Some Evidence for the Truth of Islam

[Rainbow Mage]

(1) The Scientific Miracles in the Holy Quran

Actually that isn't one. If it was I could also use that to prove that Pagan religions are true, since most of science and mathematics came from Pagans.

 

[OneThatGotAway]

(1) The Scientific Miracles in the Holy Quran
(2) The Great Challenge to Produce One Chapter Like the Chapters of the Holy Quran
(3) Biblical Prophecies on the Advent of Muhammad , the Prophet of Islam
(4) The Verses in the Quran That Mention Future Events Which Later Came to Pass
(5) Miracles Performed by the Prophet Muhammad
(6) The Simple Life of Muhammad
(7) The Phenomenal Growth of Islam

1. Where was the Holy Quran before Muhammad? What other books did Islam used?
2. What miracles were performed by other prophets before Muhammad?
3. What is so important about simple living of any prophet?
4. Would you say that Judaism and Christianity experienced a phenomenal growth?

 

[control.to.win]

The concept of Science in the Quran is that if it is truly the word of God, there can be no difference between the word of God and the action of God. Therefore, anything God reveals cannot be contrary to his action (the universe). Therefore, we can infer, that nothing in the Quran goes against science, i.e. something observable, measurable and reproducable in the universe.

The Holy Quran is a living book. It provides new evidences of it's divinity in every age. As man progresses, spiritually or in knowledge, the Qur'an is always there to provide guidance and fresh insights. So, when a man studies for years and uncovers new scientific truths, and then returns back to the Word of God, his faith is increased many fold when he realizes that Allah spoke of new discoveries the world is making now 1500 years ago.

So, the question is not why muslim's weren't rocket scientists in 7th century Arabia. Their own knowledge had not caught up to those hinted at in the Quran. It is if the Quran was false, why are there no scientific fallacies contained in it, no matter what age of Knowledge and science the Quran passes through?

 

[tmThEMaN]

Atheists do not believe in nothing. Some of us believe in many things. Just not gods, and in my case, nothing supernatural. That is not nothing.

And to be honest, I find that a belief in gods would be easier, especially on an emotional level. But it wouldn´t make sense to me. I guess what is easy to believe is different from person to person.

What i meant by nothing was in the context of religion and deity. Like you said, nothing beyond life in this universe, so nothing that exists and no one can see. You only believe in what you can see and therefore it is not really a believe, it is a fact if you can see. For example, i cannot say that i believe that the sea exists. Because it is a fact that it does and not a believe.

In some religions, it is very easy to believe in God and live life whichever way you want to and do anything your mind tells you to do. But in other religions believing alone is not enough, you need to work to earn God's acceptance and you need to give up a lot of what you desire.

Anyway, what i meant by easy was how easy it is not having to prove anything to anyone. Then call believers as anti-science and anti-logic. Atheists think they are the smartest and most brave while everyone else is a silly for believing in something that does not exist in what we know of the physical world.

It is very easy to be an atheist. To me it is like dropping school because the class is too difficult and it is more fun to spend school time playing than studying and preparing for the test (which does not exist for atheists).

 

[Kerr]

What i meant by nothing was in the context of religion and deity. Like you said, nothing beyond life in this universe, so nothing that exists and no one can see. You only believe in what you can see and therefore it is not really a believe, it is a fact if you can see. For example, i cannot say that i believe that the sea exists. Because it is a fact that it does and not a believe.

I believe that when we die we rot in the ground and that is it. In what way is that not a belief?

In some religions, it is very easy to believe in God and live life whichever way you want to and do anything your mind tells you to do. But in other religions believing alone is not enough, you need to work to earn God's acceptance and you need to give up a lot of what you desire.

Anyway, what i meant by easy was how easy it is not having to prove anything to anyone. Then call believers as anti-science and anti-logic. Atheists think they are the smartest and most brave while everyone else is a silly for believing in something that does not exist in what we know of the physical world.

I have a lot to prove, especially to myself. That we do not strive towards the acceptence of a deity doesn´t mean we don´t have anything to prove to anyone. Or do you mean on a purely religous level? Sometimes I have hard to understand what people mean, so if I am misunderstanding you just say so .

In any case, I guess that in my case I don´t have much to prove on a religious level because my interest in religion is more philosophical then anything else. But that is not about what is easy, it is about what makes sense to me .

And just so you know, we do not think that we are the smartest or the bravest or that everyone else is silly. Some do, but I think most of us know better then that.

It is very easy to be an atheist. To me it is like dropping school because the class is too difficult and it is more fun to spend school time playing than studying and preparing for the test (which does not exist for atheists).

Let me put it this way. I love people, and the thought of them dying, being gone, tears me up inside. Believing that they would go to a better place would be easier, because it would mean they wouldn´t go away, but would end up in a, well, better place. I like that thought. But I cannot ignore that it makes no sense to me when I think of it. Which is why from my perspective it is easier to believe in something more, in a god if you will, because it would bring comfort and perhaps even meaning. Instead I have a materialistic perspetive where there is no soul, no afterlife, no comfort. Life is pain. In what way is that easy?

 

[DeitySlayer]

Actually, tmThEMaN, the analogy, in my case at any rate, would be dropping out of school; but continuing to learn for the sake of knowledge. I do not believe there is an end goal or reward for good deeds; but they should be done regardless for the sake of humanity's progression and in the belief that all humans are equal.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

The concept of Science in the Quran is that if it is truly the word of God, there can be no difference between the word of God and the action of God. Therefore, anything God reveals cannot be contrary to his action (the universe). Therefore, we can infer, that nothing in the Quran goes against science, i.e. something observable, measurable and reproducable in the universe.

The Holy Quran is a living book. It provides new evidences of it's divinity in every age. As man progresses, spiritually or in knowledge, the Qur'an is always there to provide guidance and fresh insights. So, when a man studies for years and uncovers new scientific truths, and then returns back to the Word of God, his faith is increased many fold when he realizes that Allah spoke of new discoveries the world is making now 1500 years ago.

So, the question is not why muslim's weren't rocket scientists in 7th century Arabia. Their own knowledge had not caught up to those hinted at in the Quran. It is if the Quran was false, why are there no scientific fallacies contained in it, no matter what age of Knowledge and science the Quran passes through?

There are many scientific fallacies in the Quran. It's just that when they're recognized as fallacies, they're interpreted as "metaphor" or "poetry".

 

[control.to.win]

There are many scientific fallacies in the Quran. It's just that when they're recognized as fallacies, they're interpreted as "metaphor" or "poetry".

There are many things that were interpreted as metaphor before in the Quran that are now seen to be scientific truths. The fact of the matter is, if something is conclusively PROVEN by science, you will never see the Qur'an in contradiction to it. If it appears to be so, it invariably happens that something new is discovered later on that coincides with what the Qur'an said. The Qur'an is a book meant for all time and for all peoples. To encompass truths, especially scientific for then and for all future time, things can only be hinted at. Yet those same hints always astound people who realize this was written 1500 years ago.

I wonder what fallacies you are alluding to...otherwise, it's just an opinion....

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There are many things that were interpreted as metaphor before in the Quran that are now seen to be scientific truths. The fact of the matter is, if something is conclusively PROVEN by science, you will never see the Qur'an in contradiction to it. If it appears to be so, it invariably happens that something new is discovered later on that coincides with what the Qur'an said. The Qur'an is a book meant for all time and for all peoples. To encompass truths, especially scientific for then and for all future time, things can only be hinted at. Yet those same hints always astound people who realize this was written 1500 years ago.

So... some day, science will discover that the sun really does come to rest in a muddy spring every night (18:86)?

I wonder what fallacies you are alluding to...otherwise, it's just an opinion....

Besides the sun setting in a muddy spring thing, there's geocentrism, monogenism, the claim that hail comes from mountains (24:43), the claim that all reproduction is sexual (i.e. "in pairs" - 51:49), the claim that the moon was once split into two pieces (54:1)... etc., etc.

Now, please understand: I don't think that the Quran was ever intended to be a science textbook. But you have to realize that if you claim that the Quran is scientifically correct, then this cuts both ways.

 

[Islam432]

Very sly edit there, Thousand Suns.

However, I fail to see how either writing on a skin or palm leaf, or writing in a book, is more superior to the other. Written form = written form.

To be super-picky about this, the written book form of Galen's embryology teachings is MORE accurate and likely to be preserved; the multiple copies would corrobate each other and prevent a distorted copy entering circulation, as it would quickly be shown to be incorrect by the other copies. The Qur'an, however, if only written on a select few skins/leaves for 40 or so years, was highly suspectible to change and distortion.

And where is your historic proof??about Galen's writings

 

[Islam432]

The information in the Qur'an concerning embryology is not this detailed. Inarguable fact.



Ditto the Qur'an. Galen's writings were widely distributed. He was not a religious figure or leader of society, merely a scientist and philosopher. There would be no reason to change his writings to make them relevant to modern day science throughout the ages. People would merely have written new books.



Memorized form is much more unreliable than written words.



Galen's writings are approx. 1800 years old. You say a preservation period of this long is 'impossible'. Therefore, in 400 years or so, will the preservation of the Qur'an be 'impossible'?

I can give you tell you names of books written on embryology and Quran

And plz give us a credible source of Galen's writing

 

[McBell]

God does not need us,

Yes he does.
For it seems he is completely helpless when it comes to facts, truth, and empirical evidence.
But even more interesting is how theists claim that god doe snot want this or that, but leaves it up to his followers to force it down everyones throat.

we need God and it is not God's duty to make us believe,

Then it is not our fault if we do not believe in something for which the evidence for is severely lacking.

we have to look for God and believe in him.

You have to believe before you can believe?

That's our test.

*bites tongue*

 

[tmThEMaN]

Kerr

For a start, I appreciate your friendly discussion. Second, I do not mean to offend and I hope I'm not.

I believe that when we die we rot in the ground and that is it. In what way is that not a belief?

That's not a belief, it is the obvious conclusion unless you believe otherwise. Reincarnation is a believe for example. You believe in something that is beyond the obvious, or what you called supernatural.
For example, if we know there are aliens in space, then it is no longer a believe, it becomes a fact.

I have a lot to prove, especially to myself. That we do not strive towards the acceptence of a deity doesn´t mean we don´t have anything to prove to anyone. Or do you mean on a purely religous level? Sometimes I have hard to understand what people mean, so if I am misunderstanding you just say so .

As I said earlier, the first step is to believe that there is a creator. This can be observed by looking at the universe and its complexity and perfection. To me I cannot imagine that our human body alone could be this complex and it came out of nowhere. I do believe in Evolution when it comes to how the fish became a lizard and how Human beings evolved from living in caves to building skyscrapers. But I believe it is a lesson from the creator to teach us that we live in a very sophisticated creation based on laws and facts with a little mystery to keep us thinking a bit outside the box.

If you do not believe in the creator, then there's no religious believe to discuss. You refuse everything that cannot be physically proved and therefore no one can provide a proof that you would accept. The existence of the creator is only observed through his creation.

In any case, I guess that in my case I don´t have much to prove on a religious level because my interest in religion is more philosophical then anything else. But that is not about what is easy, it is about what makes sense to me .

I think it is good to keep your interest in religion philosophically and try to make sense out of religion. Not necessarily to embrace any religious concept. But at least to understand what drives people of religion and why they bother to believe.

And just so you know, we do not think that we are the smartest or the bravest or that everyone else is silly. Some do, but I think most of us know better then that.

I'm sorry for stereotyping atheists, but that was the impression most atheists gave me. However, I appreciate those who consider that the unknown is open for interpretations and does not have to make sense at the time. Example, the roundness of earth was unknown and open for interpretation, but it was considered not to make sense. History has taught us that whatever we don't 100% know already, can be anything we expect or don't expect.

Let me put it this way. I love people, and the thought of them dying, being gone, tears me up inside. Believing that they would go to a better place would be easier, because it would mean they wouldn´t go away, but would end up in a, well, better place. I like that thought. But I cannot ignore that it makes no sense to me when I think of it. Which is why from my perspective it is easier to believe in something more, in a god if you will, because it would bring comfort and perhaps even meaning.

It is of course comforting to believe that something good is waiting after death, but not all religions makes it easy and comforting. Islam for example requires a lot more than just believing. Unfortunately I'm too lazy and getting busy with life and missing a lot of my duties as a Muslim. If I die today, I will be punished for a lot of things that I did not follow properly. So it is not really a straight forward road to eternal happiness for most Muslims. Two things God does not forgive people about, one is not to solely worship God and to claim another God with him. And the second is the rights of other people who we hurt during our life (this only the person we hurt can forgive us for). This puts emotional pressure on a true Muslim to ensure that we do not falter in worshipping God and not to hurt others.

Instead I have a materialistic perspetive where there is no soul, no afterlife, no comfort. Life is pain. In what way is that easy?

If I was an atheist, I would not worry about the afterlife because it does not exist. I would simply try to make the most out of my life and make sure that I will be remembered as a good person. That looks pretty easy to me, no strings attached.

If you find that a problem, then why not get a long and just think that something better is waiting. It is not a fact that nothing will happen afterlife because no one knows for sure.

 

[yassin]

A book entitled Earth is a basic reference textbook in many universities around the world. One of its two authors is Professor Emeritus Frank Press. He was the Science Advisor to former US President Jimmy Carter, and for 12 years was the President of the National Academy of Sciences, Washington, DC. His book says that mountains have underlying roots. These roots are deeply embedded in the ground, thus, mountains have a shape like a peg.
This is how the Quran has described mountains.
God has said in the Quran:
Have We not made the earth as a bed, and the mountains as pegs? (Quran, 78:6-7)

Modern earth sciences have proven that mountains have deep roots under the surface of the ground (see figure 9) and that these roots can reach several times their elevations above the surface of the ground.2 So the most suitable word to describe mountains on the basis of this information is the word ‘peg,’ since most of a properly set peg is hidden under the surface of the ground. The history of science tells us that the theory of mountains having deep roots was introduced only in the latter half of the nineteenth century.

Mountains also play an important role in stabilizing the crust of the earth.4 They hinder the shaking of the earth.
God has said in the Quran:

And He has set firm mountains in the earth so that it would not shake with you... (Quran, 16:15)

Likewise, the modern theory of plate tectonics holds that mountains work as stabilizers for the earth. This knowledge about the role of mountains as stabilizers for the earth has just begun to be understood in the framework of plate tectonics since the late 1960’s.
Could anyone during the time of the Prophet Muhammad have known of the true shape of mountains? Could anyone imagine that the solid massive mountain which he sees before him actually extends deep into the earth and has a root, as scientists assert? A large number of books of geology, when discussing mountains, only describe that part which is above the surface of the earth. This is because these books were not written by specialists in geology. However, modern geology has confirmed the truth of the Quranic verses.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Mountains also play an important role in stabilizing the crust of the earth.4 They hinder the shaking of the earth.
God has said in the Quran:

And He has set firm mountains in the earth so that it would not shake with you... (Quran, 16:15)

Likewise, the modern theory of plate tectonics holds that mountains work as stabilizers for the earth. This knowledge about the role of mountains as stabilizers for the earth has just begun to be understood in the framework of plate tectonics since the late 1960’s.

This is just wrong. Mountains don't act as "stabilizers".

In fact, mountains are the result of tectonic activity... IOW, mountains are evidence that the earth shakes, not protection against earthquakes.

 

[McBell]

This is just wrong. Mountains don't act as "stabilizers".

In fact, mountains are the result of tectonic activity... IOW, mountains are evidence that the earth shakes, not protection against earthquakes.

them pesky facts....

 

[JohnAmes]

Islams foundations are the same foundations as christianity.
(if there is such a thing... "christos" means "meshja" or messiah in greek, from hebrew-aramaic)
Both islam and christianity are messianic religions, awaiting the judgement of the messiah.

 

[A Thousand Suns]

Islams foundations are the same foundations as christianity.
(if there is such a thing... "christos" means "meshja" or messiah in greek, from hebrew-aramaic)
Both islam and christianity are messianic religions, awaiting the judgement of the messiah.

Total nonsense

First Pillar of Islam is that there is no god but one Allah and Christians believe Jesus(pbuh) is the son of god

we can talk about the rest later

 

[Kerr]

For a start, I appreciate your friendly discussion. Second, I do not mean to offend and I hope I'm not.

Thanks. Don´t worry, I have not gotten offended. Sorry for the delayed response, btw.

That's not a belief, it is the obvious conclusion unless you believe otherwise. Reincarnation is a believe for example. You believe in something that is beyond the obvious, or what you called supernatural.
For example, if we know there are aliens in space, then it is no longer a believe, it becomes a fact.

I don´t know what happens after death, nor do I claim to know. That nothing will happen is just what makes sense to me. But that does not negate that it is a belief, since there is no way for me to actually know what happens. The only ones who do are the dead, and I have no wish to join their ranks just yet. Bottom line, I don´t know what happens after death, I believe nothing will happen, which is a belief, even if it is not a very religious or supernatural one.

As I said earlier, the first step is to believe that there is a creator. This can be observed by looking at the universe and its complexity and perfection. To me I cannot imagine that our human body alone could be this complex and it came out of nowhere. I do believe in Evolution when it comes to how the fish became a lizard and how Human beings evolved from living in caves to building skyscrapers. But I believe it is a lesson from the creator to teach us that we live in a very sophisticated creation based on laws and facts with a little mystery to keep us thinking a bit outside the box.

If you do not believe in the creator, then there's no religious believe to discuss. You refuse everything that cannot be physically proved and therefore no one can provide a proof that you would accept. The existence of the creator is only observed through his creation.

The universe is indeed very complex. But I personally do not think a creator is needed because it is complex, and I do not believe we come from nothing. Do not know what we come from, but what I would guess is that our existence is the result of natural processes.

I do not deny that I have a quite materialistic view on the world, in the sense that I do not believe in anything supernatural or, in lack of better words, anything "more". Would not underestimate the power of observation, though. None of us has been on a star yet we managed to figure out how to determine what they are made of. The man who first managed to figure out the size of the Earth did it with a stick, a well and a brain. He actually did a fairly good estimation.

I believe that if there is a God and we can observe him, even though indirect influence, then it is possible to prove his existence. But since I am a layman and not a scientist I would not be the best person to do that, nor am I that interested in it, because, as stated, my religious desire is more on a philosophical level then a desire to know if God exists or not.

I think it is good to keep your interest in religion philosophically and try to make sense out of religion. Not necessarily to embrace any religious concept. But at least to understand what drives people of religion and why they bother to believe.

This I agree with. Understanding is always important.

I'm sorry for stereotyping atheists, but that was the impression most atheists gave me. However, I appreciate those who consider that the unknown is open for interpretations and does not have to make sense at the time. Example, the roundness of earth was unknown and open for interpretation, but it was considered not to make sense. History has taught us that whatever we don't 100% know already, can be anything we expect or don't expect.

If that is your experience then I definately understand where you come from. My own experience is another, so maybe you just haven´t been that lucky .

History has taught us that even what we believe to be 100% right can be wrong. Unfortunately some people don´t realize that.

It is of course comforting to believe that something good is waiting after death, but not all religions makes it easy and comforting. Islam for example requires a lot more than just believing. Unfortunately I'm too lazy and getting busy with life and missing a lot of my duties as a Muslim. If I die today, I will be punished for a lot of things that I did not follow properly. So it is not really a straight forward road to eternal happiness for most Muslims. Two things God does not forgive people about, one is not to solely worship God and to claim another God with him. And the second is the rights of other people who we hurt during our life (this only the person we hurt can forgive us for). This puts emotional pressure on a true Muslim to ensure that we do not falter in worshipping God and not to hurt others.

I can understand what you mean. Just saying that my own beliefs do not come from what is easy. I have high moral standards myself that I try and live up to. Unfortunately my mind is chaotic in nature which makes it very hard to have self disciplin, but I am working on it.

If I was an atheist, I would not worry about the afterlife because it does not exist. I would simply try to make the most out of my life and make sure that I will be remembered as a good person. That looks pretty easy to me, no strings attached.

But that is not who I am. I don´t want to die. I don´t want that the people I care about to die. The best I can do is to make the best of the time I have, to cherish the time I have with the people that I care about. But that is not easy. I am far from a person without issues and I try to be a genuinly good person (as in I try to be a good person and not trying to be percieved as a good person). Life is not easy, no matter if you believe in God or not.

If you find that a problem, then why not get a long and just think that something better is waiting. It is not a fact that nothing will happen afterlife because no one knows for sure.

It wouldn´t be me to do that. One of the guidelines I try and live by is to be myself, and I could not make such a turn to comfort myself because I would regard it as self deception.

 

[England my lionheart]

A book entitled Earth is a basic reference textbook in many universities around the world. One of its two authors is Professor Emeritus Frank Press. He was the Science Advisor to former US President Jimmy Carter, and for 12 years was the President of the National Academy of Sciences, Washington, DC. His book says that mountains have underlying roots. These roots are deeply embedded in the ground, thus, mountains have a shape like a peg.
This is how the Quran has described mountains.
God has said in the Quran:
Have We not made the earth as a bed, and the mountains as pegs? (Quran, 78:6-7)

I am no Geologist and even i know that isn't true

Modern earth sciences have proven that mountains have deep roots under the surface of the ground (see figure 9) and that these roots can reach several times their elevations above the surface of the ground.2 So the most suitable word to describe mountains on the basis of this information is the word ‘peg,’ since most of a properly set peg is hidden under the surface of the ground. The history of science tells us that the theory of mountains having deep roots was introduced only in the latter half of the nineteenth century.

Mountains also play an important role in stabilizing the crust of the earth.4 They hinder the shaking of the earth.
God has said in the Quran:

And He has set firm mountains in the earth so that it would not shake with you... (Quran, 16:15)

Likewise, the modern theory of plate tectonics holds that mountains work as stabilizers for the earth. This knowledge about the role of mountains as stabilizers for the earth has just begun to be understood in the framework of plate tectonics since the late 1960’s.
Could anyone during the time of the Prophet Muhammad have known of the true shape of mountains? Could anyone imagine that the solid massive mountain which he sees before him actually extends deep into the earth and has a root, as scientists assert? A large number of books of geology, when discussing mountains, only describe that part which is above the surface of the earth. This is because these books were not written by specialists in geology. However, modern geology has confirmed the truth of the Quranic verses.

Where,please share the modern Geology that confirms this,thanks in advance