Tell me why I should vote for Trump/Harris

[Quagmire]

Actually, I would love to see an Al Franken/Jill Stein ticket just so I could have a Franken/Stein bumper sticker.

 

[Kathryn]

I disagree. I would say that the more informed and engaged somebody becomes the more appealing the idea of a third choice appears .

One thing that attracts me to the Jill Stein/ The Green party is that she tends to frame issues in ways that address the cause rather looking for ways to blame their opponents or coming up with mostly unworkable solutions for the results.

For instance: while the Republicans approach the border crisis from a, "look how this is impacting us and our communities. We need to take back our country and stop this any way we can" perspective, and the Democrats (typically) from a more benevolent but equally ineffective, "We need to help these poor people anyway we can" perspective, Jill Stein/The Green party says, "let's look at the conditions compelling these people to leave their countries in the first place, and let's take ownership of the part we're playing in creating and perpetuating these conditions".

The "let's take ownership" part is what appeals to me most. You can't solve a problem with one hand while you're creating it with the other. All you can do is just make a whole bunch of token gestures that may make you feel better, but that don't really accomplish anything in the long run.

Just one example.

That said, I'm fully aware that a "We should take responsiblity for our own actions" platform isn't going to appeal to everybody (in fact, I'm sure It would drive a lot of people in the other direction) but there are enough people paying attention to things from that perspective that it would (or would have) served the DNC well to take their views into account (you'd think they would have learned something from 2016).

With all that said, I'm still voting for Tony Stark.

I still don't know who I am voting for! But it will definitely be a third party vote. Or fourth party vote. Hell, I don't know. I may write in my dad's name for all I know. He'd make a pretty good President. I mean, he's dead but otherwise he'd be pretty good.

 

[Shaul]

I don't think anyone should tell someone else how to vote. You should research on your own and come to your own conclusion about for whom you should vote.

 

[Quagmire]

I don't think anyone should tell someone else how to vote. You should research on your own and come to your own conclusion about for whom you should vote.

This is research.

 

[Quagmire]

but I notice they can’t articulate what they want

btw, what do you want besides 'Not Trump'.

 

[PureX]

Ok, fair enough. So if Harris wins I'm still willing to bet that such legislation will not get enacted.

It will be because the corporate overlords will ok it. But don’t expect the border problem to be solved. Not even if the republicans got a supermajority. Because the corporate overlords don’t want that issue solved. They want all that cheap labor around driving wages down across the board. And in the end, republicans or democrats, it’s the corporate overlords that have the real power.

 

[Nakosis]

It will be because the corporate overlords will ok it. But don’t expect the border problem to be solved. Not even if the republicans got a supermajority. Because the corporate overlords don’t want that issue solved. They want all that cheap labor around driving wages down across the board. And in the end, republicans or democrats, it’s the corporate overlords that have the real power.

Ok, we'll see how your prophecy works out.

 

[Nakosis]

It’s interesting that liberals are the advocates for personal freedom as conservatives are
moving towards authoritarianism. Liberals are often accused of being for big government and against freedom but this characterization comes from just a few right wing commitments like gun rights. Liberals see the freedom from being murdered in a mass shooting more fundamental than easy gun access.

There are many tired of both parties but I notice they can’t articulate what they want. It might just be a category of people tired of the responsibility to be an informed and engaged citizen.

Or perhaps simply a group who decided to stop drinking the political Kool-Aid.

 

[F1fan]

btw, what do you want besides 'Not Trump'.

Trump is a threat to national security and democracy, and that is enough to vote for anyone that's his opponent.

But the democrats have a great platform, much of it to correct the backward agenda of the republicans. Harris is a very stron g advocate for women's reproductive rights, and this is crucial. Biden wants SCOTUS reform, and there is a suggestion to add justices to match the number of circuits in the federal system. The next president might have to appoint up to three new justices, and we can only trust Harris to nominate reasonable replacements. I want an administration that will work to help student debt which is an ongoing problem for many young people. I want an administration that is willing to help develop low cost housing. Also an administration that will help mitigate inflation and help advance the economy, as Biden/Hassis has done. I want an administration and congress that will finally create immigration reform that will help American companies and farmers, and also help migrant families either live in Mexico and work in the USA, or seek ways to immigrate if the courts recognize their case as a good one. I want an administration that has been working to help lower healthcare costs which has been going up, and a lot of this is insurance companies limiting what they will cover. There will also be a need to deal with increasing himeowner insurance costs, much of which has been caused by increasing number of extreme weather, floods, and hurricanes. I also want an administration and congress that sees a need to reform the taxation laws that so far has helped the wealthy accumulate more and more wealth while the middle class and poor face more costs of living due to the basic norms of access to technology, transportation, and inflation. I like the wealth tax idea, and while it may **** off conservatives they need to ask themselves why they are covering for the super wealthy who wouldn't give them the time of day. The USA needs to reform its attitudes about fairness and work to balance the advantaged to the disadvantaged.

I have more, but that seems adequate.

Now how about you? You don't like Harris or Trump, describe your ideal candidate and their policies. What do you want?

 

[F1fan]

Or perhaps simply a group who decided to stop drinking the political Kool-Aid.

I'll let Richard Jeni respond for me.

 

[fantome profane]

I'll let Richard Jeni respond for me.

I have say, when he started describing the "people on the left", it didn't sound to bad to me.

But I don't eat salmon.

 

[F1fan]

I have say, when he started describing the "people on the left", it didn't sound to bad to me.

But I don't eat salmon.

I know, the left doesn't sound too bad with yoga, smoking weed, burning incense, and eating salmon. Is that as bad it they get?

 

[We Never Know]

Up for grabs: one shiny, barely used 2024 American vote.

This, folks, is your chance to talk me into voting for your candidate.

As it stands now I'll most likely be voting for Jill Stein, the Green Party candidate unless I can come up with a decent write-in candidate in the meantime (If only Tony Stark was a real person), but I'm open to listening to arguments in favor of voting for one or the other of the something-other-than-make-believe 2024 presidential candidates too.

So, have at.

Our non-American members can feel free to join in as well, after all it's your world that we're most likely going to wind up blowing up too.

Well.... Trump is orange and Harris is black...

Didn't someone say orange is the new black?

Hope that helps

 

[Quagmire]

Trump is a threat to national security and democracy, and that is enough to vote for anyone that's his opponent.

But the democrats have a great platform, much of it to correct the backward agenda of the republicans. Harris is a very stron g advocate for women's reproductive rights, and this is crucial. Biden wants SCOTUS reform, and there is a suggestion to add justices to match the number of circuits in the federal system. The next president might have to appoint up to three new justices, and we can only trust Harris to nominate reasonable replacements. I want an administration that will work to help student debt which is an ongoing problem for many young people. I want an administration that is willing to help develop low cost housing. Also an administration that will help mitigate inflation and help advance the economy, as Biden/Hassis has done. I want an administration and congress that will finally create immigration reform that will help American companies and farmers, and also help migrant families either live in Mexico and work in the USA, or seek ways to immigrate if the courts recognize their case as a good one. I want an administration that has been working to help lower healthcare costs which has been going up, and a lot of this is insurance companies limiting what they will cover. There will also be a need to deal with increasing himeowner insurance costs, much of which has been caused by increasing number of extreme weather, floods, and hurricanes. I also want an administration and congress that sees a need to reform the taxation laws that so far has helped the wealthy accumulate more and more wealth while the middle class and poor face more costs of living due to the basic norms of access to technology, transportation, and inflation. I like the wealth tax idea, and while it may **** off conservatives they need to ask themselves why they are covering for the super wealthy who wouldn't give them the time of day. The USA needs to reform its attitudes about fairness and work to balance the advantaged to the disadvantaged.

I have more, but that seems adequate.

Now how about you? You don't like Harris or Trump, describe your ideal candidate and their policies. What do you want?

Well for starters, paragraph breaks.

You don't like Harris or Trump, describe your ideal candidate and their policies

I think I've answered that pretty thoroughly here:Tell me why I should vote for Trump/Harris and here: Tell me why I should vote for Trump/Harris and to add to that I'd like to see a candidate (and I wouldn't care what color hat they were wearing) who doesn't turn out to be just another shill for Wall Street and the military industrial complex.

But if you looking for something more specific: I'd like to see a candidate who would:

--- take a holistic approach to dealing with the border crisis by enacting strategies focused on investming in development and stability in the countries involved; legalizing the use of recreational marijuana (and possibly cocaine) on the federal level in order to defund the cartels and their operations and undermine their influence and impact on the countries currently experiencing a mass exodus as a direct result of their operations;

--- look into options for restructuring our entire medical system so that 35 cents of every dollar isn't going towards the maintenance of a largely unnecessary and inefficient bureaucratic infrastructure, and thereby making comprehensive medical care available to every US citizen.

--- give young people a chance by suspending student loan payments (or at least the interest) until they've at least gotten their foot in the door as far as the standard American dream goes.

---

Edit: @F1fan sorry, I didn't mean to post that yet. When I went to answer @We Never Know's post below I forgot I already had a work in progress in answer to your last post.

Anyway, there's more. Just consider this chapter one.

Well.... Trump is orange and Harris is black...

Didn't someone say orange is the new black?

Hope that helps

Sure did. Now I'm thinking the easiest thing for me would be to just move to Australia.

 

[F1fan]

Well for starters, paragraph breaks.

Can I get credit for having two spaces after each period?

I think I've answered that pretty thoroughly here:Tell me why I should vote for Trump/Harris and here: Tell me why I should vote for Trump/Harris and to add to that I'd like to see a candidate (and I wouldn't care what color hat they were wearing) who doesn't turn out to be just another shill for Wall Street and the military industrial complex.

But if you looking for something more specific: I'd like to see a candidate who would:

--- take a holistic approach to dealing with the border crisis by enacting strategies focused on investming in development and stability in the countries involved; legalizing the use of recreational marijuana (and possibly cocaine) on the federal level in order to defund the cartels and their operations and undermine their influence and impact on the countries currently experiencing a mass exodus as a direct result of their operations;

--- look into options for restructuring our entire medical system so that 70 cents of every dollar isn't going towards the maintenance of a largely unnecessary and inefficient bureaucratic infrastructure, and thereby making comprehensive medical care available to every US citizen.

--- give young people a chance by suspending student loan payments (or at least the interest) until they've at least gotten their foot in the door as far as the standard American dream goes.

---

You are very progressive and I agree with evrything you say. I want there to be healthcare access for everyone, and the cost is folded into federal taxation. So even the poor who don't earn enough to pay taxes have access to healthcare as a basic right to life. Of course insurance companies stand in the way. And conservatives for dumb political reasons. I suggest that everyone has free healthcare, but those who can afford private healthcare can pay for that special service, and this will be a gift to the insurance companies.

Of course this is a long range goal, and republicans stand in the way of any progress and reform. We've gone backwards due to Trump winning the electoral college (not the popular vote) and need someone to get us back to where we were. Then in 2028 we can work for more progressive goals, which I hope includes election reform, and the elimination of the EC.

I would think it would be awesome if the USA/Mexico border had a region of mutual development and security. Think of how the Basques exists as a region from south France to northern Spain. So if there was a joint security force of Americans and Mexicans that would secure a region where migrants from Central America can settle, and even be issued work visas for seasonal work in the USA. That would allow some option for those migrants who are refused asylum, and may be tempted to enter the USA illegally. This would be great for Mexico and the USA as there cold be a massive work force that could work in manufacturing, thus have affordable products for export and also be a safe community for Spanish speaking people. Think of the opportunity for American companies who could set up manufacturing on the border of Texas, and have less shipping and import issues.

 

[Quagmire]

Can I get credit for having two spaces after each period?

You are very progressive and I agree with evrything you say. I want there to be healthcare access for everyone, and the cost is folded into federal taxation. So even the poor who don't earn enough to pay taxes have access to healthcare as a basic right to life. Of course insurance companies stand in the way. And conservatives for dumb political reasons. I suggest that everyone has free healthcare, but those who can afford private healthcare can pay for that special service, and this will be a gift to the insurance companies.

Of course this is a long range goal, and republicans stand in the way of any progress and reform. We've gone backwards due to Trump winning the electoral college (not the popular vote) and need someone to get us back to where we were. Then in 2028 we can work for more progressive goals, which I hope includes election reform, and the elimination of the EC.

I would think it would be awesome if the USA/Mexico border had a region of mutual development and security. Think of how the Basques exists as a region from south France to northern Spain. So if there was a joint security force of Americans and Mexicans that would secure a region where migrants from Central America can settle, and even be issued work visas for seasonal work in the USA. That would allow some option for those migrants who are refused asylum, and may be tempted to enter the USA illegally. This would be great for Mexico and the USA as there cold be a massive work force that could work in manufacturing, thus have affordable products for export and also be a safe community for Spanish speaking people. Think of the opportunity for American companies who could set up manufacturing on the border of Texas, and have less shipping and import issues.

Damn. Now I may vote for you.

 

[Heyo]

btw, what do you want besides 'Not Trump'.

What does the US public want?

Time for some armchair mass psychology.
The US public is discontent. The quality of living is far below than in other developed countries, and wages haven't kept up with productivity for about 40 years now. Most don't know that, but they have a feeling that something is wrong.
Obama had a message of hope for positive change, and that's what he got elected on. But he couldn't hold most of his promises. Trump had a message of change, and he wasn't of the political establishment, so he got elected. But the public soon realized that that wasn't the change in the direction they wanted, so he got unelected. (Nobody voted for Biden in 2020.)
So, what does the public want, and who is likely to give it to them? Basically, they want to live better. Unfortunately, what would give that to them is what has been told to them is "socialism", and they've learned from early youth that socialism is bad. The most chance to win an election as PotUS is someone who can believably explain that their politics isn't socialism (or that socialism is good), someone like Bernie. But they would not only have to fight for votes, they would also have to fight the establishment of their own party.

 

[Quagmire]

What does the US public want?

Time for some armchair mass psychology.
The US public is discontent. The quality of living is far below than in other developed countries, and wages haven't kept up with productivity for about 40 years now. Most don't know that, but they have a feeling that something is wrong.
Obama had a message of hope for positive change, and that's what he got elected on. But he couldn't hold most of his promises. Trump had a message of change, and he wasn't of the political establishment, so he got elected. But the public soon realized that that wasn't the change in the direction they wanted, so he got unelected. (Nobody voted for Biden in 2020.)
So, what does the public want, and who is likely to give it to them? Basically, they want to live better. Unfortunately, what would give that to them is what has been told to them is "socialism", and they've learned from early youth that socialism is bad. The most chance to win an election as PotUS is someone who can believably explain that their politics isn't socialism (or that socialism is good), someone like Bernie. But they would not only have to fight for votes, they would also have to fight the establishment of their own party.

Bernie never stood a chance .
He made too much sense.

 

[Shaul]

This is research.

I am hoping you do more rigorous research than just this.

 

[Quagmire]

I am hoping you do more rigorous research than just this.

I appreciate your concern.

Or whatever that is.