Telford UK Sex Abuse and no word from #metoo

[icehorse]

I’ve been asking - literally for years - why feminists are largely silent on the tsunami of abuse perpetrated in the name of Islam.

In Telford, UK, it’s come to light that yet another massive Islamic “grooming” ring has come to light, probably abusing at least 1000 girls over the last 30 years:

MP 'inundated' with grooming reports (you can easily find many more articles)

Warning: I’m about to make some generalizations!

Until someone comes up with a better label, I’m going to say that a large percentage of liberal college and uni. professors, a large percentage of feminists, a large percentage of the media, the province of Ontario*, and a large percentage of students share beliefs in “social justice”, so I’m going to call members of this ideology “social justice warriors” (SJWs). I understand that many people think this is a disparaging term, as I said, I’m happy to substitute a different term, but SJW seems sadly accurate.

I’m starting to discover a number of people who are trying to understand the SJW movement better (Steven Pinker, Jonathan Haight. Camille Paglia, Douglas Murray, Christina Hoff Sommers, Jordan Peterson, Gad Saad, Mark Steyn, Lindsay Shepherd, Ben Shapiro, the administration at the University of Chicago. FIRE, Lauren Southern, Michelle Rempel, Heather MacDonald, Ella Whelan, and others).

A common theme in their analysis is that SJWs often simplify the world into two camps: oppressors and the oppressed. Given this world view, it’s plausible to conclude that western civilization is the great oppressor, and that Muslims (for example) are oppressed. So, Harvey Weinstein gets a lot more press than the tens of thousands of girls who are sexually “groomed” by Muslim men, and he gets more press than the millions upon millions of girls and women upon whom FGM (female genital mutilation) is perpetrated.

When you think about it from this perspective, I’d say you can demonstrate uncanny powers of prediction. When “oppressors” are guilty it’ll be big news. When “the oppressed” are guilty, yawn.

(As another example of this, think Israel and Palestine)

For those of you who want to shout “you’re generalizing”, let me ask you this, in the realms of science and law and history and engineering aren’t we mostly starting off by finding patterns and yes, gulp, generalizing?

*Ontario has official “Social Justice Tribunals” placed highly in the government hierarchy.

 

[Kangaroo Feathers]

I’ve been asking - literally for years - why feminists are largely silent on the tsunami of abuse perpetrated in the name of Islam.

In Telford, UK, it’s come to light that yet another massive Islamic “grooming” ring has come to light, probably abusing at least 1000 girls over the last 30 years:

MP 'inundated' with grooming reports (you can easily find many more articles)

Warning: I’m about to make some generalizations!

Until someone comes up with a better label, I’m going to say that a large percentage of liberal college and uni. professors, a large percentage of feminists, a large percentage of the media, the province of Ontario*, and a large percentage of students share beliefs in “social justice”, so I’m going to call members of this ideology “social justice warriors” (SJWs). I understand that many people think this is a disparaging term, as I said, I’m happy to substitute a different term, but SJW seems sadly accurate.

I’m starting to discover a number of people who are trying to understand the SJW movement better (Steven Pinker, Jonathan Haight. Camille Paglia, Douglas Murray, Christina Hoff Sommers, Jordan Peterson, Gad Saad, Mark Steyn, Lindsay Shepherd, Ben Shapiro, the administration at the University of Chicago. FIRE, Lauren Southern, Michelle Rempel, Heather MacDonald, Ella Whelan, and others).

A common theme in their analysis is that SJWs often simplify the world into two camps: oppressors and the oppressed. Given this world view, it’s plausible to conclude that western civilization is the great oppressor, and that Muslims (for example) are oppressed. So, Harvey Weinstein gets a lot more press than the tens of thousands of girls who are sexually “groomed” by Muslim men, and he gets more press than the millions upon millions of girls and women upon whom FGM (female genital mutilation) is perpetrated.

When you think about it from this perspective, I’d say you can demonstrate uncanny powers of prediction. When “oppressors” are guilty it’ll be big news. When “the oppressed” are guilty, yawn.

(As another example of this, think Israel and Palestine)

For those of you who want to shout “you’re generalizing”, let me ask you this, in the realms of science and law and history and engineering aren’t we mostly starting off by finding patterns and yes, gulp, generalizing?

*Ontario has official “Social Justice Tribunals” placed highly in the government hierarchy.

FWIW, the whole point of the whole #metoo thing is that it's about self reporting, and then believing self reporters. So the reason #metoo isn't talking about this, presumably, is because no one involved in it said #metoo about it.

Beyond that, plenty of feminists condemn sexual assaults within Islam. I'll do it right now for you, if it makes you feel better. I don't know that it's really helpful trying to split justice and equality movements and pit them against each other, though. #metoo is, at heart, a movement among westerners, about exposing enbedded and covert sexual assault that has been generally ignored in the past. Sexual assault within Islam is really a different problem with different advocacy and tactics appropriate.

Don't criticise the leukemia foundation for not doing enough about heart disease. The leukemia foundation isn't denying that heart disease is a real and serious problem, they're just saying it's not really the problem they're set up to deal with.

Sort of the same thing here.

 

[Altfish]

I'm a liberal, but too many on that side of the political spectrum struggle when condemning religious groups.
Nick Cohen hit the nail firmly on the head in this radio show (Not sure if it'll work outside of the UK??
BBC Radio 4 - The Silence of the Liberals
...on the assumption that it won't, there is a synopsis of the program here...
What comes after The Silence of the Liberals?

 

[crossfire]

Since when has #Metoo been a SJW movement?

 

[sayak83]

I’ve been asking - literally for years - why feminists are largely silent on the tsunami of abuse perpetrated in the name of Islam.

In Telford, UK, it’s come to light that yet another massive Islamic “grooming” ring has come to light, probably abusing at least 1000 girls over the last 30 years:

MP 'inundated' with grooming reports (you can easily find many more articles)

Warning: I’m about to make some generalizations!

Until someone comes up with a better label, I’m going to say that a large percentage of liberal college and uni. professors, a large percentage of feminists, a large percentage of the media, the province of Ontario*, and a large percentage of students share beliefs in “social justice”, so I’m going to call members of this ideology “social justice warriors” (SJWs). I understand that many people think this is a disparaging term, as I said, I’m happy to substitute a different term, but SJW seems sadly accurate.

I’m starting to discover a number of people who are trying to understand the SJW movement better (Steven Pinker, Jonathan Haight. Camille Paglia, Douglas Murray, Christina Hoff Sommers, Jordan Peterson, Gad Saad, Mark Steyn, Lindsay Shepherd, Ben Shapiro, the administration at the University of Chicago. FIRE, Lauren Southern, Michelle Rempel, Heather MacDonald, Ella Whelan, and others).

A common theme in their analysis is that SJWs often simplify the world into two camps: oppressors and the oppressed. Given this world view, it’s plausible to conclude that western civilization is the great oppressor, and that Muslims (for example) are oppressed. So, Harvey Weinstein gets a lot more press than the tens of thousands of girls who are sexually “groomed” by Muslim men, and he gets more press than the millions upon millions of girls and women upon whom FGM (female genital mutilation) is perpetrated.

When you think about it from this perspective, I’d say you can demonstrate uncanny powers of prediction. When “oppressors” are guilty it’ll be big news. When “the oppressed” are guilty, yawn.

(As another example of this, think Israel and Palestine)

For those of you who want to shout “you’re generalizing”, let me ask you this, in the realms of science and law and history and engineering aren’t we mostly starting off by finding patterns and yes, gulp, generalizing?

*Ontario has official “Social Justice Tribunals” placed highly in the government hierarchy.

Me too movement is specifically targeting hidden abuse in the higher echelons of society, in big respectable institutions and among white collar women. That is why it me "too" .

Its widely understood that among lesser privileged women and in many non-western cultures, abuse of women is widespread and blatant upto sex slavery.

 

[sun rise]

FWIW, the whole point of the whole #metoo thing is that it's about self reporting, and then believing self reporters. So the reason #metoo isn't talking about this, presumably, is because no one involved in it said #metoo about it.

Yes, it's not a "movement" but a twitter hashtag.

As to religion, there's no reporting on how Christians abuse young girls focusing on their religion. Evil people are evil no matter what their religion is.

From what I've read it seems like the authorities/police basically ignored the atrocities for many years and that to me is the where the focus should be

However, police have “significantly disputed” the figure, calling it “sensationalised”.


Superintendent Tom Harding, of West Mercia Police, argued the town was no worse than other areas of England and Wales.


“I am confident that, in the main, we do know the scale of CSE,” Supt Harding told the BBC. “Therefore, I significantly dispute the 1,000 plus figure and do feel it is sensationalised.”


Allegations are said to have been mishandled by authorities, with many perpetrators going unpunished, while it is claimed similar abuse is continuing in the area.

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

Since when has #Metoo been a SJW movement?

Since always, as 90% of it is either attention whoring or virtue signalling(or both)

"A man looked at my chest on the bus! I should be able to wear low cut shirts without having to deal with these male chauvinistic rapists! #metoo #downwithmen #toxicmasculinity"

 

[Curious George]

I’ve been asking - literally for years - why feminists are largely silent on the tsunami of abuse perpetrated in the name of Islam.

In Telford, UK, it’s come to light that yet another massive Islamic “grooming” ring has come to light, probably abusing at least 1000 girls over the last 30 years:

MP 'inundated' with grooming reports (you can easily find many more articles)

Warning: I’m about to make some generalizations!

Until someone comes up with a better label, I’m going to say that a large percentage of liberal college and uni. professors, a large percentage of feminists, a large percentage of the media, the province of Ontario*, and a large percentage of students share beliefs in “social justice”, so I’m going to call members of this ideology “social justice warriors” (SJWs). I understand that many people think this is a disparaging term, as I said, I’m happy to substitute a different term, but SJW seems sadly accurate.

I’m starting to discover a number of people who are trying to understand the SJW movement better (Steven Pinker, Jonathan Haight. Camille Paglia, Douglas Murray, Christina Hoff Sommers, Jordan Peterson, Gad Saad, Mark Steyn, Lindsay Shepherd, Ben Shapiro, the administration at the University of Chicago. FIRE, Lauren Southern, Michelle Rempel, Heather MacDonald, Ella Whelan, and others).

A common theme in their analysis is that SJWs often simplify the world into two camps: oppressors and the oppressed. Given this world view, it’s plausible to conclude that western civilization is the great oppressor, and that Muslims (for example) are oppressed. So, Harvey Weinstein gets a lot more press than the tens of thousands of girls who are sexually “groomed” by Muslim men, and he gets more press than the millions upon millions of girls and women upon whom FGM (female genital mutilation) is perpetrated.

When you think about it from this perspective, I’d say you can demonstrate uncanny powers of prediction. When “oppressors” are guilty it’ll be big news. When “the oppressed” are guilty, yawn.

(As another example of this, think Israel and Palestine)

For those of you who want to shout “you’re generalizing”, let me ask you this, in the realms of science and law and history and engineering aren’t we mostly starting off by finding patterns and yes, gulp, generalizing?

*Ontario has official “Social Justice Tribunals” placed highly in the government hierarchy.

*Sigh*

It sounds like you have more of an issue with movements that strive for social justice. Can you find a social justice warrior who says that any instance of abuse doesn't matter?

 

[crossfire]

Since always, as 90% of it is either attention whoring or virtue signalling(or both)

"A man looked at my chest on the bus! I should be able to wear low cut shirts without having to deal with these male chauvinistic rapists! #metoo #downwithmen #toxicmasculinity"

How many posts like the above have you actually seen with the #metoo hashtag?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

How many posts like the above have you actually seen with the #metoo hashtag?

A lot. The majority.

The victimhood narrative of the new left is rather popular, and doesn't seem to be slowing down any.

And in fact, I have also seen a lot of sentiment from ACTUAL victims of actual rape and assault that would not associate with this 'movement' simply because they wouldn't have their experiences lumped in with these fakers and hystericals.

 

[crossfire]

A lot. The majority.

The victimhood narrative of the new left is rather popular, and doesn't seem to be slowing down any.

So do you think sexual assault victims should just shut up about it and repress it all, then?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

So do you think sexual assault victims should just shut up about it and repress it all, then?

No. But I think this 'movement' does far more harm than good by lumping these attention seekers with their nothing burgers in hand with actual victims.

 

[crossfire]

No. But I think this 'movement' does far more harm than good by lumping these attention seekers with their nothing burgers in hand with actual victims.

Do you have a guestimate as to the percentage of people who have been sexual assault victims? Have you ever done any research into it?

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

Do you have a guestimate as to the percentage of people who have been sexual assault victims? Have you ever done any research into it?

No. But I know that calling someone a chick, or checking an attractive girl out, or making a comment that might be construed as sexual, are some things that do not constitute sexual assault.

 

[crossfire]

No. But I know that calling someone a chick, or checking an attractive girl out, or making a comment that might be construed as sexual, are some things that do not constitute sexual assault.

You might be surprised as to how many people have actually been sexually assaulted..

 

[Satans_Serrated_Edge]

You might be surprised as to how many people have actually been sexually assaulted..

Are you reading my replies at all?

 

[icehorse]

Me too movement is specifically targeting hidden abuse in the higher echelons of society, in big respectable institutions and among white collar women. That is why it me "too" .

Its widely understood that among lesser privileged women and in many non-western cultures, abuse of women is widespread and blatant upto sex slavery.

It might be widely understood at places like RF, but sadly, I don't get the sense that it's more widely understood and/or given the weight it deserves. Again, we can predict whether Harvey Weinstein or a massive grooming ring is gonna get more press.

 

[icehorse]

*Sigh*

It sounds like you have more of an issue with movements that strive for social justice. Can you find a social justice warrior who says that any instance of abuse doesn't matter?

I have an issue with movements that are ultimately based on the premise that the world should be divided up into two groups: oppressors and oppressed. This leads to gross injustices, e.g. the shocking lack of concern about massive grooming ring abuses.

To connect the dots here a little bit:

- On the one hand we have Harvey Weinstein, clearly a horrible person who's done horrible things. BUT, the SJW sees him as clearly an OPPRESSOR, so he gets attacked, which is fine.

- On the other hand, we have things like these massive grooming rings, BUT, the SJW looks the other way because the perpetrators are seen as OPPRESSED - leading to some cognitive dissonance, and silence.

 

[Curious George]

I have an issue with movements that are ultimately based on the premise that the world should be divided up into two groups: oppressors and oppressed. This leads to gross injustices, e.g. the shocking lack of concern about massive grooming ring abuses.

To connect the dots here a little bit:

- On the one hand we have Harvey Weinstein, clearly a horrible person who's done horrible things. BUT, the SJW sees him as clearly an OPPRESSOR, so he gets attacked, which is fine.

- On the other hand, we have things like these massive grooming rings, BUT, the SJW looks the other way because the perpetrators are seen as OPPRESSED - leading to some cognitive dissonance, and silence.

Why do you assume the SJW looks the other way? It sounds like you're just angry at the #metoo phenomena. I do not know of a single person that would be like "sex rings? Nah, that's cool."

You seem to be upset by people's lack of political awareness. I think your focus should be on the media and propaganda, not individuals who are simply adding their voice to a subject that has personally affected them.

 

[icehorse]

Why do you assume the SJW looks the other way? It sounds like you're just angry at the #metoo phenomena. I do not know of a single person that would be like "sex rings? Nah, that's cool."

You seem to be upset by people's lack of political awareness. I think your focus should be on the media and propaganda, not individuals who are simply adding their voice to a subject that has personally affected them.

First I'd request that you not put words in my mouth, as always, I'm happy to clarify my positions if you ask. That said...

I am upset at the media, but IMO, the media is a mirror, largely providing what the people want. Next, yes I wish people in general were better informed, that would make for better societies. But in this case I'm far more concerned by those who are, IMO, misguided activists. It strikes me that SJWs are not helping. They are guided by a simplistic idea that leads to more injustice, not more justice.