SKIP THE FACE MASKS! ....... Ummmm........ HANG ON! U-TURN?

[Samantha Rinne]

I don't wear face masks. I'll be happy to draw a diagram of why not.

But the short version is, when I wear a mask, I hyperventilate and start to panic. I mouth breathe and I'm allergic to dust, and all of those face masks seem to be made of that scrappy dusty tissue paper.

But I personally think that most face masks don't filter exhale air, they trap it. And they don't block incoming air, they filter it. So you're left with air that feels dry and dusty, and then you sneeze, and the whole mask is ruined because it's paper rather cloth and it doesn't dry properly and gets moldy.

Breathe in outside you get fresh air. Breathe out, and you exhale properly. No trapped air, no nothing. Some states are fining ppl for not wearing masks. But wearing a mask ought to be a choice. Instead, if you're afraid of people walk away from crowds.

 

[Samantha Rinne]

Asians often wear 'pollution masks', so masks are more common in general and there is less resistance to wearing them. If it helps with pollution then of course it helps with virus kind of thing.

Westerners have to get over the the fact that they feel like a bit of a wanker wearing one in public, and this is compounded by people saying 'you don't need to wear a mask unless you are ill'.

Obviously, however, a mask helps prevent spread and the 'no mask' brigade are, at best, criminally negligent.

US ppl wear dust masks for construction, which is a good way of putting them. They're not medical grade at all, and they're dusty. They're mainly for work on things like scraping paint of wood or working around smoke.

I'd rather inhale smoke.

 

[oldbadger]

I had it very mildly. Slight nagging dry cough for 48hrs, then a night of tossing and turning feeling feverish, with heart racing a bit. In the morning no real fever, but low grade fever (<38C) that afternoon and evening, plus a lot of muscular aches for 72hrs. I had to take paracetamol twice for upper back ache, not for fever at all (my brother, who is a doctor, had a similar experience).

The worst effect was to come, however: sudden and total loss of smell and taste, between lunchtime and dinnertime on the same day (day 4). Notably, this occurred in spite of having completely clear nose and sinuses. That was 12 days ago now. Some of my sense of taste and smell has come back, but a lot of what I eat still tastes like cotton wool, and I wake each morning with the sensation of having slept with an Arab's toe in my mouth - a weird and not specially pleasant pseudo-taste, which is detectable at intervals throughout the day. I think each day is a slight improvement on the one before, but it seems to be a long haul. I've briefly lost my sense of taste and smell before with 'flu', but never in this way. I'm just hoping I get it back eventually.

Thank you very much for that.
I think you should post up as a new thread for everybody to read, because it is likely the first real close up description of covid that we have seen.

And your brother, a doctor, is a fair decision maker about it, I have no doubt.

Thank you again. Please do think about sticking up a thread about that.

 

[oldbadger]

US ppl wear dust masks for construction, which is a good way of putting them. They're not medical grade at all, and they're dusty. They're mainly for work on things like scraping paint of wood or working around smoke.

I'd rather inhale smoke.

So why not use medical grade masks?

It's best to think positively and optimistically at this time.

 

[McBell]

The way that things are moving common sense wise, shops will be insisting that shoppers wear masks here.
Best you stay at home.

I do.
I only leave when I have to.
Mom has dialysis Mon, Tue, and Fri.
Can not miss that.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

Some states are fining ppl for not wearing masks. But wearing a mask ought to be a choice.

No matter how many people you endanger or otherwise negatively impact by irresponsible behavior.

Instead, if you're afraid of people walk away from crowds.

Instead, if you're afraid of acting responsibly in public, confine yourself to your private domain.

 

[Quagmire]

From todays New York Times:

Coronavirus Live Updates: C.D.C. Recommends Wearing Masks in Public, but Trump Says: ‘I’m Choosing Not to Do It’

 

[Revoltingest]

From todays New York Times:

Coronavirus Live Updates: C.D.C. Recommends Wearing Masks in Public, but Trump Says: ‘I’m Choosing Not to Do It’

Mrs Revolt plans to use a mask she made.
(We gave away most of the N95 ones I had.)
I'll skip the mask, but avoid close contact with my disease
ridden fellow humans (just in case I'm the diseased one).

 

[Milton Platt]

SKIP THE FACE MASKS! ....... Ummmm........ HANG ON! U-TURN?
Back in Febnruary and early March the standard response to face masks was that they are ineffective for the public. I expect that these ideas were born from Leader's comments such as 'Skip the face masks'. Here are just two examples of February and early March opinions about them..... these are not links:-
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Face masks won't help you avoid illness, so why wear them ...www.businessinsider.com › face-masks-wont-help-avoi..........................28 Feb 2020
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3 Mar 2020 - Medical experts explain why you should wash your hands instead of getting a face mask to protect against coronavirus. ...www.inquirer.com › health › coronavirus › face-masks...
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And so we have been watching the people of several Western countries out and about, mostly without face masks.................
...and now, in recent hours and days, we hear the the World Health Organisation is reviewing its advice about face masks. I snatched a couple of similar articles ......if you 'google' face masks you'll see a range of articles, I expect.
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MDH: Wearing homemade facemasks in public "Not a bad idea"
KARE11.com-3 hours ago
MDH: Wearing homemade facemasks in public "Not a bad idea". How masks could help and what you need to know if you want to make your own ...
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Trump backs Americans covering faces as task force debates ...
ABC News-14 hours ago
Trump backs Americans covering faces as task force debates mask ... "It's not a bad idea, at least for a period of time" to cover your face when ...
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QUESTION:-
Is this one reason why Western pandemic graphs differ significantly from Korean, where everybody wears face masks?

It is perfectly right that the guidelines should be updated when more and better data has been obtained.

 

[Augustus]

It is perfectly right that the guidelines should be updated when more and better data has been obtained.

While I agree that decisions shouldn't be judged with 20/20 hindsight bias, and that a 'wrong' decision can result from people doing the right thing according to available evidence available at the time of the decision, this situation really isn't one of them.

What is the 'better data' that wasn't previously available that makes it 'rational' to advise them now, but not weeks ago?

What we knew about masks was always sufficient for us to advise people to wear them as the default option. We should have be waiting for 'more and better data' that it was not beneficial to wear them, not the other way around.

 

[oldbadger]

I do.
I only leave when I have to.
Mom has dialysis Mon, Tue, and Fri.
Can not miss that.

So you can go out to shop on either of Weds, Thurs or Sats, eh?
And if you tend to another, maybe you should wear a face mask when going out...?
It's about your Mom, not you, surely?

 

[Mock Turtle]

Seems more a practical issue to me, as if the masks were available I would be using them. I'm saving the two I have for those special occasions - like if I have to have anyone in the house for any period or I need to be in the company of any more vulnerable than I am.

 

[oldbadger]

It is perfectly right that the guidelines should be updated when more and better data has been obtained.

You needed better data about wearing masks?
Do you think that great thought, data and medical intelligence went in to the 'Skip the masks' advice?

Let's look at some data:- Pick the infection rate graph for any western country. Now compare that graph with Korea's. Besides better testing and response by Korea, take a look at any Korean public area where there are people. They are all wearing masks and have been since the infection took hold in Korea.

This delay before the U Turn could be very costly for all western nations that did not support the wearing of face masks. People touch their faces involuntarily. No other data was needed.

 

[McBell]

So you can go out to shop on either of Weds, Thurs or Sats, eh?

as far as I can tell, here in my neck of the woods you can pretty much do whatever so long as you are not in big groups.

unless you are standing in line to get into a store (cough)walmart, menards(cough) because the store has decided to limit the number of people inside the store so they let you catch the Covid outside in line BEFORE going into the store...

And if you tend to another, maybe you should wear a face mask when going out...?
It's about your Mom, not you, surely?

I have three masks with me whenever I leave the house.
I do not put them on until such time as I am going to be around others.
In a store, gas station, at Davita cause the CDC says so,etc.
I do not wear it whilst driving cause it is so damn annoying

 

[Augustus]

Seems more a practical issue to me, as if the masks were available I would be using them. I'm saving the two I have for those special occasions - like if I have to have anyone in the house for any period or I need to be in the company of any more vulnerable than I am.

You can reuse them. Just leave for a few days between uses and any viruses will die off on their own.

Or make your own, vacuum cleaner bags might work quite well, then cover your face with a scarf layered with other. Obviously it's not ideal, but offers some protection.

Viral load on exposure matters too, and even poor protection can likely reduce this.

 

[oldbadger]

as far as I can tell, here in my neck of the woods you can pretty much do whatever so long as you are not in big groups.

unless you are standing in line to get into a store (cough)walmart, menards(cough) because the store has decided to limit the number of people inside the store so they let you catch the Covid outside in line BEFORE going into the store...


I have three masks with me whenever I leave the house.
I do not put them on until such time as I am going to be around others.
In a store, gas station, at Davita cause the CDC says so,etc.
I do not wear it whilst driving cause it is so damn annoying

Fair enough..... Good answers all.....

I went to prepay for electric, buy some petrol and collect weekly shopping this morning. The garage was closed because an employee had become ill. The supermarket started a 'No couples' rule this morning and so was only allowing one person out of any couple inside which was causing some friction, and I noticed that all checkout operators are now protected partially by large ABS screens........ no cash is accepted, only card-payments. But the local convenience store was still able to put some credit on my electric key.

I don't think that this will be over soon. Equatorial countries don't seem to be benefiting from higher temperatures. Yopu mention that you are out in the sticks....... apart from farmers and the very very wealthy everybody here is living within close communities. Our lock-down is very seriously kept.

Good luck to you and your Mom........ that is a big big responsibility for you at this time....... All the very best....

 

[stvdv]

I was a bit late ordering face mask. Got my pack from China 3 hours ago

For the time being, I had this one

View attachment 38451

What a coincidence. The mask I bought is the same as below one
(I do not believe in coincidence, so I take it as a hint, not to get Corona virus)
Corona patients can receive oxygen with this simple snorkel mask

 

[Mock Turtle]

You can reuse them. Just leave for a few days between uses and any viruses will die off on their own.

Or make your own, vacuum cleaner bags might work quite well, then cover your face with a scarf layered with other. Obviously it's not ideal, but offers some protection.

Viral load on exposure matters too, and even poor protection can likely reduce this.

True. It's a bit 50-50 as to what benefit I might get. Mostly I see it as not infecting others, and here I am at an advantage, only going shopping once or at most twice a week and not using public transport at all. Still use hand sanitiser and plenty of hand washing too. Haven't come across any in shops sneezing or coughing - must be the upmarket nature of such.

 

[Mock Turtle]

True. It's a bit 50-50 as to what benefit I might get. Mostly I see it as not infecting others, and here I am at an advantage, only going shopping once or at most twice a week and not using public transport at all. Still use hand sanitiser and plenty of hand washing too. Haven't come across any in shops sneezing or coughing - must be the upmarket nature of such.

Thinking a bit more on this - if I rotated, as suggested, and left them out exposed to the sun, I should get a minimum of a week for two visits out or two weeks for one visit a week, such that this would give a good chance for the virus to be gone from the surfaces. It still doesn't answer the problem of getting infected via the eyes or via touch, or the question of how do most actually get infected. If we knew that then we might have a better chance of targeting all the various vulnerabilities we have. Will probably start using the masks though since it will unlikely make me less safe and might be better for others too.

 

[Augustus]

Thinking a bit more on this - if I rotated, as suggested, and left them out exposed to the sun, I should get a minimum of a week for two visits out or two weeks for one visit a week, such that this would give a good chance for the virus to be gone from the surfaces. It still doesn't answer the problem of getting infected via the eyes or via touch, or the question of how do most actually get infected. If we knew that then we might have a better chance of targeting all the various vulnerabilities we have. Will probably start using the masks though since it will unlikely make me less safe and might be better for others too.

That's what I do. Have 4 KN95 masks and don't go out every day so they get well over 72 hours to 'recover'. Also, my thinking is that if the outside of the mask gets contaminated, that's stuff that would have been in my lungs otherwise (unless it's from my hands but I make sure I don't touch them). Might be worth covering your face with a scarf too though to stop yourself touching the mask and contaminating it that way. Can wash that every time you come home.

Could also wear sunglasses/glasses which offer some protection. Feel like a right dick wearing sunglasses indoors mind.

(I wonder how many people will die because they didn't want to look like a **** in a mask though? Must be some people at least )

Cashier sneezed when serving me today, I'm certainly glad I was wearing a mask (although not exactly glad she sneezed).