"Spanking babies is surprisingly common, U.S. study finds"

[LuisDantas]

Just to be clear; you haven't given us any reason to think your a scientist, so I have no reason to give your interpretations of science based statements any more consideration than if you were going on about early Renaissance art. So it isn't rejecting science, but rejecting your interpretation and use of it. And as an FYI, throwing around irrelevant psychological terms like "operant conditioning" doesn't impress.

He does have a point, though.

 

[Skwim]

He does have a point, though.

What point is that?

 

[LuisDantas]

Skinner's Behavioral Psychology is pretty well established, and it makes it very clear how positive punishment is counter-productive.

Pointing out that he is not a scientist or that his wording may sound odd does not really remove his point.

 

[Skwim]

Skinner's Behavioral Psychology is pretty well established, and it makes it very clear how positive punishment is counter-productive.

Pointing out that he is not a scientist or that his wording may sound odd does not really remove his point.

As indicated here, it depends. I also have to go along with psychologist Elizabeth Gershoff's observations on spanking as noted below.

"While positive punishment can be effective in some situations, B.F. Skinner noted that its use must be weighed against any potential negative effects. One of the best-known examples of positive punishment is spanking. Defined as striking a child across the buttocks with an open hand, this form of discipline is reportedly used by approximately 75 percent of parents in the United States.

Some researchers have suggested that mild, occasional spanking is not harmful, especially when used in conjunction with other forms of discipline. However, in one large meta-analysis of previous research, psychologist Elizabeth Gershoff found that spanking was associated [with] poor parent-child relationships as well as with increases in antisocial behavior, delinquency and aggressiveness. More recent studies that controlled for a variety of confounding variables also found similar results.
source
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My take on it is that, used judicially and in a good parent-child relationship, it does have merit, and is not counter-productive.

 

[Sunstone]

As indicated here, it depends. I also have to go along with psychologist Elizabeth Gershoff's observations on spanking as noted below.

"While positive punishment can be effective in some situations, B.F. Skinner noted that its use must be weighed against any potential negative effects. One of the best-known examples of positive punishment is spanking. Defined as striking a child across the buttocks with an open hand, this form of discipline is reportedly used by approximately 75 percent of parents in the United States.

Some researchers have suggested that mild, occasional spanking is not harmful, especially when used in conjunction with other forms of discipline. However, in one large meta-analysis of previous research, psychologist Elizabeth Gershoff found that spanking was associated [with] poor parent-child relationships as well as with increases in antisocial behavior, delinquency and aggressiveness. More recent studies that controlled for a variety of confounding variables also found similar results.
source
​

My take on it is that, used judicially and in a good parent-child relationship, it does have merit, and is not counter-productive.

So you disagree with Gershoff's findings?

 

[LuisDantas]

My take on it is that, used judicially and in a good parent-child relationship, it does have merit, and is not counter-productive.

And do you think that actually happens in reality?

I have yet to find any evidence, while there are boatloads challenging that view.

 

[beenie]

Spanking an infant is ridiculous; not only is it purely stupid but they have no idea why they are being swatted by the very person they trust the most.

Spanking an older child is ridiculous as well; if the argument is that they are old enough to understand what they've done, then why not use another method like... oh, I don't know... talking to them?? to explain it. Even when I child is being belligerent, there are certainly options.

Source: mom of 6.

 

[dust1n]

...does anyone else think it's a little weird the association between slapping a butt and discipline? What is that, exactly?

 

[Breathe]

...does anyone else think it's a little weird the association between slapping a butt and discipline? What is that, exactly?

Hm. Probably because it's not bony so is less dangerous than to strike in the face, ribs, etc, at a guess?

 

[LuisDantas]

...does anyone else think it's a little weird the association between slapping a butt and discipline? What is that, exactly?

An expression of the instinct of wanting to exercise control over the environment (in this case, children's behavior) by way of aggression?

 

[dawny0826]

And do you think that actually happens in reality?

I have yet to find any evidence, while there are boatloads challenging that view.

Father Heathen and I (as well as our siblings) were spanked as kids. None of us are depressed, aggressive or overtly anti-social people. We still maintain close relationships with our parents.

I have spanked my daughters very few times. My oldest daughter has no recollection of a spanking and to be honest, I can't recall a specific time that I spanked her.

My youngest daughter did get a spanking when she was told repeatedly to stop removing the plastic plugs from the electrical outlets and I caught her going toward an electrical outlet with a metal object. That behavior was dangerous and attempts to block off the outlets and keep them plugged wasn't working. I felt it important to strongly convey that what she was doing was wrong and dangerous.

Usually, we use positive and negative reinforcers to teach our kids. The removal of privileges typically works best. Time outs were a joke for my kids, though it's been effective for other kids that we know.

NEVER have I spanked my children without thoroughly explaining why I did so, reassuring them that my intentions were not to hurt them, but, to ensure that they were paying attention to the lesson at hand. If I'm seeing red because they are behaving like crazy monkeys, I give myself a time out. A spanking is out of the question if I'm frustrated.

My children and I are very close.

 

[dawny0826]

An expression of the instinct of wanting to exercise control over the environment (in this case, children's behavior) by way of aggression?

There's a problem if a parent is spanking in/our of aggression.

I can't relate to this. I also can't relate to the concept of wanting to control a child. Guiding and directing a child requires interference, instruction and sometimes dispipline.

This doesn't stem from a desire to control, at least not in my household.

 

[MysticSang'ha]

Spanking an infant is ridiculous; not only is it purely stupid but they have no idea why they are being swatted by the very person they trust the most.

Spanking an older child is ridiculous as well; if the argument is that they are old enough to understand what they've done, then why not use another method like... oh, I don't know... talking to them?? to explain it. Even when I child is being belligerent, there are certainly options.

Source: mom of 6.

I never found it to be an effective option in our household. Human beings, when needs are met (not wants), are capable of adapting well to their circumstances. We tend to get into trouble when we as parents confuse a child's wants with needs, and decide for them what it is they need and punish accordingly.

I once heard a parent suggest that it was necessary to verbally berate a child with insults (e.g. "You're such a ****ing *****") in order to prepare them for the real world. IOW, how would an overweight child cope with people calling them fat if the parents don't do it to them first?

Lovingly calling them a ****ing *****. There's a difference. Apparently. I dunno. I thought it was weird.

I disagree with the practice of parents choosing to inflict pain that is unnecessary in order to "teach a lesson". Life is full of lessons already. I've found they learn most through example from the parents. They may not express it (they don't have to), but it's why parents talk about how their kids are so much like them.

Spanking a baby....it's as ridiculous as berating a baby for not reciting the alphabet correctly.

 

[DeepShadow]

Father Heathen and I (as well as our siblings) were spanked as kids. None of us are depressed, aggressive or overtly anti-social people. We still maintain close relationships with our parents.

I'm very glad, but that proves nothing. You might as well say that you smoked and didn't get lung cancer. In the world of risk factors, the existence of people who dodged the risk is not as important as the population data.

My youngest daughter did get a spanking when she was told repeatedly to stop removing the plastic plugs from the electrical outlets and I caught her going toward an electrical outlet with a metal object. That behavior was dangerous and attempts to block off the outlets and keep them plugged wasn't working. I felt it important to strongly convey that what she was doing was wrong and dangerous.

It sounds like you were using spanking in a very limited way, which is good. I don't know about anyone else here, but I'm not equating all spanking with abuse.

Usually, we use positive and negative reinforcers to teach our kids. The removal of privileges typically works best. Time outs were a joke for my kids, though it's been effective for other kids that we know.

FWIW, removal of privileges and time out is considered negative punishment, not negative reinforcement. Common mistake. Negative reinforcement would be the removal of things they don't want, to encourage behavior. Removing curfew as a reward for good grades, for example.

NEVER have I spanked my children without thoroughly explaining why I did so, reassuring them that my intentions were not to hurt them, but, to ensure that they were paying attention to the lesson at hand. If I'm seeing red because they are behaving like crazy monkeys, I give myself a time out. A spanking is out of the question if I'm frustrated.

All signs of a responsible parent.