Spirit first?.......or substance first?

[stevevw]

all the way back to the beginning
that is where we start

From my understanding of the spirit it is best to refer to the bible considering this is where the spirit is mentioned. The spirit can have different meanings. As applied to God who is spiritual as in Genesis 1:2 "the spirit of God hovered over the waters" assuming that Gods spirit was around before those events. So the spirit came first. As to humans we have a spiritual dimension but this can be dead unless we are born again in the spirit of God. So there can be a material world before humans became spiritual. It can be summed up in John 1: 1 - 5 where the word was with God in the beginning and the word was God and everything that was made comes from the word. So the material world was made by the word of God which was immaterial and therefore the spirit came before the material. The word was Jesus and another verse later in the same book in John 1: 14 tells us that the word became flesh and dwelt amoung us. The word was immaterial and became material so the spiritual came before the material.

 

[sayak83]

all the way back to the beginning
that is where we start

Neither first. Brahman is first, both spirit and substance emerge from that. On equal footing and inseparable.

 

[Thief]

From my understanding of the spirit it is best to refer to the bible considering this is where the spirit is mentioned. The spirit can have different meanings. As applied to God who is spiritual as in Genesis 1:2 "the spirit of God hovered over the waters" assuming that Gods spirit was around before those events. So the spirit came first. As to humans we have a spiritual dimension but this can be dead unless we are born again in the spirit of God. So there can be a material world before humans became spiritual. It can be summed up in John 1: 1 - 5 where the word was with God in the beginning and the word was God and everything that was made comes from the word. So the material world was made by the word of God which was immaterial and therefore the spirit came before the material. The word was Jesus and another verse later in the same book in John 1: 14 tells us that the word became flesh and dwelt amoung us. The word was immaterial and became material so the spiritual came before the material.

I would say....

God is that Spirit, able to pronounce......I AM!
and the First to have done so

Someone had to be first

and I believe substance is the affirmation
a creation performed by that Spirit

I think we agree?

 

[Thief]

Neither first. Brahman is first, both spirit and substance emerge from that. On equal footing and inseparable.

to take hold of any inanimate object.....is to hold God in my hand?

 

[sayak83]

to take hold of any inanimate object.....is to hold God in my hand?

Yes.

 

[Thief]

Yes.

and we are not of the same perspective

you can know the Artist by His creation
but He is not His creation

 

[sayak83]

and we are not of the same perspective

you can know the Artist by His creation
but He is not His creation

I know we differ.
There is only one immense tree, some are leaves and another is the trunk.

 

[Thief]

I know we differ.
There is only one immense tree, some are leaves and another is the trunk.

so also....your spirit is God?

 

[sayak83]

so also....your spirit is God?

Yes. So is yours.

 

[Thief]

Yes. So is yours.

I cannot agree

I am not God

but in fairness of argument....it is written
....ye ARE gods...

 

[idav]

all the way back to the beginning
that is where we start

Neither.

 

[Thief]

Three questions:

• What beginning?
• How are we to understand "spirit" for the purposes of the question?
• How are we to understand "substance" for the purposes of the question?

and how are we to drag you through this discussion if you lack vocabulary

why not post a statement explaining a lack of beginning