Should Pagans and Witches

[The Hammer]

Have religious freedom? Not according to some.

"On Saturday, July 16th 2022, the Witch’s Fest event held in Astor Place, New York City (NYC), was invaded by a group of evangelical Christians who clearly believed that their religion was the only one which should be followed."

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/holis...rce=WebPush&utm_campaign=Push_PAG_ChannelFeed

Also, something the GOP and conservatives, (maybe even the Originalists) should take note of:

"It is important to muse upon what Mr (Thomas) Jefferson had to say about the First Amendment:

“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof’, thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.”

It certainly appears that the original spirit of the First Amendment was that everyone should be free to engage in the religious practices that best suit them.

 

[JustGeorge]

Have religious freedom? Not according to some.

"On Saturday, July 16th 2022, the Witch’s Fest event held in Astor Place, New York City (NYC), was invaded by a group of evangelical Christians who clearly believed that their religion was the only one which should be followed."

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/holis...rce=WebPush&utm_campaign=Push_PAG_ChannelFeed

Also, something the GOP and conservatives, (maybe even the Originalists) should take note of:

"It is important to muse upon what Mr (Thomas) Jefferson had to say about the First Amendment:

“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof’, thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.”

It certainly appears that the original spirit of the First Amendment was that everyone should be free to engage in the religious practices that best suit them.

Its a shame, but many who plead for 'religious freedom' don't mean it, at least not in the terms one would imagine when one hears the word 'freedom'. They mean they want the freedom to press their religion on others most of the time.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

I've posted many times here about a judge in Indianapolis, back in the late 90s/early 00s, ordered a divorcing couple--both Wiccan and wanting to raise their children in such an environment--to not expose their children to "non-mainstream religions."
The only thing that has changed is they are now significantly more powerful.

 

[The Hammer]

Its a shame, but many who plead for 'religious freedom' don't mean it, at least not in the terms one would imagine when one hears the word 'freedom'. They mean they want the freedom to press their religion on others most of the time.

At least that's what it seems like from the purely monotheistic traditions.

Never met someone forcing me to be a Hindu, or Yoruba, or Pagan, or FSM follower.

It only ever comes from Christianity/Catholicism or Islam.

Edit: sometimes Baha'i. But usually their schtick is to just get you to agree that whatever God(s) you worship, is really there's as well.

 

[The Hammer]

I've posted many times here about a judge in Indianapolis, back in the late 90s/early 00s, ordered a divorcing couple--both Wiccan and wanting to raise their children in such an environment--to not expose their children to "non-mainstream religions."
The only thing that has changed is they are now significantly more powerful.

That's.... Illegal. Afaik.

Or at least it sure as hell should be.

 

[Shadow Wolf]

That's.... Illegal. Afaik.

Or at least it sure as hell should be.

It's Indiana and a judge. I do believe (though I'm not certain) it was overturned, because, yeah that one shouldn't even need explaining, but it happened.

 

[Sedim Haba]

FYI

 

[Heyo]

At least that's what it seems like from the purely monotheistic traditions.

Never met someone forcing me to be a Hindu, or Yoruba, or Pagan, or FSM follower.

It only ever comes from Christianity/Catholicism or Islam.

Edit: sometimes Baha'i. But usually their schtick is to just get you to agree that whatever God(s) you worship, is really there's as well.

It's systemic. If you believe there is only one god, it must be your god and all others must be false.

 

[Heyo]

Have religious freedom? Not according to some.

"On Saturday, July 16th 2022, the Witch’s Fest event held in Astor Place, New York City (NYC), was invaded by a group of evangelical Christians who clearly believed that their religion was the only one which should be followed."

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/holis...rce=WebPush&utm_campaign=Push_PAG_ChannelFeed

Also, something the GOP and conservatives, (maybe even the Originalists) should take note of:

"It is important to muse upon what Mr (Thomas) Jefferson had to say about the First Amendment:

“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof’, thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.”

It certainly appears that the original spirit of the First Amendment was that everyone should be free to engage in the religious practices that best suit them.

"The police were eventually called. The two who were dispatched spoke to the man with the megaphone, but eventually left, leaving the Christians to continue disrupting the event."

Someone should, just to see if the NY police might be hypocrites, interrupt a church service with a megaphone and see what happens.

 

[Guitar's Cry]

I've posted many times here about a judge in Indianapolis, back in the late 90s/early 00s, ordered a divorcing couple--both Wiccan and wanting to raise their children in such an environment--to not expose their children to "non-mainstream religions."
The only thing that has changed is they are now significantly more powerful.

I remember George W. Bush saying he didn't think a military veteran should get a pentacle on his gravestone because witchcraft isn't a religion, or some such nonsense.

 

[PureX]

Many Americans these days think freedom is a synonym for selfishness. To be free means being able to think do and say whatever one wants regardless of the consequences to anyone else. So if they don't like your religion, or your sexual orientation, or your politics, or whatever else, they are "free" to use the power of government to deny you the right to believe or express it. To, in effect, turn the government into a fascist state on their personal behalf. And they don't even see themselves doing it because they think they are "freedom loving Americans".

 

[lewisnotmiller]

I remember George W. Bush saying he didn't think a military veteran shouldn't get a pentacle on his gravestone because witchcraft isn't a religion, or some such nonsense.

Well, his dad said atheists shouldn't be citizens, so...the prejudiced apple doesn't fall far from the tree I guess.

 

[paradox]

Have religious freedom? Not according to some.

"On Saturday, July 16th 2022, the Witch’s Fest event held in Astor Place, New York City (NYC), was invaded by a group of evangelical Christians who clearly believed that their religion was the only one which should be followed."

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/holis...rce=WebPush&utm_campaign=Push_PAG_ChannelFeed

Also, something the GOP and conservatives, (maybe even the Originalists) should take note of:

"It is important to muse upon what Mr (Thomas) Jefferson had to say about the First Amendment:

“Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should ‘make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof’, thus building a wall of separation between Church & State. Adhering to this expression of the supreme will of the nation in behalf of the rights of conscience, I shall see with sincere satisfaction the progress of those sentiments which tend to restore to man all his natural rights, convinced he has no natural right in opposition to his social duties.”

It certainly appears that the original spirit of the First Amendment was that everyone should be free to engage in the religious practices that best suit them.

No because:
1) is not a religion
2) they practice black magic which can be used to do harm to others

 

[Guitar's Cry]

No because:
1) is not a religion
2) they practice black magic which can be used to do harm to others

We also eat babies and ride broomsticks to secret groves where we kiss Satan's anus.

At least we're having fun!

 

[Ashoka]

We also eat babies and ride broomsticks to secret groves where we kiss Satan's anus.

At least we're having fun!

Stop giving away our secrets to mortals

 

[paradox]

We also eat babies and ride broomsticks to secret groves where we kiss Satan's anus.

At least we're having fun!

You probably don't sacrifice babies but what makes you think some groups do not?

Stop giving away our secrets to mortals

You mean like spiritual pain secrets?

 

[ChristineM]

Should Pagans and Witches Have religious freedom?

Yes. But while right wing Abrahamic religion is doing what right wing Abrahamic religion has always done (impose their religious views on people of a whole country) then it ain't going to happen.

 

[Viker]

No because:
1) is not a religion
2) they practice black magic which can be used to do harm to others

1) I incorporate and view witchcraft integral to my religion. Just like a Christian may view baptism or the Eucharist as a part of their own.
2) Many conservative Christian groups are dominionists, a threat to others who don't comply... even like yourself.

 

[Link]

No because:
1) is not a religion
2) they practice black magic which can be used to do harm to others

This is not the case per Islam. Arabs in Mecca before Mohammad (s) worshiped Satan outwardly manifestly and were into dark arts, but God said on behalf of Mohammad (s):

"To you is your religion and to me is my religion" (Surah Kaffiroon)

The notion that people practicing magic should be killed is in hadiths but contradicts Quran.

The Quran and Sunnah, also shows believers will face attacks from Sorcerers but will in time build shields and weapons from God by connecting to the chosen lights.

There's no need to fear it, and it's part of the trial of the world.

Believers are guaranteed success on their enemies in this regard provided they rely on God and continue to worship him alone.

 

[paradox]

Arabs in Mecca before Mohammad (s) worshiped Satan outwardly manifestly and were into dark arts, but God said on behalf of Mohammad (s):

"To you is your religion and to me is my religion" (Surah Kaffiroon)

Interesting, are you saying God - Allah allows practicing of dark arts?