sovereignty of God + human free-will

[Eddi]

The mind of a person plans his way,
But the Lord directs his steps

(Proverbs 16:9 NASB)

I believe in the sovereignty of God, that God has a big plan for us and sometimes pre-ordains things to happen using his free will, so as to further his big plan

But I also believe in human free will, which we have on account of us being made in God's image

I believe it is possible for humans to confound God's wishes as well as that it is possible for God to act against human's wishes just as much as it is possible for one human's wishes to act against the wishes of another human

Basically, I believe in constrained agency - human free will constrained by the limits of Godly (and worldly) determinism

I believe that God has a plan, but that his plan is flexible and is always revised in light of what his humans get up to

Does this violate his omniscience? My instinct is to say no, because he can see all the possible choices any one of his humans may make...

I believe the butterfly effect is a factor in all this

However: who says God has to be omniscient??? Maybe he cannot fully comprehend the outcomes caused by human free will? Personally, I think he can tell what's going to happen in the next few minutes or seconds with 100% certainity, the next few days 98%, and the next few weeks 80% - that the further into the future the less sure he can be.

Does this mean that he cannot fully know the consequences of his own interventions? Maybe.

And I reckon he can exert mind-control over humans, to over-ride their free will and make them do his bidding

But at the end of the day, all we can do is sit about and speculate...

 

[LightofTruth]

But I also believe in human free will, which we have on account of us being made in God's image

I'm curious as to where you got that idea from.

 

[Eddi]

I'm curious as to where you got that idea from.

1) God has free will (self evident)
2) We humans are made in God's image (Genesis 1:27)

Conclusion: We humans have free will

I think that is what is meant by "created man in his own image" - that humans have agency as God has

 

[LightofTruth]

1) God has free will (self evident)
2) We humans are made in God's image (Genesis 1:27)

Conclusion: We humans have free will

I think that is what is meant by "created man in his own image" - that humans have agency as God has

Can you point to any Biblical text to support that idea?

 

[Samael_Khan]

Can you point to any Biblical text to support that idea?

Humans can make choices, therefore free will. Often times the Bible asks people to choose a path. If they didn't have free will then they couldn't choose anything.

 

[Eddi]

Can you point to any Biblical text to support that idea?

I don't need to as it can be demonstrated to be true on the basis of it being supported by two premises which are true - from which it follows logically

If you believe God has free will and that we are made in his image then it naturally follows that we too have free will, the argument is sound as it is both valid and true

As long as we are operating within the Christian paradigm anyway, of course an atheist may come along and say that the first premise is false as there is no God

It is a fact that can be discerned through human reason, which is a gift from God

God wants us to reason

Isaiah 1:18

For me (I don't know about you) faith has four elements that all interact with each other:

1. Scripture - God given
2. Reason - God given
3. Tradition - cultural
4. Experience - personal and God given

My faith regarding this matter rest primarily on scripture and reason

Although in our society we have a tradition of believing in free will, and I experience my life as though I have free will...

Edit: Proverbs 16:9 too!

Edit: Revelation 3:20 - we can chose not to let Jesus in when he knocks on our door, which would require free will

 

[PureX]

From a Taoists perspective, there is no contradiction between divine control and human free will. To put it in Christian terms; even when we choose to "defy God's will", we are still fulfilling God's will. We don't know this, of course, or understand how it is so. But we are not God, so it is not for us to know.

We are God's co-creators in that, through our free will, we are allowed to "create ourselves". But from God's perspective, who we will become as a result of our free will, and the choices we will make, is already determined.

 

[1213]

...Basically, I believe in constrained agency - human free will constrained by the limits of Godly (and worldly) determinism
...

I think free will means only that person can want freely what ever he wants. It does not mean that things also must go as person wants. This is why I think people have totally free will. And at least I have free will.