so many gods?

[SaintAugustine]

I have always been confused by the myraid listings of Gods, Avatars, etc.
Can you simplify for my western mind, how it works....

 

[Me Myself]

It´s like the three-nity, but there are more of them.

 

[SaintAugustine]

But in Trinitarian theology its all God, just different aspects of him.
Does the same apply to Hinduism?

 

[Me Myself]

But in Trinitarian theology its all God, just different aspects of him.
Does the same apply to Hinduism?

YES!

Different schools exist, like in christianity, but yes, it is a feature common in many (or most?) that all of the gods are the same god.

sometimes there is a discussion of who is the """ head""" or """ supreme"" (like in christianship, this place is generaly the father. Jesus said no one know when the day will come, not even me, only the father. So the "Father" in christian Godhead is the "leading" head more or less)

I personally like to revere Shiva, but I´ve revered Krishna Ganesha and others as well

 

[Madhuri]

I have always been confused by the myraid listings of Gods, Avatars, etc.
Can you simplify for my western mind, how it works....

To make it really simple:

There is one God.
This one God manifests or expands him/her/itself into many for various roles and can be known by many names.

The 'gods' are manifestations of particular energies of the One God.

 

[Madhuri]

It´s like the three-nity, but there are more of them.

Actually, not really. This trinity only relates to the material universe.

 

[Vinayaka]

I have always been confused by the myraid listings of Gods, Avatars, etc.
Can you simplify for my western mind, how it works....

The answers will vary because Hinduism is so vast. Its pretty hard to simplify it. That's like simplifying the United States by focusing on Cincinnati. Most believe in One Supreme though, with whichever version or name calls you the most being the 'choice'. The other Gods can be seen in a myriad of ways. One is aspects of the Supreme, which others have mentioned. Another is as Separate Gods, like helper Gods working under or for the Supreme one, something akin to archangels. Still others are angels or guardian spirits. That might apply to village gods, practically unknown of anywhere except in some small village. Still others have been 'invented' in later times as a way to unify former ones.

Avatars are when God Supreme embodies a human body and works on Earth for the betterment of mankind. Krishna and Rama are the two most notable examples. Others are disputed by scholars. Many Hindus don't believe in the avatar concept at all.

So an individual Hindu may have a simple answer for you, if you talk to several, it won't be simple at all. The simplest answer is just that "Everything is God" which Hindus believe one can come to understand in a non-intellectual mystical way, but that doesn't do much for practicality. Sure there is only one Earth too, but that doesn't help you navigate it.

 

[Me Myself]

Actually, not really. This trinity only relates to the material universe.

I am not sure I understand, may you elaborate?

 

[SaintAugustine]

The answers will vary because Hinduism is so vast. Its pretty hard to simplify it. That's like simplifying the United States by focusing on Cincinnati. Most believe in One Supreme though, with whichever version or name calls you the most being the 'choice'. The other Gods can be seen in a myriad of ways. One is aspects of the Supreme, which others have mentioned. Another is as Separate Gods, like helper Gods working under or for the Supreme one, something akin to archangels. Still others are angels or guardian spirits. That might apply to village gods, practically unknown of anywhere except in some small village. Still others have been 'invented' in later times as a way to unify former ones.

Avatars are when God Supreme embodies a human body and works on Earth for the betterment of mankind. Krishna and Rama are the two most notable examples. Others are disputed by scholars. Many Hindus don't believe in the avatar concept at all.

So an individual Hindu may have a simple answer for you, if you talk to several, it won't be simple at all. The simplest answer is just that "Everything is God" which Hindus believe one can come to understand in a non-intellectual mystical way, but that doesn't do much for practicality. Sure there is only one Earth too, but that doesn't help you navigate it.

Vinayaka, thank you!

 

[Madhuri]

I am not sure I understand, may you elaborate?

Ok first of all, I'm not even sure that Shaivite devotees believe in that trinity.
So I can only explain the Vaishnava teachings.

Srimad-Bhagavatam (2.6.42) “Maha-Vishnu (Karanadakashayi Vishnu) is the first incarnation of the Supreme Lord in the process of creating the material worlds. He is the master of eternal time, space, cause and effects, mind, elements, material ego, the modes of nature, senses, the universal form of the Lord (Garbhodakashayi Vishnu) and the sum total of all living beings, both moving and nonmoving.”

So first of all, there is Vishnu, Supreme Personality of Godhead.
Maha-Vishnu is an aspect of Vishnu. He 'consorts' with Mahamaya in order to create the material universes.
When this is completed, Maha-Vishnu expands himself as many times as there are new universes, entering each. Mahavishnu in these created universes is known as Garbhodaksayi Vishnu.

Brahma and Shiva (Sambhu) are 'born' of Garbhodaksayi Vishnu, in each universe. This means that there are many Brahmas and Shivas, one in each universe.

Thus, in each material universe there is a trinity (trimurti): Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva. Brahma takes responsibility for populating the universes. Vishnu is responsible for maintaining their existence and Shiva is responsible for the destruction of the universe. On a microcosmic level, they represent the birth, life and death of all things in the material universe.

This is an extremely summarised explanation. There is soooo much more to it. But I hope that makes some sense.

Mahavishnu (the round things are supposed to be individual universes):

Garbhodaksayi Vishnu (and the artist has depicted Brahma being born from the naval):

Trimurti (wives are included. To note, the females represent or are manifestations of the energy of the male):

 

[Me Myself]

Ok first of all, I'm not even sure that Shaivite devotees believe in that trinity.
So I can only explain the Vaishnava teachings.

Srimad-Bhagavatam (2.6.42) “Maha-Vishnu (Karanadakashayi Vishnu) is the first incarnation of the Supreme Lord in the process of creating the material worlds. He is the master of eternal time, space, cause and effects, mind, elements, material ego, the modes of nature, senses, the universal form of the Lord (Garbhodakashayi Vishnu) and the sum total of all living beings, both moving and nonmoving.”

So first of all, there is Vishnu, Supreme Personality of Godhead.
Maha-Vishnu is an aspect of Vishnu. He 'consorts' with Mahamaya in order to create the material universes.
When this is completed, Maha-Vishnu expands himself as many times as there are new universes, entering each. Mahavishnu in these created universes is known as Garbhodaksayi Vishnu.

Brahma and Shiva (Sambhu) are 'born' of Garbhodaksayi Vishnu, in each universe. This means that there are many Brahmas and Shivas, one in each universe.

Thus, in each material universe there is a trinity (trimurti): Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva. Brahma takes responsibility for populating the universes. Vishnu is responsible for maintaining their existence and Shiva is responsible for the destruction of the universe. On a microcosmic level, they represent the birth, life and death of all things in the material universe.

This is an extremely summarised explanation. There is soooo much more to it. But I hope that makes some sense.

Mahavishnu (the round things are supposed to be individual universes):

Garbhodaksayi Vishnu (and the artist has depicted Brahma being born from the naval):

Trimurti (wives are included. To note, the females represent or are manifestations of the energy of the male):

Lovely art!

But for what I understood of your explanation, then all is part of Vishnu, and Brahma and Shiva are seen in this explanations as forms of Vishnu, so.... wouldn´t it be similar? Same god, different aspects/manifestations?

Or is in this form Vishnu not the same as what creates his worlds?

 

[Madhuri]

Lovely art!

But for what I understood of your explanation, then all is part of Vishnu, and Brahma and Shiva are seen in this explanations as forms of Vishnu, so.... wouldn´t it be similar? Same god, different aspects/manifestations?

Or is in this form Vishnu not the same as what creates his worlds?

The trimurti only exists in the material worlds. And there are an infinite amount of trimurtis.
Even G-Vishnu is only an aspect of the original form of God.
So God, Vishnu or whatever one decides to call it, is so much more than the trimurti. The Lord in and as the material universes is just one aspect of his infinite Self.

So one cannot say that God is a trinity. It is more accurate to say that God is One and that God is an Infinity.

Also, my understanding of the Christian trinity concept is that the father, son and spirit all exist simultaneously as one but separate and on an eternal basis. Is that right?

The trimurti comes about through a process. It begins with Vishnu who then expands an aspect of himself. When this aspect is expanded, it manifests in a particular way. And then after the cycle of the universe ends, these manifestations retract back into the Whole/God.

 

[SaintAugustine]

The trimurti only exists in the material worlds. And there are an infinite amount of trimurtis.
Even G-Vishnu is only an aspect of the original form of God.
So God, Vishnu or whatever one decides to call it, is so much more than the trimurti. The Lord in and as the material universes is just one aspect of his infinite Self.

So one cannot say that God is a trinity. It is more accurate to say that God is One and that God is an Infinity.

Also, my understanding of the Christian trinity concept is that the father, son and spirit all exist simultaneously as one but separate and on an eternal basis. Is that right?

The trimurti comes about through a process. It begins with Vishnu who then expands an aspect of himself. When this aspect is expanded, it manifests in a particular way. And then after the cycle of the universe ends, these manifestations retract back into the Whole/God.

You pretty much got it on the Christian Trinity....but on the Hindu, can I say that Brahama is all gods and avatars...an expression of them..or would I mispeak. I love God is One and God is an Infinity by the way.

 

[Madhuri]

You pretty much got it on the Christian Trinity....but on the Hindu, can I say that Brahama is all gods and avatars...an expression of them..or would I mispeak. I love God is One and God is an Infinity by the way.

Depending on the branch of Hinduism, Brahman is either everything or an aspect of God.

Brahman is impersonal. Those who see Brahman as the Supreme believe that the personal forms come from it.

For those who believe that the personal form is the Supreme, Brahman represents the impersonal aspect of the Supreme; all-pervading consciousness.

 

[SaintAugustine]

Madhri, can you explain to me what and who are the characters in the second picture with Brahma being born from the naval.

 

[Madhuri]

Madhri, can you explain to me what and who are the characters in the second picture with Brahma being born from the naval.

The serpent is Ananta Shesha and the woman is Lakshmi, the female aspect of Vinshu (ie/ the energy aspect).

You can read more about Ananta here:

Shesha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Ananta is manifest often as the brother of God but is also a direct expansion of God.

 

[zenzero]

Friend SA,

Personal understanding:
There is that NOTHINGNESS which is labelled as Brahman. No problem and quite understood if someone uses another label for IT like God, Tao, etc.
This nothingness expanded and all that came out of it are parts of THAT and so have been all labelled as *gods*. Due to limitations of meditators only 33,00,000,000 gods have been developed each having different qualities.
But again kindly remember they are just images that comes from human imagination and are just representatives of THAT which is having no qualities or labelled BRAHMAN.
Man too is one of that which is an outcome of that expansion and the mind that man has is such that it is constantly active and so the realization of humans themselves as being part of THAT gets illusive. So early humans who stilled their mind reliased that it is the only task for each individual to still their minds doing which the realization of themselves being a part of THAT emerges and in the process human minds require constant reminders and whatever way such eminders can be brought around has been evolved through culture by those realised humans.
The role of *gods* are to act as reminders of THAT!

Love & rgds

 

[SaintAugustine]

Friend SA,

Personal understanding:
There is that NOTHINGNESS which is labelled as Brahman. No problem and quite understood if someone uses another label for IT like God, Tao, etc.
This nothingness expanded and all that came out of it are parts of THAT and so have been all labelled as *gods*. Due to limitations of meditators only 33,00,000,000 gods have been developed each having different qualities.
But again kindly remember they are just images that comes from human imagination and are just representatives of THAT which is having no qualities or labelled BRAHMAN.
Man too is one of that which is an outcome of that expansion and the mind that man has is such that it is constantly active and so the realization of humans themselves as being part of THAT gets illusive. So early humans who stilled their mind reliased that it is the only task for each individual to still their minds doing which the realization of themselves being a part of THAT emerges and in the process human minds require constant reminders and whatever way such eminders can be brought around has been evolved through culture by those realised humans.
The role of *gods* are to act as reminders of THAT!

Love & rgds

Thank you Zen...so all are like fingers point to Brahman..the ultimately reality or at least source of all reality.

 

[Me Myself]

Well, my perception is that all is a different aspect of God.

I personally, wouldn´t limit deities or even beings to only material representations and "the" God, because what I have learned which also includes energy managment (pranic healing, auras, etc) recognizes beings of pure energy, not necesarily materialized.

In any case, I agree with God being one and an infinity, and the he trascends all forms including any personality or name we attribute to him.

Maybe we are just juggling conceptualizations and words, maybe not, but blah, that´s my take

 

[Madhuri]

I personally, wouldn´t limit deities or even beings to only material representations and "the" God, because what I have learned which also includes energy managment (pranic healing, auras, etc) recognizes beings of pure energy, not necesarily materialized.

I'm not sure I understand this...
Could you elaborate?