The “three wise men”

[an anarchist]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

 

[Rival]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saoshyant

Zoroastrianism expects 3 such figures.

 

[Sand Dancer]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

I don't think they are okay with other religions having validity.

 

[an anarchist]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saoshyant

Zoroastrianism expects 3 such figures.

That is true. I still think this passage of the Bible is taking it upon itself to declare that Jesus is the expected Messiah of their religion. If the passage is to be believed, the Magi saw Christ as the Messiah they’ve been waiting for still, though He be one man.

 

[Lain]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

The magi were wise men in a sense (for Daniel was praised as a wise man and made chief over them, yet the term also refers to magi, it is an equivalent thing not a mistranslation), and yes they used astrology to see this star (the NET notes note that the term they used concerning the star was "in it's rising" which is an astrological thing), although of course it is also a supernatural event. Whether they were Zoroastrians or just "wise men/mages" from the East I do not know but I think it is probable that they were.

Zoroastrianism indeed does expect this sort of figure and Jesus is the fulfillment of it, in fact is the fulfillment and hope of every religion/person as God Himself first preached this hope into the world at Genesis 3:15 saying "and I will put hostility between you and between the woman, and between your offspring and between her offspring; he will strike you on the head, and you will strike him on the heel." It is a shame that they seemed to miss their Lord.

As for syncretism between us, I do not think it is called for, as there was not syncretism but a bowing of one to the other (them to the Infant God). Whatever truth they have surely we do have it but without the falsehoods that they may have. But studying them to see what that group of mankind expected and desired concerning these things is a worthwhile and interesting thing.

 

[an anarchist]

As for syncretism between us, I do not think it is called for, as there was not syncretism but a bowing of one to the other (them to the Infant God). Whatever truth they have surely we do have it but without the falsehoods that they may have. But studying them to see what that group of mankind expected and desired concerning these things is a worthwhile and interesting thing.

This is very insightful, thank you. There doesn’t have to be syncretism, you are right.
Also, welcome to RF lain!

 

[Lain]

Also, welcome to RF lain!

Thank you!

 

[Jeremiah Ames]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

I always believed the “ wise men” were magicians, although they also appear wise.
I don’t get hung up on Bible translations any more. I used to see so many errors and purposeful mistranslations and other problems, and worried over these things.
Then I realized it’s all meaningless.

For your question, I do believe the magi have implications.

I’m sorry, if I appear less than helpful here.

 

[Shaul]

The Gospels never actually state how many magi were there. The number three is based on Christian tradition, not the Gospels.

 

[rational experiences]

Human men scientists theists as a man claims I know against men.

Yet men brotherhood invented human sciences practice wisdom of evil. Was just a man advised.

Theories.

Wandering star saviour is stone as a God science earth status. God returns by star body. Said by men. Cold gases released from stone were put back into space.

A hot stone gas burning consumed everything so the wandering star was either saviour or satan.

Known by men in science removing God earths deceased cold gas entombed out of the stone leaving empty chambers of previous spirit gases. Sin holes. Sink hole.

Meanwhile earths heavens gases burn out and fall to the ground attacking irradiating all life.

Evil scientific Satanism.

Wisdom advice of men about three.

Holiness is the space empty womb first and the only empty body holy. Not God. Taught. Holy one body only mothers space womb.

Birthed holy immaculate spirit heavens not burning is the second wisdom.

Birthed sacrificed alight gas spirit the third wisdom.

Natural wisdom of the three regarding God as stone the star and the saviour.

Reason for asteroid mass cold in space womb pressure. Why it was moving old earth science cause.

CH gases out of stone the only holy body. Heavens science conscious wisdom...never change.

A long time ago science changed Christ mass the title given Jesus.

Teaching said Jesus before Christ as men had attacked life in satanic science before. Advice only.

In modern life Christ was attacked again. Same quantified event Jesus.

So science said Jesus CHRIST then Jesus again. Advised....science had caused it again.

A teaching proving scientists had attacked sacrificed human life on earth as one mass heavens...self owned advices one each human life harmed versus the brothers human who had invented the sciences.

As each individual man in human life paid the personal price for his brothers practice of the occult the teaching.

Spiritual human life versus satanic science occultism. Science as the practice. Not natural science being observation only.

 

[Estro Felino]

The Magoi (hence the word magic from Greek mageia) were Zoroastrian priests, but also astronomers and astrologers.
In 7 BC the great conjuction (alignment of Saturn and Jupiter) had taken place. That is the Bethlehem star.
So Jesus was born between the 7 and 6 BC, because in 6 BC the famous Quirinus' census takes place.

 

[Dropship]

...I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say...

But why did God send Jesus if Zoroastianism is all we need?

 

[rational experiences]

If a human being living nearly as just bio water oxygenated and owner bio chemicals says something is abducted but something is sent.

You are meant to apply human logic.

Water in chosen human nuclear temple pyramid science was abducted by UFO ark radiation mass the accumulated force of it.

Above us.

As ground radiation in nuclear dust conversion increased it below us in stone.

Reasoned earths atmosphere sitting in voiding space vacuum only deals with natural gas light.

Science constant never owned natural light constant the void vacuum did.

Mother womb was the description.

When earths spatial cooling of pressure occurred water was sent back down to ground and held. Water holds holy ox oxygen. Oxygenation of bio life heals it.

Tree of Life irradiated bush burning not oxygenating is saved also. Holy tree of life assists health.

Blood changes its body by pressured change.
Cells change form in pressure change.
Oxygen heals. Water held where it belonged.

Ice the saviour melts putting back water. Upper atmosphere gas however is hotter by loss of ice reasoning.

Christ mass atmosphere accumulator holds stable life DNA for animals and humans. Christ ancient symbol holy ox. Oxygen.

 

[Mark La Buda]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

I support, the astrologers or magi-either of which-under the Mosaic Law-the Israelites were not to consort with.. Considering this, why would “divine” intervention lead them to Herod first and not to Jesus. Actually, it certainly lack a purpose for God to summon them. Doing so, He would be violating his own just standard/laws.

Have you ever wondered why the star led the magi to King Herod first? It was Satan that led them to Herod. Matthew, chapter 2, relates the outcome of this diversion. The purpose was to destroying Jesus. A divine source would not have maneuvered events to causes danger to Jesus and innocent deaths.

 

[sojourner]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

The Bible doesn’t give us the number. No text says that there were 3.

The Greek term in the texts is magoi.

 

[sojourner]

But why did God send Jesus if Zoroastianism is all we need?

I thought John Lennon said that love is all we need???

 

[Triumph]

Matthew 2 gives an account of three men visiting baby Jesus. Depending what version of the Bible you’re using, who the men are differs. The KJV says this
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

The NIV says this
1 After Jesus was born in Bethlehem in Judea, during the time of King Herod, Magi from the east came to Jerusalem2 and asked, “Where is the one who has been born king of the Jews? We saw his star when it rose and have come to worship him.”

due to the KJV, it’s been put in popular imagination that these “wise men” were kings, fulfilling the prophecy of Isaiah 60:3 . They were not kings. They were Magi.
What are Magi? They were the priests of Zoroastrianism, and they were the astrologers/astronomer of their times.
The star that they seen. That has been depicted as a spotlight shining on baby Jesus in popular imagination. Does this make sense? Wouldn’t every one be able to see it? Doesn’t it make more sense that these Magi were referring to astrological signs? They were astrologers, right?
So why does any of this matter? I think there are big implications that the presence of the Magi bring. Zoroastrianism has an awaited Messiah figure. Doesn’t this Bible passage assume to claim that Jesus was the awaited Messiah of Zoroastrianism as well?
I interpret this as Christians should look into Zoroastrianism and see what it has to say. I often talk about my opinions on the end times on this site, Zoroastrianism has shaped my views on it. The rapture cannot happen unless we make it happen through collective morality, this is the resulting syncretic view of Zoroastrianism and Christianity (IMO). the presence of the Magi has implications, do you disagree?
Also, shame on the KJV for changing the word Magi to wise men. My assumption is that the translators knew the implication, and sought to erase any hint of syncretism in their version of the Bible.

A main point about those 3 men is do they believe Jesus is the Son of God or not. The Son of God never spoke of those 3 men from the East. They were seeking a King to worship, but Jesus said all worship is to God the Father in Heaven and God is not a king. God did not send anyone to worship his son, Jesus.
They were seeking a man to join them to rule over the Jews as a king. Jesus denied being a king at his trial saying other people called him king, Jesus did not. Being called something and actually being that description can be 2 entirely different things. Jesus did not come to be a king ruling land. The 3 were seeking a military leader to enable them to control Israel and they were willing to pay for the assistance of the power of Jesus with gold which Jesus teaches is the root of evil. If Jesus refused, they offered him myrrh which is the herb used in embalming Jesus. It is interesting that Frankincense is helpful in treating nuclear radiation sickness but it comes from certain plants that are a favored resting place for serpents/snakes so collecting Frankincense is a dangerous activity.
The sword of Jesus is truth that destroys the lies spewed by talking serpents. The reputation of Herod as a cruel ruler was well known so after telling Herod that a king that would rule Israel had been born knowing it would alarm Herod into fearing his own governmental power what did they do? Did they stay with Jesus to learn what he would teach and help to protect him from Herod? No, they left a wake of dead Hebrew/Jewish Children behind because of their words leaving young Jesus, the Son of God, in peril as they returned to their own land and beliefs.
Also interesting is according to Josephus a member of the Magi was the King of Persia during the days of Daniel. The Persian area today is modern Iran and Iraq.

 

[Triumph]

The Gospels never actually state how many magi were there. The number three is based on Christian tradition, not the Gospels.

Interesting, I think the magi may represent the future main religions of Islam since they honor Jesus as a prophet and recognize his birth.
important because Jesus did say he was a prophet and more than a prophet. His birth narrative is written as an informative parable of future events as well as the past events surrounding his birth.

 

[Triumph]

I support, the astrologers or magi-either of which-under the Mosaic Law-the Israelites were not to consort with.. Considering this, why would “divine” intervention lead them to Herod first and not to Jesus. Actually, it certainly lack a purpose for God to summon them. Doing so, He would be violating his own just standard/laws.

Have you ever wondered why the star led the magi to King Herod first? It was Satan that led them to Herod. Matthew, chapter 2, relates the outcome of this diversion. The purpose was to destroying Jesus. A divine source would not have maneuvered events to causes danger to Jesus and innocent deaths.

it was a "divine" guidance from a conflicting power, not the Father of Jesus. Jesus was treated with respect but if they realized his true power from God and his mission of savior, they would have loved Jesus and never left him.
Anyone can be an antichrist that denies Jesus is born of a virgin and the son of God. In the last war there is only one main Antichrist but many antichrists assist him.
Anyone can be Satan because it describes a person that denies the Words of God are true and accepts different values than those acceptable to God.
Matthew 12:26
And if Satan cast out Satan, he is divided against himself; how shall then his kingdom stand?"
This describes a false religion supported by people of the same values that have cruel dictates supporting unfair laws. But if that ruler completely changes his false religious ideas, then his old religion will not stand, it will disappear. Example: Few, if any people worship Zeus today. That false religion did not stand.
Luke 22:3
Then entered Satan into Judas surnamed Iscariot, being of the number of the twelve."
What happened to Judas is he wanted to return to the Hebrew/Jewish religion. The temple was killing Christians and Judas must have been in fear of his own life. Judas being the manager of the donations to the church Jesus formed realized Jesus was giving it all away and Judas would never be rich. After receiving the 30 pieces of silver for selling the life of Jesus, Judas was rejected by the temple. They considered Judas a traitor to their religion and felt Judas should die for leaving it.