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Terrorist Win in Fight over Free Speech
- Thread starter Darkdale
- Start date
Judgement Day
Active Member
Excuse me??? Terrorist??? Who are you calling a terrorist here?????
Judgement Day
Active Member
You may want to reconsider the use of your word. The insulting cartoon didnt only insult the protesters, but also insults all Muslims around the world. But there were Muslims that chose to riot and there were Muslims who chose not to. By this, not only the protesters that demanded the apology, but all Muslims, thus, making a title thread like that messages people, especially Muslims, that you are claiming that they are terrorists.Darkdale said:
Darkdale
World Leader Pretend
Judgement Day said:
Nope. Just the violent ones. No one is going to surrender to non-violent protesters. The West is afraid of offending Muslims because they don't want their children killed, their women cut into pieces, and their embassies burned to the ground. That is why they are capitulating. The peaceful protests, with the Muslims holding signs promising a new holocaust for the Jews and threatening to kill all the westerners is OK, it just makes us pity them. But it is the violent ones we have to deal with... and that is why it is important for Muslims to make sure that the West can tell the difference between the peaceful Muslims and the violent ones.
I understand that Muslim were offended. I can understand that you don't want to be lumped in with the people who are disgracing your religion. But I'm curious, when Muslims, in the name of your God, murder thousands of people, which is clearly against the Koran, how come there is no protest? But when a Danish guy makes a little cartoon, people are storming the streets, killing, and burning down buildings? Help us understand your priorities.
Darkdael,
Just out of curiosity. I dont know if you have a wife, or maybe a sister, but how would you feel if a comic was drawn in a local newspaper that is viewed by many in your community that portrayed your sister or mother engaging in sexual intercourse with a three or four men, and then calling her a whore afterwards?
Just out of curiosity. I dont know if you have a wife, or maybe a sister, but how would you feel if a comic was drawn in a local newspaper that is viewed by many in your community that portrayed your sister or mother engaging in sexual intercourse with a three or four men, and then calling her a whore afterwards?
Darkdale
World Leader Pretend
Ezzedean said:
How would I feel? I'd be pissed. But I wouldn't kill people or burn down buildings. How would you feel, if someone drew a picture of my mother being raped by five Muslim men, and in response I came and killed your family? Wouldn't that seem irrational? Or would you think it was ok?
Luckily you have a good head on your shoulders and you wouldn't do something like that, but there are many who aren't lucky enough as you and I. One thing I think needs to be known is that, yes, SOME muslims got out of hand, out of maybe 2000 protestors (per protest) you can blame maybe a hundred of them for taking things too far, that is a very small percentage. How many times have things gotten out of hand at a protest, muslim or non muslim? It doesn't matter where you are, or who is protesting, there is a pretty good chance that things will get out of hand. In the 60's and 70's there were war protests all over the world that got out of hand. I'm sure we can search the net and find hundreds of protests that lead to acts of violence in one way or another. I personally believe that if muslims want to protest this comic and make a huge deal out of it, we should be protest against anything that insults Jesus (pbuh), Moses (pbuh), or any other prophet of God, and it should also be in a peaceful manner, and as hard as it is to believe, although some have gone over board MOST have been peaceful, the media just wont show it, what's so entertaining and interesting about a bunch of peaceful muslims? They would rather show the morons and extremists who are taking things too far.
Peace and Blessings
Ezzedean
Peace and Blessings
Ezzedean
Darkdale
World Leader Pretend
Ezzedean said:
I'm sorry, you may think what these people do is just minor or small, but they are killing people. That means war. I'm sorry, but if you can't stop them, then we have to. That is all there is to it.
Ezzedean said:
Don't worry, most of the violent protesters back in the 60s and 70s were no better than the violent protesters coming from the Arab Street today. One doesn't make the other ok. Again, you can keep acting like this is no big deal, but your people are killing people and so we are going to kill them back.
Ezzedean said:
Again, you keep pretending like this is no big deal, that just shows how little you understand about what is about to happen. The more violent you guys get, the more violent we will get - and we aren't messing around. We mean to end the violence... whatever that means, however we have to do it... that is what we mean to do. You should understand that this is very serious. This isn't a joke.
I'm saying that people have been taking things too far, killing people and burning down buildings would fall under the category of taking things too far. "Your people have been kiling people, so we are going to kill them back." The Quran talks about the transgressors all the time, and tells us that if one fights against us (for our beliefs, and only our beliefs) we fight back... but that's from a non-lovin God... I'm assuming it's okay now though, since it's what you want to do. Believe me when I tell you this, violence and more death is NOT the solution to this problem.
With the greatest of respect, Ezzedean, your comment "Luckily you have a good head on your shoulders and you wouldn't do something like that, but there are many who aren't lucky enough as you and Is is a cop -out.Ezzedean said:
It isn't a case of luck, it is a case of self discipline, and not rushing out to burn, pillage and destroy. there is such a thing as restraint; we may be human animals, but we have learned to tollerate our emotions (thankfully) and not use Gut - reaction temper trantrum methods. I personally am sorry that the Muslim population has reacted so badly to the cartoons, but it is not all one sided.
A couple of says ago, I replied to a post from a Muslim member of this forum, who was asking about our thought on Jesus Christ, and his relationship to God. Unfortunately, that poster ended his question whith something like "and don't give me the crap of 1=3".
Religious tollerance needs to be seen to be adopted by all (not just one faction).
(I apologise for the vulgar lavatorial reference above, I was quoting)
Not a problem Michel. I'm just trying to make it clear to everyone that I dont in any way agree with what the muslims have done, but at the same time it's not the first time that things like this have happened, and these things have happened from non-muslims, Asatru is saying WAR, we must get the muslims for this. Why dont I hear him saying WAR to the nazis or skinheads who have commited acts of violence and murder in the years? There are many groups who have commited these things, but as soon as the muslims did it, it's time to kill them all off, I say that's BULL. Like I stated earlier, and it is a very valid point, out of thousdands, hundreds were taking things too far, and maybe 5-10 out of thousands commited these deaths. Yes it's wrong, yes it's disgusting, but should we now go and kill all muslims in sight because of some extgremists? I don't think so. How many "Christian" folowers have commited murder and rape? Ed Gein, BTK, many killers were Christians, should I now think WAR TO ALL CHRISTIANS? I dont think so, because I know better. You guys should too.
I just once would like you guys to put yourselves in the shoes of a Muslim like me and MILLION others. The ones who haven't hurt a fly in their lifetime. Ones who wake up and go to school, or work like the rest of you. The ones who live right next door to you. The ones who are a part of the same charity organizations as you, and the ones who work to make the community better, and the ones who DO preach religious tolerance. I am willing to bet that there are more of US than there are THEM (extremists). Like I said, the media doesn't want to show US, they would rahter show THEM.
Peace and Blessings
Peace and Blessings
d.
_______
while the SD is obviously keen to hype this up as a freedom of speech violation, the truth in this matter is far less dramatic. what happened was the swedish version of the FBI (SÄPO) informed the webhost that these caricatures was being published on their server, something they apparently was unaware of. the webhosting company wanted no part of this, understandably enough, and therefore shut SD's webpage down. the caricatures and SD's webpage is now up and running on a private server.
informing the webhosting company that they might be in mortal danger isn't the same as censorship, and it is apparently normal procedure in a situation like this.
Darkdale
World Leader Pretend
Ezzedean said:
Just because things like this have happened, doesn't mean that they have happened to this extent, over such a tiny thing. Also, refer to me as Darkdale, not Asatru. I do not speak for Asatruar. But yes, we must strike back.
Ezzedean said:
We went to war with the Nazis, if you'll remember. It is the same thing.
Ezzedean said:
No one is saying we should kill all Muslims. American Muslims aren't suffering from the same sickness. American Muslims have been peaceful and, for the most part, responsible and even a little outspoken (if you can imagine that!) As far as I can tell, American Muslims are just as "American" as I am. As far as I know there are Muslims in our military fighting to protect me from terrorists. I still think American Muslims have been too quiet... but, I think they have been a better example.
Ezzedean said:
These guys weren't committing crimes because they were Christian. These Muslim people are committing crimes in the name of Islam. IF you can't recognize the difference, then may the gods save you.
Just because things like this have happened, doesn't mean that they have happened to this extent, over such a tiny thing. Sorry, insulting a prophet of God (in the eyes of Muslims) is not a tiny little thing to us, and it shouldn't be a tiny little thing to Christians or Jews. Just because society has made it okay to do these sorts of things, it doesn't mean that it is. We base our life around these peoples teachings, God chose these people for us, the least we can do is stand up for them. Only 50 years ago, women used to be respected in Western society, and they weren't running around wearing close to nothing... but now, it's the norm and it's okay. The same goes for this tiny little thing, believe me, insulting a Prophet of God like that (Mohammed, Moses, Jesus,Noah, Abraham) IS NOT A TINY LITTLE THING. AND IF YOU CANT UNDERSTAND THAT, MAY GOD HELP YOU!!!
Ezzedean said:
I don't think that is a matter that is relevent to this thread.
I live in England; our prime Minister has long advocated a philosophy of 'Zero tollerance' towads people (whoever they are) who cause riots, pillage, arson, vandalism......whatever.
I don't for a moment think that any coolheaded Christian wants to declare an all out war against Muslims; I would be surprised to hear it if that was ever considered. It would be wrong, and immoral.
The vast majority of your people are law abiding (there is no doubt about that). Perhaps what they ought to do is to feel a sense of responsability towards the extremists, and deal with them "In house', before these people cause the havock they have caused.
I get the impression (and please forgive me if it is erroneous) that Muslims are very loath to report their own kind (even if they are aware that their friends are going to commit an illegal act).
Here is what Muslims should have done, from the beginning of this dreadful affair:-
Thousands join pro-Islam protest
A demonstration by thousands of UK mainstream Muslims protesting against controversial cartoons satirising the Prophet Muhammad is under way.
Several thousands packed in to London's Trafalgar Square waving banners calling for unity against Islamophobia.
The rally started peacefully, allaying fears of disruption by extremists.
The event aims to explain the views of moderate Muslims towards cartoons published in a Danish newspaper which led to worldwide protests.
Organisers also said it aims to dissociate the mainstream Muslim community from a "minority of extremists".
Hanifa Brka
Protester
Coach-loads of demonstrators arrived at the rally called United Against Incitement and Islamophobia, which got off to a trouble-free start at about 1340 GMT on Saturday.
Among them was Hanifa Brka, a 29-year-old student from Birmingham, who said: "This is the heart of our faith - we believe it is wrong to talk badly about the prophet.
"I would like to send a message to all honest Christians - we are all brothers and sisters."
A series of speakers gathered to support the Muslim community, including MP Jeremy Corbyn.
In his speech, which was met with cheers from the crowd, he said: "The only way our community can survive is by showing mutual respect to each other.
The rally is backed by Christian and peace groups
"We demand that people show respect for each other's community, each other's faith and each other's religion."
The event was organised by the Muslim Council of Britain and the Muslim Association of Britain, with the backing of a number of Christian groups, peace organisations and the Mayor of London.
Mayor Ken Livingstone had singled out football thugs and extremists and warned them to stay away, saying police would halt any attempt to disrupt the demonstration.
Organiser Anas Altikriti, of the Muslim Association of Britain, said he was confident the demonstration would not be taken over by extremists.
Police operation
He told BBC Five Live: "Our stewards are very vigilant, we're working very closely with the police plus we have made absolutely sure that there will only be one official slogan on our T-shirts and on our placards, and that is 'united against incitement and united against Islamophobia' - anything else is not down to the organisers."
Scotland Yard said it has been working with organisers all week to plan the operation, expected to involve 500 officers.
Protests held in London last week sparked outrage when demonstrators carried placards with strong messages - the Metropolitan Police said some protesters could be charged with "incitement to murder".
Doctor Azam Tamimi, who is the director of the Institute of Islamic Political Thought, is due to Lead
The
Demonstration and said it would be peaceful. "The main purpose of the rally today is to object to what has been going on in a civilised manner. "We have the right to be angry, but we have to do it within the remits of the law, and we have to respect the rights of others," he said.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/4700482.stm