Stop talking trash about the hood/inner city.

[jeager106]

We try not to dis posters in 3rd person.
Life is more difficult for some.

O.K. I get it.
Thanks.

 

[vaguelyhumanoid]

They're smack talking the people who perpetuate modern ghetto culture and refuse to use correct grammar even in serious situations

This is one of my absolute pet peeves. When people complain about "incorrect grammar", they're trying to portray others as less intelligent but actually showing their own ignorance of the science of linguistics. Objectively, no English dialect is more or less correct than any other when spoken fluently. When people say "correctness", what they usually mean is prestige. The standardized form of a language typically has the most prestige, with dialects spoken among the lower class having the least - the implication of this is not coincidental. African American Vernacular English is one of the most frequently put-down dialects of the English language, yet it is in certain aspects more grammatically complex than standard English. (note that not all black people speak AAVE, and there are AAVE speakers of other races. Also, many AAVE speakers code-switch between it and General American depending on social context.)

 

[lovesong]

This is one of my absolute pet peeves. When people complain about "incorrect grammar", they're trying to portray others as less intelligent but actually showing their own ignorance of the science of linguistics. Objectively, no English dialect is more or less correct than any other when spoken fluently. When people say "correctness", what they usually mean is prestige. The standardized form of a language typically has the most prestige, with dialects spoken among the lower class having the least - the implication of this is not coincidental. African American Vernacular English is one of the most frequently put-down dialects of the English language, yet it is in certain aspects more grammatically complex than standard English. (note that not all black people speak AAVE, and there are AAVE speakers of other races. Also, many AAVE speakers code-switch between it and General American depending on social context.)

I have no problem with vernacular dialects in their own social contexts. They can be a fascinating aspect of local cultures. I was only referring to those (black, white, Hispanic, or otherwise) who refuse to shift to standardized English when it is expected. Examples are school papers, court, work interviews, and around authority figures. These are situations where vernacular or slang of any kind is inappropriate. Just as I would be looked down upon for using text slang in an email to a professor, government official, or boss, people are similarly looked down upon when using vernacular language in situations like the ones I mentioned that require more standardized language.

 

[vaguelyhumanoid]

I have no problem with vernacular dialects in their own social contexts. They can be a fascinating aspect of local cultures. I was only referring to those (black, white, Hispanic, or otherwise) who refuse to shift to standardized English when it is expected. Examples are school papers, court, work interviews, and around authority figures. These are situations where vernacular or slang of any kind is inappropriate. Just as I would be looked down upon for using text slang in an email to a professor, government official, or boss, people are similarly looked down upon when using vernacular language in situations like the ones I mentioned that require more standardized language.

OK, that's more reasonable then, but still not anything I'd get particularly hung up on myself. Sadly most people I hear from who talk a lot about "correct grammar" etc are very pretentious and elitist about it.

 

[MD]

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Yay, West Coast, baby!

Personally, I'm partial to Ice Cube:

 

[Maponos]

I live in a city that is very 'hood' and is known for its high crime rate and is predominantly African American. I see how they live their lives with drugs, gang violence, massive amounts of illegitimate children and I don't have one ounce of pity for them. They also glorify this way of life, so how can it be possible to find anything redeemable about their communities?

I come from an even poorer place in rural Kentucky and my family was strong enough to rise above their humble origins, so when I see people living in squalor and only complaining about it, I have no pity for them at all.

 

[Brickjectivity]

Since inner cities have always been problem areas, I think we can say that cities are the biggest cause of inner city problems. I don't think rural problem areas are comparable although the suffering may be similar. Cities have a long history of totally sucking. They sucked in Roman times, Greek times, Chinese dynasties, ...pretty much always. They've always sucked for most people.

 

[Acim]

Yes, we have a high murder rate, drugs, homelessless, much of the area looks like Detroit and so on. This is a working class and poor area. Most of the people who live here are working class people with families. Mother and fathers with kids. There's white people, black people, Mexicans, immigrants, etc. The vast majority of people do work and do their best to make it. Most people are very friendly, as well. There's not the false air of superiority you get with the people from the well-to-do suburbs, who view you as trash and look down their noses at you.

This is one of 2 paragraphs that stood out for me. The "yes, we have high murder rate, drugs, homelessness and so on" part does not make it sound like a welcoming place. It is routinely perceived as an unsafe place. For those not prone to conform to whatever are the current social norms in such a place, it seems dangerous to live there and even to pass through. Doesn't help seeing videos, during riots, whereby African Americans (albeit a very tiny minority) are yelling, stop the cars with white people so we can beat them up. This being said most recently after an African American officer shot/killed an armed African American youth. Thus, not really remotely any justification for such a sentiment. If non-black person said this in I think any other context about African Americans, there would be zero doubt about it as racism. In this context, it gets to slide on by as "frustration."

Yes, there's a mixture of working class/good natured poor people who are mixed in with whatever negative elements we are allowed to identify today in inner cities, without coming off as being inherently racists for saying that aloud. I fully believe that if actual dialogue, beyond sound bites, were occurring, that everyone in America that is also good natured would seek to make life as best as possible for these working people/good natured poor people.

But right about now, the solutions for that (making life as best as possible for good natured people living in these areas) are not readily known. If coming from what is perceived, even a little bit, as non-African American politicians, it is seemingly judged as systemic racism, meant to keep all people living there down, and trodden. Somehow, magically, voting for more white Dems is seen as helpful for the area, even while the evidence in I believe all inner city areas in America has not shown that to be helpful. The perception is clearly that voting for an African American Republican has to be much worse for those people than voting for a white Dem.

The "false air of superiority" from people living in well-to-do suburbs strikes me as viable, but I truly think it is on par, in numbers, with the negative element within the hood. Meaning, painting that with a broad strokes strikes me as (equally) unfair as suggesting all people in inner city are negative elements, always up to no good. Any sensible person, being honest, would see that it really is a small minority in both places.

It doesn't help that the city is gentrifying areas for the yuppies, the cost of living keeps rising while wages have stagnated, the healthcare system is broken and underfunded, and so many more people are falling into poverty. So give us a break.

If gentrifying is unhelpful, then literally the ideas for solutions gets lower and lower. Gentrifying meaning: renovate and improve (especially a house or district) so that it conforms to middle-class taste.

Where I live, there are portions of inner city where houses are very beautiful. In my life, I've not known those areas to be anything but 'the hood.' But I can imagine before that perception, there was a time (I'm guessing about 100 years ago) where those houses are same places where the most wealthy in the city lived. Take these same houses, put them in the best area in the region, and I feel confident, they'd sell at $500K at least, if not $1 million. But because they are in 'da hood,' they might go as high as $200K in asking price. Depending on circumstances around time of selling, a buyer could possibly get that property/house for $20K.

If renovating and improving an area, so it conforms to middle-class taste, is seen as "unhelpful," then it would be nice to see what is truly seen as helpful.

Given the overwhelming amount of evidence (though not readily found in academic type resources) to "keep it real," the idea of what is helpful and not helpful shows up almost exactly backwards. If there were say a policy to renovate and improve an area - I think everyone would see that as helpful. So, it's gotta be the "middle-class tastes" that is seen as "not keeping it real." And arguably has to be seen as far worse to conform the renovation to "well-to-do" tastes (i.e. rich folks' taste). Therefore, it has to be renovating to conform to, at most, lower middle-class" tastes, and how that is all decided so that it isn't seen as attracting the wrong (snooty) crowd, is anyone's guess. Would be hard to imagine, though I don't think entirely far-fetched to think it means renovating to conform to poor-class tastes.

In essence though, is that not what precisely we are talking about? That all improvements in inner cities ought to conform to whatever poor-class finds acceptable, and not offensive? Seeing that middle-class and well-to-do tastes are seen as unhelpful, likely arrogant in their aims to help poor class.

 

[GoodbyeDave]

Since inner cities have always been problem areas, I think we can say that cities are the biggest cause of inner city problems.

Well, no. In Europe, inner cities are not problem areas. When we had riots in London a couple of years ago, they were in the suburbs, as they are when they have them in Paris.

Problem areas are areas inhabited by problem people. This is partly cultural, and partly induced by bad government. Unemployment is the USA is lower than in the EU (although not than in the UK) but the percentage of the working poor is very high and the level of education (according to Uesco) is low.

 

[Kapalika]

If they were to extract all of the blood from your heart through that gaping hole, the world would have enough of whatever blood type you are to last for years.

What the hell is wrong with you?I would of thought as a Satanist you would appreciate that many in that kind of environment or situation would be striving to make the best of it or aim for something higher. The kind of generalizations that the OP is addressing are not based on individual merit but by guilty by association mindsets.

St. Frankenstein put me on "ignore" because I didn't have sympathy for his
obvious "feel sorry for me" post.

I'm so sad, feel bad, not glad.
I've never used the ignore feature. I rather enjoy reading members opinions especially
when filled with self loathing.

Or maybe it's because you see things through such a narrow lens and don't even view an entire group of people as human but make a caricature.

Since inner cities have always been problem areas, I think we can say that cities are the biggest cause of inner city problems. I don't think rural problem areas are comparable although the suffering may be similar. Cities have a long history of totally sucking. They sucked in Roman times, Greek times, Chinese dynasties, ...pretty much always. They've always sucked for most people.

Wow! A reasonable and insightful post!

 

[Neo Deist]

Frustration.

"Typical" came to mind.

 

[dawny0826]

I'm tired of it. I see a lot of you talking smack about it and insulting people who live there. Well, I've lived in rough inner city neighborhoods for almost my entire life. So I'm one of "those people". In San Francisco, I lived in a residential hotel. Fires, murders, suicides and petty crime were a common place thing in that building. (A residential hotel is a step away from a flophouse, to put it in perspective.)

I now live in Columbus, Ohio, in the Linden neighborhood. Linden is one of the roughest areas in the city, along with the Hilltop on the Westside and the Southside around Downtown. Yes, we have a high murder rate, drugs, homelessless, much of the area looks like Detroit and so on. This is a working class and poor area. Most of the people who live here are working class people with families. Mother and fathers with kids. There's white people, black people, Mexicans, immigrants, etc. The vast majority of people do work and do their best to make it. Most people are very friendly, as well. There's not the false air of superiority you get with the people from the well-to-do suburbs, who view you as trash and look down their noses at you.

People are very hard working, mostly in manual labor and also running their own businesses. My mom worked all her life in retail, supporting her family. We are not lowlifes, trash, genetically inferior, etc. Some of us are going through hard times for reasons out of our control. America doesn't make it easy to "move on up" on the socio-economic ladder, especially when you start out poor, have physical and mental health problems, etc. But we still try. A lot of the teenagers living in this area are still trying to make something of themselves. A teenage girl who works at the grocery store I go to wants to be a nurse. They're not all gangbanging thugs, toting guns. Even the "thug" types really need help at the end of the day, because they became trapped in such a lifestyle due to circumstances.

It doesn't help that the city is gentrifying areas for the yuppies, the cost of living keeps rising while wages have stagnated, the healthcare system is broken and underfunded, and so many more people are falling into poverty. So give us a break. It's not like the wealthy types don't have their own skeletons in the closet, they're just somewhat better at hiding it, while society casts a judgemental eye on us and expects us to fail. But we're still trying, despite society leaving us behind and spitting on us throughout the decades - white, black, Latino, etc. Inner city, rural, etc.

As J-Hud says: "I got this."

I've discussed with my daughters (14 & 11) on more than one occasion that they need not be judgmental or assumptive of the kids that are from poorer neighborhoods. I've corrected both of my girls on more than one occasion when referring to peers who bully on the bus as being "ghetto".

I know that our poorer communities are diverse with people who represent a spectrum of jobs, family circumstances and mentalities.I don't have a problem with people, in general. As long as a person's actions aren't hurting me or my family in some way, I've no desire to degrade them and have no reason not be respectful if our paths cross.

My problem isn't with "the hood" at all. My problem is with people who call any community home, but, do not care about doing their part to see their community flourish. I have no patience for the individual who blames everyone else under the sun for that which goes wrong within their community, but, contributes to its destruction.

I'm angered by the men and women who willfully bring children into loveless homes filled with abuse and addiction. I'm angered by people who commit crime on their own accord and then blame the law and everyone else for their actions.

I'm tired of the expectation that I'm supposed to pity those that are willfully and knowingly contributing to their own oppression and misfortune.

I have no respect for the individual who complains of what they lack, but, will not, according to their ability, do anything to improve their own circumstances. It really annoys me when the same people project a sense of entitlement.

To your point, this isn't everyone and shouldn't be the descriptive for America's poorer neighborhoods. I know that. This certainly describes some.

A person doesn't have to be poor or live in "the hood" to be a troublesome butt hole.

 

[Revoltingest]

I've discussed with my daughters (14 & 11) on more than one occasion that they need not be judgmental or assumptive of the kids that are from poorer neighborhoods. I've corrected both of my girls on more than one occasion when referring to peers who bully on the bus as being "ghetto".

I know that our poorer communities are diverse with people who represent a spectrum of jobs, family circumstances and mentalities.I don't have a problem with people, in general. As long as a person's actions aren't hurting me or my family in some way, I've no desire to degrade them and have no reason not be respectful if our paths cross.

My problem isn't with "the hood" at all. My problem is with people who call any community home, but, do not care about doing their part to see their community flourish. I have no patience for the individual who blames everyone else under the sun for that which goes wrong within their community, but, contributes to its destruction.

I'm angered by the men and women who willfully bring children into loveless homes filled with abuse and addiction. I'm angered by people who commit crime on their own accord and then blame the law and everyone else for their actions.

I'm tired of the expectation that I'm supposed to pity those that are willfully and knowingly contributing to their own oppression and misfortune.

I have no respect for the individual who complains of what they lack, but, will not, according to their ability, do anything to improve their own circumstances. It really annoys me when the same people project a sense of entitlement.

To your point, this isn't everyone and shouldn't be the descriptive for America's poorer neighborhoods. I know that. This certainly describes some.

A person doesn't have to be poor or live in "the hood" to be a troublesome butt hole.

You reminded me that many people don't see a problem as the problem it is.
They see the problem in terms of its cause.
Example....
We have a very expensive, massive & impressive library system here.
Sounds great, eh?
I used to rent books on CD, but had to give it up because most had bad
CDs, meaning that I never really heard the whole book.
Talking to an friend about this, he dismissed the CD problem. The real
problem was those women running the library. And so he launched into a
litany of examples of how the library shouldn't be run, ie, proof of the cause.
Btw, he insisted he isn't sexist when I pointed out he was. No one ever is.