Teacher: Christian faith prohibits treating transgendered students with respect and dignity

[Subduction Zone]

I am still learning and it appears that teacher should have learned a bit more too.

When dealing with this sort of issue, especially as a teacher, it is wiser to see on the side of caution. There was no need to make the student's life more difficult, nor did it serve any purpose.

 

[YmirGF]

Really? I'm disappointed in you. This is really about basic respect. It's like if someone changes their name. You should just respect that.

and if you don't play along you can be drummed out of your job of seven years. Yeah, that ought to help build trust and respect. It's not about respect. No one is being particularly respectful of the teachers opinions and beliefs. His ideas DO NOT MATTER. Only the transgender person's feelings matter. If this is equity. It sucks.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Excuse you, but I am not pretending to be a man and you wouldn't say that crap to my face. Also, that's not how sex reassignment surgery works. Mind you, breast implants, vaginoplasty and phalloplasty are also used for cis people who may have lost their genitals through illness, injury or never had them due to a deformity. Phalloplasty is often used on combat veterans who were wounded in war. So you just insulted them, too. Good going.

Sorry Frank, but I have my opinion and I'm sticking by it. I disagree with what you said wholeheartedly because that's just the way it is.

I can respect your wishes to do with yourself whatever it is that you want to do, and have already done to yourself, for which I would never look at people as yourself as being subhuman or something along those lines. I personally don't approve of the lifestyle, yet I wouldn't condemn you for it. I'm just a person with an opinion and I think you would appreciate it for me being truthful about it.

A point I'm trying to make involves that pertinent fact of life that you're just not going to make everybody like you in terms of your views and opinions. It just won't happen.

And by forcing people to accommodate things, wether by speech or action, typically ends up making matters far far worse than they were at the start.

The whole point of my reply was just pointing out that not everybody should be forced to accommodate under any type of threat, the lifestyles and choices of a group of people they themselves don't believe or condone. Respect is a two-way street. Not a one-way street.

 

[Shad]

The teacher should have just used his name and kept mum on the rest. Just call it like it is. A transgenderd person.

Nobody should be forced to say anything they don't want to say.

That was the compromise. According the teacher he made a mistake calling the student "her".

"[He told me] I’ve had a slip-up and he went on to describe what happened," Hochman described. "He goes, 'the student was participating in an activity, almost walked into a wall and yelled out stop her."

"Vlaming said he agreed to only refer to the student by his new name citing his devout Christian faith."

And the authoritarian administration doubled down.

"Superintendent Laura Abel told the School Board that administrators ordered Vlaming on numerous occasions to refer to the student by male pronouns. When the teacher refused, she recommended termination."

Ergo Compelled speech and authoritarian measure to force validation. The student is too mentally fragile for public school if a mistake causes such an issue. The admins are typical low pay grade tyrants.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Sorry Frank, but I have my opinion and I'm sticking by it. I disagree with what you said wholeheartedly because that's just the way it is.

You are free to continue in your callous and rude ignorance. That's your choice if you want to appear foolish and hurtful when you spew nonsense on a topic you don't understand. "Lifestyle". What garbage. Get a clue.

 

[shmogie]

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"High school teacher in Virginia fired for refusing to call transgender student male pronouns

A few days ago, the West Point Public School Board in Virginia voted unanimously to fire Peter Vlaming, a French teacher who had taught for seven years, because he refused to call a transgender freshman with the pronouns “he” and “him.” Vlaming said his Christian faith prohibited him from treat the student with respect and dignity.

View attachment 25939 ​

Peter Vlaming, who taught French class at West Point High School for nearly seven years, lost his job after a five-hour long public hearing he requested Thursday night.

The original complaint stemmed from a rising-9th-grade student who had transitioned and requested to be called by the male pronouns "he" and "him."

Principal Jonathan Hochman told the School Board that Vlaming refused to use the male pronouns to refer to the student because he considered it a "lie."
source​

Your thoughts on the statement that his "Christian faith prohibited him from treat[ing] the student with respect and dignity."

(A note on the thread's title. It is not a quote from the teacher.)​

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Calling someone what they cannot possibly be is a lie. No one of one sex can ¨transition¨ to another sex, No matter, the hormones, chemicals or slicing and dicing, every cell of their body carries the chromosomes of the birth sex.

You failed to mention that this teacher had taught this student previously, when she was a she, her birth sex.

He used no heś or sheś in referring to this student, he never treated he/she with disrespect, he simply did not want to participate with others in this particular fantasy.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

and if you don't play along you can be drummed out of your job of seven years. Yeah, that ought to help build trust and respect. It's not about respect. No one is being particularly respectful of the teachers opinions and beliefs. His ideas DO NOT MATTER. Only the transgender person's feelings matter. If this is equity. It sucks.

Not all ideas deserve respect. Not understanding is one thing but being disrespectful, making it a point to call someone what they do not want to be called and refusing budge on the issue is not a "free speech" matter. He was making the classroom into a hostile place and discriminating against a student. He was disrupting the learning environment.

I honestly don't understand gay people defending this sort of stuff. This trend of oppressed minorities punching down to feel better about themselves is shameful.

 

[shmogie]

Just a tip, but you should never call a person "it". It's dehumanizing. If you don't know what a person wants to be called in terms of gender, just use "they". That's what I do.

A true physical hermaphrodite is rare, but their sex is truly confused and mixed.

Totally different from one sex pretending they are another

 

[Shad]

He used no heś or sheś in referring to this student, he never treated he/she with disrespect, he simply did not want to participate with others in this particular fantasy.

If you read the article there was a mistake which he used a pronoun rather than a name. A mistake he admits to. If you read further the admins ordered him to use pronouns, rejected his name compromise and fired him for insubordination. The Admin, as I said above, is a low pay grade tyrant. Ie The type of person that gets the tiniest of power and lets it go to their head.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

A true physical hermaphrodite is rare, but their sex is truly confused and mixed.

Totally different from one sex pretending they are another

Like you pretending to be a decent human being and a follower of Jesus.

 

[shmogie]

Good. Kudos to the school board. He deserved to be fired. If you can't treat your students with respect, then don't be a teacher. You're going to have to deal with out LGBT students now and they're going to have to get over it. He can't use his religion as an excuse to be an *** because there's many trans people who are Christian and denominations that affirm trans people. A Christian is supposed to respect the dignity of all their fellow human beings, and he is violating that by making it a point to discriminate against, belittle and humiliate a student of his. Not only that, but it is unnecessarily disruptive of the learning environment.

He did none of the things you say he did, why not actually read the facts before you pontificate ? There is no such thing as a person changing their sex, it is scientifically impossible. I deal in reality, not fantasy.

There are ways to address these folk that is both respectful and truthful, I try and do that.

 

[YmirGF]

Not all ideas deserve respect. Not understanding is one thing but being disrespectful, making it a point to call someone what they do not want to be called and refusing budge on the issue is not a "free speech" matter. He was making the classroom into a hostile place and discriminating against a student. He was disrupting the learning environment.

I honestly don't understand gay people defending this sort of stuff. This trend of oppressed minorities punching down to feel better about themselves is shameful.

My own feeling, Frankie, is that the Trans community has a public relations disaster on its hands and no one seems to want to acknowledge that.

 

[shmogie]

If you read the article there was an mistake which he used a pronoun rather than a name. A mistake he admits to. If you read further the admins ordered him to use pronouns, rejected his name compromise and fired him for insubordination. The Admin, as I said above, is a low pay grade tyrant. Ie The type of person that gets the tiniest of power and lets it go to their head.

I agree, PC tyranny.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

My own feeling, Frankie, is that the Trans community has a public relations disaster on its hands and no one seems to want to acknowledge that.

No more than gays do. Bigots whine about y'all forcing your views on them just as much as they whine about trans people doing it. They're increasingly taken less seriously. For example, I don't hear people spewing the hateful and stupid garbage in this thread offline. People are generally respectful. Some just feel they can get away with saying online what they can't offline.

 

[YmirGF]

No more than gays do. Bigots whining about y'all forcing your views on them just as much as they whine about trans people doing it. They're increasingly taken less seriously. For example, I don't hear people spewing the hateful and stupid garbage in this thread offline. People are generally respectful.

I do not think a lot are respectful. I think many are cowed and mouthing platitudes, afraid they might lose their "Progressive" creds if they don't toe the line. (And yes, I do think many people are that superficial) I think a lot of people pretend to be respectful hence the expression "virtue signalling".

Would you rather have real people tell you what they actually think or a bunch of cowed allies who are afraid to say anything not in their playbook. It builds a false sense of security where in fact little exists. If you do not allow the expression of something it will go underground. This is one area WE do not want that to happen... but it's already starting.

 

[YeshuaRedeemed]

Religious liberty and free speech are human rights, and you are using the strawman fallacy. He did not say not to respect people, he just reserves the right to religious liberty and free speech. If I were him, I would sue on First Amendment grounds.

 

[YmirGF]

Religious liberty and free speech are human rights, and you are using the strawman fallacy. He did not say not to respect people, he just reserves the right to religious liberty and free speech. If I were him, I would sue on First Amendment grounds.

And you would likely lose and be poorer for it.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I do not think a lot are respectful. I think many are cowed and mouthing platitudes, afraid they might lose their "Progressive" creds if they don't toe the line. (And yes, I do think many people are that superficial) I think a lot of people pretend to be respectful hence the expression "virtue signalling".

Would you rather have real people tell you what they actually think or a bunch of cowed allies who are afraid to say anything not in their playbook. It builds a false sense of security where in fact little exists. If you do not allow the expression of something it will go underground. This is one area WE do not want that to happen... but it's already starting.

No, I'd rather people keep their hateful garbage to themselves. If they do air it, they should suffer social consequences for it, like people do for being racist or anti-Semitic. If they don't understand, that is fine. There's aspects of the "trans umbrella" I find worthy of criticism, like the "trans trender" thing, but I'm not going to belittle them or invalidate their experience. Respect and treating people with dignity is important.

What does it going underground matter? Lots of extremist lunacy is "underground". Do neo-Nazis deserve to have their opinions respected, too?

 

[Curious George]

It is a bit of an object lesson for anyone hell bent on standing up for their principles. Those days are over, unless of course, your principles are in alignment with political correct doctrine, then you can do whatever you like.

Definitely a lesson for those wishing to take a stand. Your beliefs have consequences, and you should accept those consequences. "Those days" are not over.

He took a stand; he is dealing with the consequences; people are discussing whether those consequences are fitting.

I think they are. Trying to spin it as "a lie" is just b.s. rationalization for I don't like or respect this kids world view.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

.

"High school teacher in Virginia fired for refusing to call transgender student male pronouns

A few days ago, the West Point Public School Board in Virginia voted unanimously to fire Peter Vlaming, a French teacher who had taught for seven years, because he refused to call a transgender freshman with the pronouns “he” and “him.” Vlaming said his Christian faith prohibited him from treat the student with respect and dignity.

View attachment 25939 ​

Peter Vlaming, who taught French class at West Point High School for nearly seven years, lost his job after a five-hour long public hearing he requested Thursday night.

The original complaint stemmed from a rising-9th-grade student who had transitioned and requested to be called by the male pronouns "he" and "him."

Principal Jonathan Hochman told the School Board that Vlaming refused to use the male pronouns to refer to the student because he considered it a "lie."
source​

Your thoughts on the statement that his "Christian faith prohibited him from treat[ing] the student with respect and dignity."

(A note on the thread's title. It is not a quote from the teacher.)​

.

He deserved to be fired. "Christian faith" requires nothing of the sort.