christian to read Christianity into the book of Daniel. That's really frustrating to fight the Christian doctrine of Replacement Theology!

 

[Ben Avraham]

The Tanakh is the most precious of all things, so everyone wants to claim it as their own.

Isn't it something! You surely ain't kidding!

 

[rosends]

I have this one in the PDF format? Is this one ok?

The Jewish Study Bible: Featuring The Jewish Publication Society TANAKH Translation: Adele Berlin, Marc Zvi Brettler, Michael Fishbane: 9780195297515: Amazon.com: Books

Still an academic version which has a different approach to the underlying purpose and accuarcy of the text, but a step up from 1917 (the translation it uses is the NJPS of 1985).

 

[roger1440]

Still an academic version which has a different approach to the underlying purpose and accuarcy of the text, but a step up from 1917 (the translation it uses is the NJPS of 1985).

Can you give an example using a bad and good translation?

 

[rosends]

Can you give an example using a bad and good translation?

If I have the right edition in mind, it begins with " When God began to create heaven and earth" which might carry some intent, but which, to my ear, ignores the meanings of "b'rei****" and inverts the order of the words to put God before the verb when, in the Hebrew, the order is "b'rei**** (at the outset) bara (created) elokim (god)". In the same verse, it ignores the definite article in front of "heaven" and "earth." While it is the version that sefaria.org uses, so I occasionally use it, I prefer the print-only Stone edition. Note that the examples in this first verse aren't even theologically sticky wickets. Just linguistic choices with which I disagree.

 

[MHz]

In the Book of Daniel 9:24-27 seven seventies are decreed:

"Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."

Interestingly Jesus refers to seven seventies when asked how many times we should forgive someone.

"Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven."
Matthew 18:21-22

And Jesus refers to Daniel 9:26-27 through Matthew 24:15 in regards the abomination that causes desolation.

It is the only instance I'm aware of where Jesus directs us to an old testament prophecy twice so I believe it is an essential key for unlocking prophecy. What do you think the seventy sevens or seventy weeks means?

This is the verse that belongs there. A false throne so Satan can demand worship under threat of death.

Da:11:31:
And arms shall stand on his part,
and they shall pollute the sanctuary of strength, and shall take away the daily sacrifice,
and they shall place the abomination that maketh desolate.

The prophecy covers a period of 490 years. The last week started when God called John the Baptist and 3 1/2 years later the cross happened. 3 1/2 years after Acts:10 took place. It was a single block of time so the timeline Revelations has is the one that should be used.

This should clarify who is associated with 'covenants' in that passage and when God is the reference then that changes the meaning if the verses connected with that week. The 'little horn' verses from Da:8 also mentions a few events as well as others that cover Rome's whole 500

Da:9:4:
And I prayed unto the LORD my God,
and made my confession,
and said,
O Lord,
the great and dreadful God,
keeping the covenant and mercy to them that love him,
and to them that keep his commandments;

Da:9:27:
And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week:
and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease,
and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate,
even until the consummation,
and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

 

[tгєรкเค]

It refers to the same period but is divided up to emphasize the importance of the first seven weeks (49 years) with the rebuilding of Jerusalem and the last week when Christ was Manifested.

Where is the missing week?

Daniel 9:27

“the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.” Why refer to these aspects?

The completeness of reconstruction of Jerusalem which will have important symbolic significance eg book of Revelation.


26And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.



‘and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary’ ? Meaning?

The Jews who have put to death their Messiah, in turn have their temple and Jerusalem destroyed by the Romans.

‘and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined’? Meaning?

Life is going to become very difficult for God's chosen people


27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Is this the missing week?

Yes

What is the Covenant? What other Covenants are there in the bible?

The New Covenant prophesised in Jeremiah 31:31 symbolised at the last supper.

‘Shall cause sacrifice and oblation to cease’ Meaning?

Sacrifice at the temple ends with the destruction the temple. Jesus is the new focal point of worship.

‘And for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate’ Meaning?


The Return of Christ ends this for the Jews (Bridal symbolism - Matthew 25 and book of Revelation)

‘and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.’ Meaning?

The Returned Christ's love will be poured upon the Jews. They will be the first as a Nation to recognise the Returned Christ.

Feel free to add comments or suggest amendments

My opinion is that there's no missing week, but the last remaining week (7years: 3 1/2 : 3 1/2) will last for 2520 years, that is with the first half, are 1260 years or 42 months of tribulation and the remaining half, 1260 years of desolation, but these days shall be shortened accirdingly.

Daniel 9:26
And after the threescore and two weeks shall an anointed one be cut off, and be no more; and the people of a prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary;

It was the Romans that destroy the city and the temple, not the Jews

John 14:30
Hereafter I will not talk much with you, for the prince of this world comes and has nothing in me.

Revelation of John 12:9
And the great dragon was cast out, the serpent of old, who is called Devil and the Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

but his end shall be with a flood; and unto the end of the war desolations are determined...

 

[Dawnofhope]

My opinion is that there's no missing week, but the last remaining week (7years: 3 1/2 : 3 1/2) will last for 2520 years, that is with the first half, are 1260 years or 42 months of tribulation and the remaining half, 1260 years of desolation, but these days shall be shortened accirdingly.

Daniel 9:26
And after the threescore and two weeks shall an anointed one be cut off, and be no more; and the people of a prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary;

It was the Romans that destroy the city and the temple, not the Jews

John 14:30
Hereafter I will not talk much with you, for the prince of this world comes and has nothing in me.

Revelation of John 12:9
And the great dragon was cast out, the serpent of old, who is called Devil and the Satan, who deceives the whole world; he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.

but his end shall be with a flood; and unto the end of the war desolations are determined...

I agree the 3 1/2 years (42 months or 1260 days) representing 1260 years is important as there are several references to this time period in the Bible.

What Does the Bible Say About 42 Months?

The two periods of 1260 years could also refer to two Prophets that emerge at this time, not just one.

 

[tгєรкเค]

I agree the 3 1/2 years (42 months or 1260 days) representing 1260 years is important as there are several references to this time period.

What Does the Bible Say About 42 Months?

Forty and two months...

It kind of remind me of the Jews' wandering years in the wilderness 40 desolate years.

And the two witnesses sort of reminds me of the two faithful witnesses: Joshua and Caleb including all of their descendants, from the tribe of Judah and Iphraim, the remaining Jews and early followers of Jesus who fled the destruction of Jerusalem and wander throughout the 1260 period unto the four corners of the world.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Forty and two months...

It kind of remind me of the Jews' wandering years in the wilderness 40 desolate years.

And the two witnesses sort of reminds me of the two faithful witnesses: Joshua and Caleb including all of their descendants, from the tribe of Judah and Iphraim, the remaining Jews and early followers of Jesus who fled the destruction of Jerusalem and wander throughout the 1260 period unto the four corners of the world.

Forty is another number the recurs in the Bible and is generally a time period that is associated with trials and testing. It rained for forty days and forty nights while Noah and his family were on the Ark. Jesus had forty days of being tested in the wilderness before His Ministry began.

The period of 1260 years most likely relates to a religious dispensation from the beginning of era to the beginning of another is association with the Messiah or Christ returning.

The analogy with Joshua is useful and there is a pairing of Moses and Joshua, Jesus and Peter and then Muhammad and Ali which the prophecy could match. The Jewish, Christian and Islamic dispensations were founded by Moses, Christ and Muhammad but relied on appointed witnesses or successors to carry the message forward.

 

[tгєรкเค]

Forty is another number the recurs in the Bible and is generally a time period that is associated with trials and testing. It rained for forty days and forty nights while Noah and his family were on the Ark. Jesus had forty days of being tested in the wilderness before His Ministry began.

The period of 1260 years most likely relates to a religious dispensation from the beginning of era to the beginning of another is association with the Messiah or Christ returning.

The analogy with Joshua is useful and there is a pairing of Moses and Joshua, Jesus and Peter and then Muhammad and Ali which the prophecy could match. The Jewish, Christian and Islamic dispensations were founded by Moses, Christ and Muhammad but relied on appointed witnesses or successors to carry the message forward.

Two witnesses..

I wouldn't mind, it'd be Moses and Joshua, (Levites and Jews), as it was meant to be, had not Moses 'struck the rock of God, and sinned, he would have been one of the twelve witnesses that had entered the 'promised land' beforehand, but God forbade Him and Aaron and their generations (and of the ten tribes) for their transgression.

Mohammed and Islam, in my opinion, is mentioned here

Revelation of John 9:1-3
And the fifth angel sounded the trumpet, and I saw a star fall from heaven unto the earth; and to him was given the key of the bottomless pit. And he opened the bottomless pit, and there arose smoke out of the pit as [the] smoke of a great furnace; and the sun and the air were darkened by reason of the smoke of the pit. And there came out of the smoke locusts upon the earth and unto them was given power, as the scorpions of the earth have power.

the scorpions were the Levites(Rabbinic Jews)

and the locusts were the Ishmaelites(Arab Moslems)

Revelation of John 9:4
And it was commanded them that they should not hurt the grass of the earth neither any green thing neither any tree, but only those men who do not have the seal of God in their foreheads.

Revelation of John 9:11
And they had a king over them, [who is] the angel of the bottomless pit, whose name in Hebrew tongue [is] Abaddon, and in Greek, Apollyon [meaning destroyer].

 

[Muffled]

In the Book of Daniel 9:24-27 seven seventies are decreed:

"Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy."

Interestingly Jesus refers to seven seventies when asked how many times we should forgive someone.

"Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven."
Matthew 18:21-22

And Jesus refers to Daniel 9:26-27 through Matthew 24:15 in regards the abomination that causes desolation.

It is the only instance I'm aware of where Jesus directs us to an old testament prophecy twice so I believe it is an essential key for unlocking prophecy. What do you think the seventy sevens or seventy weeks means?

I believe it is commonly believed to be the number of years form the edict of Cyrus until the death and resurrection of Jesus.

 

[Breathoflife]

The 70 Weeks of Years has an interesting history. One that has left the last Week of Years resembling the prophecy given through Gabriel a mess.Gabriel made it simple the entire 70 Weeks of Years, 490 years total, applied to Daniel’s people and city. Yet almost all immediately apply the entities in this last week to anyone but those named. We have Russia, the RCC, Europe or name your own favorite Gentile entity. Daniel’s people and city is very straight forward and if it is untrue then the entire prophecy must be false.

The 70 Weeks has three different events to mark off how we are to know when these 70 Weeks has run its course. the first sign would be the edict King Cyrus for the city of Jerusalem and the temple to be rebuilt. The edict was issued and it took 7 Weeks of Years or 49 total years for the city and temple to be rebuilt. That left 63 Weeks of Years still to be fulfilled.or 440 years. The second portion of the prophecy is pinned on the fulfillment of the first section and declares that The Messiah would come to Jerusalem exactly 62 Weeks of years or 434 total years for this second prophecy to be fulfilled with Messiah coming and being sacrificed. With these two sections of the prophecy complete with cutting off of Messiah. We have gone through 69 Weeks of Years or a total of 483 years. Leaving one Week of Years, 7 years, for all the rest of the prophecy to be fulfilled..This final week of years is concerning not Rome or the E.U. But apostate Israel.

 

[Muffled]

The 70 Weeks of Years has an interesting history. One that has left the last Week of Years resembling the prophecy given through Gabriel a mess.Gabriel made it simple the entire 70 Weeks of Years, 490 years total, applied to Daniel’s people and city. Yet almost all immediately apply the entities in this last week to anyone but those named. We have Russia, the RCC, Europe or name your own favorite Gentile entity. Daniel’s people and city is very straight forward and if it is untrue then the entire prophecy must be false.

The 70 Weeks has three different events to mark off how we are to know when these 70 Weeks has run its course. the first sign would be the edict King Cyrus for the city of Jerusalem and the temple to be rebuilt. The edict was issued and it took 7 Weeks of Years or 49 total years for the city and temple to be rebuilt. That left 63 Weeks of Years still to be fulfilled.or 440 years. The second portion of the prophecy is pinned on the fulfillment of the first section and declares that The Messiah would come to Jerusalem exactly 62 Weeks of years or 434 total years for this second prophecy to be fulfilled with Messiah coming and being sacrificed. With these two sections of the prophecy complete with cutting off of Messiah. We have gone through 69 Weeks of Years or a total of 483 years. Leaving one Week of Years, 7 years, for all the rest of the prophecy to be fulfilled..This final week of years is concerning not Rome or the E.U. But apostate Israel.

I believe there is no evidence to indicate the last seven years goes any further than the first coming of the Messiah, Jesus.