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Spirituality & Sexuality

Pleroma

philalethist
In tantric yoga there is a discipline known as tantric sex, an innocent sexual practice with the aim of preparing oneself quickly for spiritual realization.

It exists in Christianity too, The Bridal Chamber and the explicit teachings of Jesus of an occult sexual practice shows that there is indeed some connection between these two subjects.
 

metalnun

God Intoxicated
What are your views on the two?

Is there any link?

If so, what is it?

Due to the unfortunate and insidious influence of gnostic dualism, "spirit is good and flesh is evil" which has somehow become pervasive both in western and eastern religious traditions, spirituality has been divorced from sexuality, resulting in dysfunction, estrangement from each other and from God.

But, sexuality is an expression of the Divine nature. Even in the Judeochristian tradition, which takes a relatively dim view of sex, the creation story says, "Let us make man in our image... male and female created He them." And the sacrament of marriage is a picture of the intimate union between Christ and the church (although it is not often mentioned). In Hinduism we have Shiva and Shakti as the parents of the universe. The passionate love between Krishna and Radha expresses God's love for each individual soul. That union of yin-yang, masculine and feminine, is echoed throughout all of creation, down to the atomic level.

My teacher Mark Whitwell discusses this in his new book, "The Promise of Love, Sex and Intimacy." We can experience the Divine through the union of opposites in asana, pranayama, meditation and sacred sex.

As a tantrika I regard sexuality as sacred in the context of Love. God is Love, manifesting through each of us. Sexuality has a biological as well as a spiritual function. On the biological level, conventional sex is merely a release of tension which may result in reproduction. But the spiritual function of sex is the raising of kundalini and divine union.
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Metalnun, I appreciate the wisdom that shines through your post, and look forward to many more, btu I just want to note here that:

The passionate love between Krishna and Radha expresses God's love for each individual soul.

Is not entirely accurate.

The love between Krishna and the Gopis may be said to symbolize God's love for the individual soul, but Radha is not the individual soul but rather the Paramatman. All souls are her expansions.

More broadly, the gopis are the cosmic shaktis, whose corollaries are universal systems full of beings cast in the mould of the gopi.

I posted this sometime as a comment to an article analys=zing Shiva's love for Parvati as representing the universal / individual relationship:
In the article, the analysis of Parvati’s longing for Shiva and subsequent Tapasya was that it was an allegory for the soul's longing for God, equated Parvati with an individual soul, and Shiva as the totality of God. The author quoted a great Vishnaivite purana to this effect, not realizing that the statement by the author of this article was contradicted by the quote from the Shrimad Bhagavatam.

Vaishnavite cosmology is much less derivative of Samkhya. Shaivite cosmology is derived from Samkhya, yoga and tantra as well as things unique to Shaivism although Vaishnavism represents Vishnu as introducing Samkhya in one of his avataras (this is also in the Shrimad Bhagavatam.) Before I go further, I want to clarify that I am not in any way disparaging Vaishnavism, or the Shrimad Bhagavatam. However, the material in the Shrimad Bhagavatam, or the philosophy of Vaishnavism, cannot apply to Shaivism without a great deal of ‘translation.’


Purusha is the self as consciousness. Prakriti is nature, which generates (in biological life) limited faculties of consciousness in its form as maya.

Shiva, the whole beyond the sum of all consciousness, the supreme transcendent, projects itself into manifestation by garbing itself with nature - prakriti. When this projection occurs, it scatters like a spread of light, and appears to constitute many different individual souls (atmans, where the supersoul is paramatman). In Kashmir Shaivism, we call the individuated soul Anu, which is part of the trinity, the other members being Shakti and Shiva.

Individual souls are still purusha, not prakriti. It is anu (purusha) longing to return to shiva (purusha). This soul is neither male nor female. Shiva is neither male nor female. Absolute transcendence is not confined to any particular pattern of experience, not confined to any particular duality, not even the primordial duality of maleness or femaleness.

Shiva is culturally represented as (static) male, and is unique in having an aniconic representation (the lingam), which despite the efforts of some Indian philosophers to disprove, is indeed a sexual symbol, but /not/ a primitive fertility symbol. To understand the lingam requires the seeker of truth to go far beyond culturally conditioned sexual mentalities. That is a subject for another time. Shakti (which includes prakriti), is represented as dynamic female, aniconically through the yoni, almost always depicted conjoined with the linga.

However Shakti has both male and female forms, as well as dynamic and static forms. These nuances are under-appreciated. It is prakriti which generates both male and female qualities and existences, like mirrors of eachother.

And who is to say what exactly defines male and female? We can provisionally define them based on conditioned observations of conditioned phenomena, but maleness and femaleness are open to so much differentiation over time, over place, over consciousness. The original maleness and femaleness is bhedabheda (two in one, dual yet nondual). No secondary descriptors apply to this primordial male (provisionally Shiva) or primordial female (provisionally Shakti). Not strong or weak. Not consciousness and nature. Not knower and known. Not subject and object. Not dynamic and static. Not foreground and background. Not even penetrating and receiving.

Shiva has both transcendent and imminent existences (and non-existences!) Shiva also pervades, and constitutes gross matter/form (where shakti here represents name in the namarupa duality). All physical manifestation is Shiva. Shiva is the gross(vyakta) and Shakti is the subtle (avyakta).

Shakti has both transcendent and imminent existences (and non existences!) Shakti is also pure satchitananda, the blissful absolute truth of consciousness, transcending even the Shiva tattva as Paramashakti with Paramashiva (the atattva beyond the 36 tattvas)


To return to the author’s analysis, the story can indeed be used as an allegory for the efforts of the individual soul to merge into its source, its sustenance, and its final end (even though it has never actually been separate save in illusion!), but that is not who Parvati is.

Parvati is Paradevi, Parashakti incarnate. She is as much Shiva as Shiva is. She is the ‘half yet whole’ of Supreme God. All individual souls are her manifestations/expansions. Shiva is the husband of all beings (who are the Shaktis of God(Shiva)). Even as Shakti is the wife of all beings (who are the Shivas of a Goddess(Shakti)). Our maleness is Shiva’s, as the one primordial male. Our femaleness is Shakti’s, as the one primordial female.

Yet they are many.

Shiva is consciousness. Shakti is conscious of consciousness.
Shakti is consciousness. Shiva is conscious of consciousness.

One is the object to the other. One is the subject of the other. They are not different, nor are they the same. We cannot say what they are. One is the attributes of the attributeless other. Both equally partake of, and participate in all of these dualistic pastimes, yet are not defined by them, nor confined by them.

To transcend our individual souls, to discover our true selves (soul and self are not the same! Atman is soul, AHAM is self. The true self is universal, and is *also* the whole) we must ourselves become Shiva and Shakti (which we actually already are, but we fail to realize and experience this.) In this way Parvati’s puranic story is excellent inspiration.

One cannot be truly Shiva without being Shakti as well. Or vice versa.

Jiva, the embodied soul, is Shiva from one view. Jiva is a Shakti of God (Shiva) from another view. Both are correct. Both are correct on the same levels, and in different levels.

For example, the embodiment part wherein all manifestation is seen as female prakriti. Yet it is also seen as male Shiva. Both are true.

The soul part, where all souls are seen as Shaktis of God. Or as Purushas(Shiva) inhabiting maya-prakriti(shakti). Both are true.


One commentator stated “Parvati does not understand the essence of Shiva and Shiva does not understand the essence of Parvati. That is the truth. So how do these two get together?”

Nothing could be further from the truth. Not even Shiva understands himself the way Shakti encompasses his shear reality with her absolute consciousness. Not even Shakti understands herself the way Shiva penetrates the depths of her shear reality with his absolute consciousness.

It is in error to ‘think of God’ in a conceptual manner, but we may indulge for the purpose of explication with the caveat that any conception we conjure up is terribly limited, and must be discarded and gone beyond once understood.

Shiva and Shatki are two mirrors exactly parallel to one another, extending infinitely in uncountable dimensions, infinitely reflecting eachother, savoring eachother’s light eternally. No measure of inequality, of differentiation can exist here. We cannot typecast Shakti as representing mortal souls entrapped in samsara seeking the supreme, and we cannot typecast Shiva as only the supreme, and not the former.

Do not make the error of duality when considering the supreme union. We can provisionally consider individuated jivatmans to be male or female in relation to God, assigning the opposite gender to God, to facilitate union. It is beneficial for men to cultivate the feeling of being female for a male God, as this subdues the male ego and facilitates union with, and merger into, the true maleness, but to believe this as a set reality is incorrect. One must also realize God as Female, and oneself as limited/individual-male. Krishna, whom men surrender to as female gopis, is also Kali, who is surrendered to as male. Yes, Krishna is Kali.

Volumes more can be said about the exquisite duality-yet-nonduality of Shiva and Shakti, in all its infinite manifestations and splendors, but what use are words in describing that which cannot be thought, or thought of, let alone spoken of? I wish only to correct misunderstandings here.

I want to be clear that I am not disparaging the work put into the article, or some of the comments. It is appreciated. However, seeing errors or partial truths, I am required to offer corrections and expansions.


Would you mind expanding on your tantrik views and theory/practice?
 

Parsifal

Member
Hi, Iridescence. Re the "Bhava Police", you said:

It comes across so much like a religious head-game designed to keep adherents feeling off balance and unsure of God's love for them.

You know that I've expressed empathy with a lot of the things you've said and the spiritual transformation you've gone through, but I don't share your indignation. I feel that there are enough truly sinister reality police in the world without imputing such motives to imperfect but sincere (and sometimes enlightened) spiritual & religious teachers.
:bright:
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Then perhaps you haven't been acquainted with ISKcon, whose leaders are anything but sincere and enlightened.

There is an incredible amount of manipulation, group think and regurgitation of dogma.
 
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You know that I've expressed empathy with a lot of the things you've said and the spiritual transformation you've gone through, but I don't share your indignation. I feel that there are enough truly sinister reality police in the world without imputing such motives to imperfect but sincere (and sometimes enlightened) spiritual & religious teachers.
Then perhaps you haven't been acquainted with ISKcon, whose leaders are anything but sincere and enlightened.


There is an incredible amount of manipulation, group think and regurgitation of dogma.

Exactly... Not everyone has been burned by manipulation, group-think and dogma, so it's understandable that not everyone will share my indignation. I learned the hard way not to elevate so-called spiritual/religious leaders, which has been shown to result in a lot of heartache, and if I sense that something's not right, I will say as much.




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I would go so far as to call it systemic spiritual rape, as in the Church.
It can get pretty rough, for sure. I have noticed the similarities with the scandals between ISKCON and the Catholic Church, and the irony is that both organizations try to snuff out healthy, natural human sexuality in various ways. I suspect that's why said sexuality then manifests in the unhealthy ways that it has.

And it's not that I don't realize that these folks are human too -- they are, and have their own battles and struggles to get through, but when they're part of any organization that holds itself up as a pillar of morality to which everyone must bow, that just makes it even more irksome, to say the least.


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Parsifal

Member
Purusha is the self as consciousness. Prakriti is nature, which generates (in biological life) limited faculties of consciousness in its form as maya.
Shiva, the whole beyond the sum of all consciousness, the supreme transcendent, projects itself into manifestation by garbing itself with nature - prakriti.

I'm developing a cosmology/theology that hopefully can be understood by a popular audience, not just scholars. Many of your posts are very helpful for my understanding and my project. Here you explained the distinction between Shiva and Purusha in a clear way. So how do you characterize the supreme consciousness present in all sentient beings, whether or not the individual beings are aware of it? Is this Purusha?

philosophy of Vaishnavism, cannot apply to Shaivism without a great deal of ‘translation.’

This is something I've wondered about. My project begins with cosmogenesis, the origin and meta-evolution of the universe from the absolute nondual reality which you describe in great detail and give the name Shiva. I've found the Shiva-Shakti philosophy to contain the best information about cosmogenesis. My question to you is: does Vaishnavism also have an explanation of these matters? If so, how is different from Shaivism?

The original maleness and femaleness is bhedabheda (two in one, dual yet nondual). No secondary descriptors apply to this primordial male (provisionally Shiva) or primordial female (provisionally Shakti).

Hinduism has many Gods and Goddesses to whom the secondary attributes of Father and Mother would apply. Which would be best to characterize as the ultimate Father God and Mother Goddess, in terms of cosmogenesis? Perhaps the right question is: which were the earliest or most basic Godforms which acquired the characteristics of male and female that resonate with us in human terms?
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Parsifal, I would like to suggest to you Jnaneshvar's "Amritanubhav" as the best text I know of to simply and beautifully explain that.

In the Vedas, we have Vak/Gayatri/Aditi & Purusha/Narayana/Hiranyagarbha, but ithyphallic representations of Shiva are attested to before the writing of the Vedas (which were first oral for a very long time)
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Puranic accounts of cosmogenesis are similar across the sects, the procession from mahat tattva through the material sheathes/bhutas, forming the brahmanda - cosmic egg (hiranyagarbha), and its constituent lokas (planes of existence).
 

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
What are your views on the two?

Is there any link?

If so, what is it?
I would take out the word spirituality and use psychology, but both work for me. No one ever said that sexuality needs to be summed up with the missionary position.
While texts such as the Kama Sutra are largely not practical for the modern reader, they do attest to the layers and dimensions that sexuality can be explored.
Tantric positions, movements or rhythms can open new worlds for couples, a little bit of exploring sex shops in the right urban locations can inspire the break of orthodox thought, and bring the understanding that not everything in the bedroom should be politically correct.

I would also encourage people to research sexual trends in various cultures, to understand taboos, or how to break them. historical individuals such as Richard Burton are fascinating in that they show us that even in the most reserved times, sexual expressions which go far beyond what is accepted were in existence.
 

Pleroma

philalethist
Shuddhasattva,

Even though there are parallels between the Christianity like the way Sophia going back into the arms of Jesus and in Hinduism about prakriti and purusha uniting together it should be taken in a allegorical way. I know there are explicit teachings of physical innocent sexual practice but I don't think that's the highest form of philosophical thought.

Why do you want to have an innocent sexual practice when you can directly worship the Father and achieve liberation. Such acts of innocent sexual practice to have a desire to quickly get liberated from this world sounds like the Gnostics were highly influenced by elements of Buddhism.
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
So I take it that you don't wish to answer in genuine honesty as it might deprive you of consuming a commodified, heavily debased and reinterpreted derivative of Indian thought without acknowledging the intellectual dishonesty in doing so?

I would think an archaeologist would know better than cultural misappropriation, but... :/
 

Caladan

Agnostic Pantheist
So I take it that you don't wish to answer in genuine honesty as it might deprive you of consuming a commodified, heavily debased and reinterpreted derivative of Indian thought without acknowledging the intellectual dishonesty in doing so?

I would think an archaeologist would know better than cultural misappropriation, but... :/
That's quite the case of South Asian inferiority complex you got there, either that or a severe case of South Asian centrism. Which ever it is Good luck with that. Fortunately today, people don't need to travel back in time to historical Indian eras in order to enhance their sex life. In fact it seems that the developed world is succeeding today where a much more conservative Indian culture is failing, whether they are doing it on the basis of native Indian historical thought or if they are reinventing the wheel is quite irrelevant.
 
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