Spiritual Alchemy vs the Hero's Journey?

[Jumi]

In alchemy there really isn't any evil. The only real evil from a human point of view would be suppression of developmental qualities.

 

[allfoak]

Hi

I've no idea whether this is the right place to post this, but I went to a study group recently on Harry Potter (the books by JK Rowling). I'm not a fan and haven't read the books, but a friend dragged me along.

In the group it was discussed about the theory that Harry was following an alchemical journey. Then someone mentioned the Hero's Journey. I'm reading up on it all, or trying to, and to me there's not much difference between the two?

To be honest it's all a bit over my head, especially looking at where the hero's journey comes from and then looking at Joseph Campbell and how he was influenced by Carl Jung, and I don't fully understand Carl Jung (as yet).....and then Carl Jung talks a lot about alchemy but I'm not sure what exactly, lol.

One bit that's bothering me which may be relevant here is that in Harry Potter, there is constant evil trying to harm him, I don't see how that plot fits an alchemical structure. The stages of alchemy that I've read about don't talk about some sort of evil or negative quality that has to be eradicated, that's external from self, only more 'leaden' aspects of self.

I've really value your views.. Thanks

Greetings
The practice of alchemy is, like all others a path to perfection.
This involves transformation.
Transformation involves change.
Transformation that leads to perfection can only occur within an environment of great contrast, a world of opposites.
In the case of alchemy transformation comes through purification which is necessary for the bringing together of the opposites.
The hero's journey is the same.
There is a purification that takes place usually through some tragedy that takes place in the life of the hero in order to bring together the opposites within one's self which enables the hero to make the journey.

 

[Rosanna]

Thanks Sunstone, I'm having my website re-done. I'm not technical and tend to remain anonymous on the net, but maybe after it's done, I'll get so me stuff shared. Good luck with your painting, I'm not that good, it's just that I'm in an artistic community and so my stuff gets seen and sold.

 

[Rosanna]

An spiritual alchemy tale would have a central theme of overcoming evil, as Harry Potter does, but that evil would be more internal rather than external.

Now there is somewhat of an alchemical tale there. Part of Voldemort's soul is bound to Harry himself, and that part manifests as Harry's own darker powers (his ability to speak with snakes, the Sorting Hat wanting him to be a Slytherin, etc.)

So one could argue it works, Harry, by confronting Voldemort, is also confronting the evil inside of him, as stereotypical of a cliche-Nazi brand of evil as it may be.

But, eh. The fact that the dark side of Harry is literally because of the soul of Magic Hitler kind of makes the analogy not work in my opinion. At the end of the day, the protagonist isn't confronting his own, inherent evil and overcoming it, he's fighting an external evil that was forced upon him.

The revelation that Harry's dark side wasn't his own, but was just a shard of Voldemort's soul, kind of ruined any alchemical metaphor it could have.

Thanks, this is interesting because I thought the Hero's Journey more clearly showed the need for overcoming evil than did a spiritual alchemy tale. But that's because I know nothing, this is all new to me....To me a spiritual alchemy tale would have been more about letting go of lesser (more leaden) aspects of self and then combining the rest etc to find refinement of the personality....I'm just not getting it....I know I'll have my aha moment, but it's not yet, lol.

So I'm really curious why a spiritual alchemical tale would have a central theme of overcoming evil.......or perhaps I am on the same page as you after all, because you're saying it's the external evil that's the problem, that is missing in the spiritual alchemical tale. The central theme of overcoming evil is about the internal evil of self.....it's just that I never saw it as evil. I saw it as just not very developed and so could create negative consequences. Or perhaps that's just that I'm not that dark myself, lol, but some people may have jealousy, etc, that is quite dark....

The thing about Voldemort being external to Harry I kind of don't mind, because it's a story....and Voldemort could maybe be a representation of the internal evil and struggle against it.....but if that's the case, then Voldemort is Harry and Harry killed his own parents therefore......and I know that's got to be wrong, that's just my simplistic brain again.....

And now you say Harry had a shard of Voldemort inside him, that I didn't know because as I say I've not read the books or found a decent summary of the whole set of stories yet.....so was Harry a Horcrux? Please excuse my ignorance of the whole thing, i do intend to read the books!

Thanks for your reply!

 

[Rosanna]

My theory is that we all know there is an "evil" and we would not buy the Harry Potter story without evil, therefore we should not believe in "sacred alchemy" or whatever it's called.

thanks for your reply, I don't believe it, I'm just curious about it for artistic reasons at the moment.

 

[Rosanna]

And other things. The warring houses, the magical brethren, etc, the book keeps foreshadowing that they must come together somehow and find a synthesis. But I think Rowling herself is too much of a pessimist to actually end the book on that happy of an ending. Harry Potter is post-modernist alchemy, and the magnum opus is only achieved in fleeting, fragmentary ways. Harry is at turns saved by each of the magical brethren and members of the four houses, for instance; he unites the deathly hallows, but then breaks them for fear of loss or abuse just as Flamel does with the Stone at the beginning. The Wizarding World is "saved", but you'd have to be naive to imagine that Voldemort is the last we'll see of magical fascism. It's too broken a world for alchemy to actually succeed. So Harry acts as a partial stone, but the quintessence is never reached.

Not unlike alchemy in the real world, in fact.

Wow, interesting! Thanks. I have often wondered whether Rowling is somewhat pessimistic and would be intrigued how an optimist would have written the stories.....but then too optimistic and there would have been no darkness I suppose. I admire her, I don't mean to criticise her in any way of course.

I hear what you're saying about post modernism, I expect there's a post modern version of a hero's journey as well. Do you know, is the 'quintessence' similar to what Jacob Boehme referred to when he spoke of 'the signature of all things?'

thanks for responding

 

[Rosanna]

In alchemy there really isn't any evil. The only real evil from a human point of view would be suppression of developmental qualities.

Thanks, yes that's how I saw it...

 

[Rosanna]

Greetings
Transformation that leads to perfection can only occur within an environment of great contrast, a world of opposites.
In the case of alchemy transformation comes through purification which is necessary for the bringing together of the opposites.
The hero's journey is the same.
There is a purification that takes place usually through some tragedy that takes place in the life of the hero in order to bring together the opposites within one's self which enables the hero to make the journey.

Thanks allfoak,

I can see the similarity there, but I've never really understood about the opposites. I know sometimes we all have conflicting parts of ourselves, we also have a male and female side that may be better if it came together, but in alchemy I see a big thing made of the 'Conjunction' and I don't really get it on a spiritual / personal development level. Are there really so many opposites? I've never fully understood the Conjunction stage of alchemy...

Thanks for your reply.

 

[Rosanna]

The evil is YOU, the parts of yourself that are repressed and manifesting into monsters/

thanks, I think I get that now...

 

[allfoak]

@Rosanna
Conjunction: Purification of Earth - AlchemyLab.com

 

[Rosanna]

Thanks allfoak! I'm going to read that now!

 

[Jean Valjean]

The modern chemistry is the follow-up to alchemy. If you brew alchohol you are involved with alchemy. Wine and other intoxicating drinks are all part of a natural chemical process - yeasting. Destilling is also a natural chemical process according to 90ies chemistry books. Erowid got tons of books on alchemy.