The 10 borrowed commandments

[CMIYC]

​

How can Moses claim to have received his 10 from up above? I thinks they were "borrowed" from another source as were most of christianity's devine claims.




I.
Thou shalt not kill, nor bid anyone kill.

II.
Thou shalt not commit adultery or rape.

III.
Thou shalt not avenge thyself nor burn with rage.

IV.
Thou shalt not cause terror.

V.
Thou shalt not assault anyone nor cause anyone pain.

VI.
Thou shalt not cause misery.

VII.
Thou shalt not do any harm to man or to animals.

VIII.
Thou shalt not cause the shedding of tears.

IX.
Thou shalt not wrong the people nor bear them any evil intent.

X.
Thou shalt not steal nor take that which does not belong to you.

XI.
Thou shalt not take more than thy fair share of food.

XII.
Thou shalt not damage the crops, the fields, or the trees.

XIII.
Thou shalt not deprive anyone of what is rightfully theirs.

XIV.
Thou shalt not bear false witness, nor support false allegations.

XV.
Thou shalt not lie, nor speak falsely to the hurt of another.

XVI.
Thou shalt not use fiery words nor stir up any strife.

XVII.
Thou shalt not speak or act deceitfully to the hurt of another.

XVIII.
Thou shalt not speak scornfully against others.

XIX.
Thou shalt not eavesdrop.

XX.
Thou shalt not ignore the truth or words of righteousness.

XXI.
Thou shalt not judge anyone hastily or harshly.

XXII.
Thou shalt not disrespect sacred places.

XXIII.
Thou shalt cause no wrong to be done to any workers or prisoners.

XXIV.
Thou shalt not be angry without good reason.

XXV.
Thou shalt not hinder the flow of running water.

XXVI.
Thou shalt not waste the running water.

XXVII.
Thou shalt not pollute the water or the land.

XXVIII.
Thou shalt not take God's name in vain.

XXIX.
Thou shalt not despise nor anger God.

XXX.
Thou shalt not steal from God.

XXXI.
Thou shalt not give excessive offerings nor less than what is due.

XXXII.
Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's goods.

XXXIII.
Thou shalt not steal from nor disrespect the dead.

XXXIV.
Thou shalt remember and observe the appointed holy days.

XXXV.
Thou shalt not hold back the offerings due God.

XXXVI.
Thou shalt not interfere with sacred rites.

XXXVII.
Thou shalt not slaughter with evil intent any sacred animals.

XXXVIII.
Thou shalt not act with guile or insolence.

XXXIX.
Thou shalt not be unduly proud nor act with arrogance.

XXXX.
Thou shalt not magnify your condition beyond what is appropriate.

XXXXI.
Thou shalt do no less than your daily obligations require.

XXXXII.
Thou shalt obey the law and commit no treason.




The 42 Principles of Ma'at, the Goddess who personified the ideals of Truth and Righteousness, were known to all the ancient Egyptians. They have been rephrased here in Biblical Commandment form to make them more intelligible and familiar to moderns. In the original form they were preceded with "I have not" as in "I have not stolen." The Egyptians believed that when they died, their souls would be judged by these principles. Moses and the Israelites, who were originally Egyptians, would have been familiar with these principles, but after wandering for forty years they seem to have only remembered 8 of them (those highlighted in orange). Moses added three new non-secular commandments; the one about not honoring the other gods, the honoring of their parents, and the one that included their neighbor's wives and slaves as coveted chattel. The remarkable thing about the principles of Ma'at is not only how much more advanced they are in comparison with the Hebrew Commandments, but how most of them are strikingly relevant to this day.

Various translations of the Declarations of Ma'at exist and they do not all agree in phrasing, order, or even the total number of principles (since some have multiple statements and some are redundant). Versions are available at the following websites, where readers may compare interpretations.

Version 1
http://www.ag-east.org/West/Maat.html

Version 2
http://www.mobeinstitute.com/kmt2002/area.cfm?pi=6&xvc=2

Version 3
http://members.aol.com/TAOofAPU/maat.htm

Version 4
http://www.mich.com/~heru/maat42.html

For comparison, see these various versions of the Ten Commandments of the Hebrews, the Christians, the Catholics, the Greek Orthodox, and the Moslems. It is most curious to observe the convoluted interpretations of these otherwise clearly stated commandments that those with other agendas or self-interest will often give, as if unlimited exceptions could be construed at will and intent was irrelevant. This interpretive susceptibility alone demonstrates the secular superiority of the Principles of Ma'at.

Version 1
http://www.godstenlaws.com/commandments.htm

Version 2
http://www.holidays.net/shavuot/ten.htm

Version 3
http://www.duhaime.org/tencomm.htm

Version 4
http://www.angelfire.com/ca5/pray/tenc.htm

Version 5
http://www.therain.org/studies/ten.html

Version 6
http://www.themiracleofstjoseph.org/tencmds2.htm

Version 7
http://www.goarch.org/access/orthodoxfaith/commandments.html

Version 8
http://islam-usa.com/e70.htm

Version 9
http://www.ou.org/chagim/shavuot/aseret.htm

 

[nutshell]

The gospel has been on the earth since the time of Adam and Eve. When Moses brought forth the 10 commandments it wasn't like they were the first time God had given these commandements. For example, "Thou shalt not kill," was obviously a commandment because Cain was sent away after he killed Abel. If it had not been a commandment then, it would not have been wrong. Hence, the 42 priniciples you mentioned may have actually been influenced from the commandments that were given to Adam and Eve by God.

 

[flacsmada]

I would say it is much more likely that a lot of other religions borrowed from christianity like the ancient egyptions and islamic faith. Which has %70 of the same "values" as christianity. I attribute this to Paul the Apostle converting the whole known islamic world around 100 A.D. They later probably saw what this had to offer and came up with there own system they could call their own. In my opinion from the research I have come across

 

[Valjean]

How would the ancient Egyptions have borrowed from a then non-existant religion, flacsmada? Were their seers that good?

By "islamic world" I assume you mean a few Arab regions. I doubt if there was a very large Christian community in Mecca by Muhammad's time.

The Ten Commandments were compilation of obvious rules designed to address issues then troubling a certain tribe of ancient Bedouins.

 

[sandy whitelinger]

The best Biblical explaination I've heard for the similarity of religious views is this:

God imparted the truths of His word and message to Adam in the garden. This can be evidenced by Adam's two sons bringing offerings to God. There are other evidences of this. For example find all of the the Biblical truths that were offered in the book of Job.

These truths were passed down through the generations.

At the Tower of Babel, god was miffed that man had not obeyed one of His first commandments: "Be fruitful and multiply and replinish the earth." Man was planning on doing just the opposite. By building the tower he was trying to keep man unified.

God confounded the languages and this caused man to regroup and spread out across the earth. Man also took with him the message that was given in the garden. The message changed gradually but retained much commonality.

This concept was related to me by a missionary from China who, at that time, had found over three hundred references to the Christian message hidden within the characters of the Chinese language.

 

[michel]

The best Biblical explaination I've heard for the similarity of religious views is this:

God imparted the truths of His word and message to Adam in the garden. This can be evidenced by Adam's two sons bringing offerings to God. There are other evidences of this. For example find all of the the Biblical truths that were offered in the book of Job.

These truths were passed down through the generations.

At the Tower of Babel, god was miffed that man had not obeyed one of His first commandments: "Be fruitful and multiply and replinish the earth." Man was planning on doing just the opposite. By building the tower he was trying to keep man unified.

God confounded the languages and this caused man to regroup and spread out across the earth. Man also took with him the message that was given in the garden. The message changed gradually but retained much commonality.

This concept was related to me by a missionary from China who, at that time, had found over three hundred references to the Christian message hidden within the characters of the Chinese language.

Sounds quite feasible; the most coherent of possible explanations for the basic commonality of the main Faiths. But what about all those that do not believe in the ten commandments ?

 

[sandy whitelinger]

Michel, don't believe in the 10 commandments in what way? That they don't exist? That there is no need to follow them? They aren't God-given?

 

[ChrisP]

How would the ancient Egyptions have borrowed from a then non-existant religion, flacsmada? Were their seers that good?

By "islamic world" I assume you mean a few Arab regions. I doubt if there was a very large Christian community in Mecca by Muhammad's time.

The Ten Commandments were compilation of obvious rules designed to address issues then troubling a certain tribe of ancient Bedouins.

I was under the impression that Judaism has been around since Abraham/ the tower of Babel? Isn't that well before the Egyptian civilisation?

 

[Valjean]

I was under the impression that Judaism has been around since Abraham/ the tower of Babel? Isn't that well before the Egyptian civilisation?

I was under the impression that Moses received the commandments after he'd gathered up the Hebrews and fled Egypt.

 

[michel]

Michel, don't believe in the 10 commandments in what way? That they don't exist? That there is no need to follow them? They aren't God-given?

I am talking about various pagan religions, for example - there are many faiths that don't 'buy into' the Bible.

 

[ChrisP]

I was under the impression that Moses received the commandments after he'd gathered up the Hebrews and fled Egypt.

Yes but the Jewish Law has been around much longer than that.

 

[michel]

Moses and the Israelites, who were originally Egyptians, would have been familiar with these principles,

Moses and the Israelites were Hebrews, not Egyptians.

Moses was from the tribe of Levi (Exodus 2:1,10), traced back to Shem, son of Noah.

The Egyptians are from Mizraim (Genesis 10:6), son of Ham, son of Noah.

The Chinese are from the Sinites (Genesis 10:17), traced back to Ham.

The 10 Commands were written by God Himself (Exodus 31:18).

 

[Halcyon]

The ancient egyption civilisation predates all known archelogical evidence of the jewish people by some 3,000 years (from memory).

They existed in a time when all peoples were polytheistic. It wasn't until the pharoah Akhenaten (Amenhotep IV) temporarily abolished the orthodox religion of egypt in favor of a religion of his own creation, centered around the worship of a single sun God known as Aten, that monotheism was born. After his death the original polytheistic religion was reinstated.

Some theorise (including Freud) that Judaism is infact an offshoot of Akhenaten's theosophy. Think about it, Moses was born in egypt, he led his people out of egypt. It seems more logical to me that the Jews originated in egypt at the time of Akhenaten, then later added stories to suggest another 'divine' origin for their peoples.
Before Exodus all we have is a mix of adapted Babylonian myth, originally polytheistic (hence all the references to gods in the plural e.g. the word elohim, 'creating man in our image' etc) and geneology, also probably mythological rather than factual.

Using quotes from the bible to prove events in the bible doesn't work.

 

[Terrywoodenpic]

I am not sure that the round about routes that the comandments might have taken, to come down to us, is important.
They were endorsed by Jesus and his teachings and are accepted by all Christians.
On this occasion I think speculation is unhelpful.

Terry
___________________________-
Amen! Truly I say to you: Gather in my name. I am with you.

 

[Bennettresearch]

Hi flacsmada, good to see you.

I just have to say oops! Seyorni is right in stating the chronolgy of the appearance of moral codes and it is important to know which civilization and moral code came first. There is much evidence to the fact that Judaism borrowed from other cultures. It is even possible that even Abraham didn't come up with the idea of monotheism totally on his own.

CMIYC has a very intersting thread here. Just as the myriad Christian sects put their own take on things into their doctrine, ancient peoples sought to differentiate themselves and identify themselves with their own doctrine and moral code of laws. Therefore, even the Egyptians and Babylonians weren't so far removed from each other that there wasn't some kind of oral code that predated both of them. We only know what has be written down, we don't know for sure what the peoples who interacted with each other followed in the way of a doctrine of sorts or the accepted moral code of these earliest societies.

Where thi Bible is not out of line, is that Moses was a prophet and this is the job of a prophet to define a religion. That which is true, will always be true no matter who said it first. Therefore to "borrow" can be misleading. Moses was stating that which he saw as true according to his relationship with God and passed it down to the Israelites because they needed their own identity. He could not entirely reject everything Egyptian.

My own take is on the modern study of religion, if I disagree with a doctrine or set of laws, there will still be some content that I cannot arbitrarily reject because of the truth of said concept.

 

[Bennettresearch]

Hi Terry,

Jesus did not totally sign on the the laws of Moses. This is why He was so controversial. The Jews would naturally object to Him coming along and amending their faith. This is the core and essence of Christianity. Jesus, as a prophet, would present His new covenant and this would supercede all others. Of course He never really had a chance to do this because He was taken out and we only have testimony of doctrine by people who weren't even among His original apostles.

 

[Scott1]

How can Moses claim to have received his 10 from up above? I thinks they were "borrowed" from another source as were most of christianity's devine claims.

Quite a leap, there CMIYC... the Decalogue contains a privileged expression of the natural law. It is made known to us by divine revelation and by human reason.... what makes you think Moses claimed it as something "new"?

 

[joeboonda]

Sure is a long list of commandments posted at the start! And I couldn't even keep the ten!!! In the Bible, there was a time before the Law (10 commandments) when "man did what was right according to his own eyes" or man-made law. As man had a conscience, and was made in God's image, it is not improbable that man all over the world was able to come up with laws himself before the 'Big Ten'. The Ten Commandments were for a specific people, the Jews, for a specific time, from Moses til Jesus. Jesus calls us to a higher law of LOVE, the JEWISH Christians saw the ressurrection as so significant that they changed their day of worship to Sunday, the other laws still in effect, but to be lived out to a higher degree out of unconditional love. For example, say a man or woman commits adultery, instead of stoning them, the spouse may even FORGIVE them and keep them, although Jesus said you don't HAVE to, you may under the higher law of unconditional love.

 

[nutshell]

How would the ancient Egyptions have borrowed from a then non-existant religion, flacsmada? Were their seers that good?

By "islamic world" I assume you mean a few Arab regions. I doubt if there was a very large Christian community in Mecca by Muhammad's time.

The Ten Commandments were compilation of obvious rules designed to address issues then troubling a certain tribe of ancient Bedouins.

Mecca was the center of trade and commerce in those days and there were well established Christians and Jews in Mecca. Granted, it wasn't their home, but they were definetly there. Muhammad was undoubtedly influenced by what he heard there.

 

[michel]

The ancient egyption civilisation predates all known archelogical evidence of the jewish people by some 3,000 years (from memory).

As I said before, the Egyptians come from Mizraim --- Genesis 10.

The Hebrews come from Abraham --- Genesis 12.

Thus the Egyptians were here before the Hebrews were.

But when they went polytheistic, God in His grace sent Joseph down to Egypt as a witness --- followed by his whole family.

When that didn't work, God defeated the 9 primary [false] Egyptian deities (Exodus 12:12).

And when that didn't work --- He slew all the firstborn of Egypt --- including the Hebrews --- who refused to put the blood of a lamb on their doorposts.

I think by then I would have gotten the picture and gone monotheistic too.

Wouldn't you have?

It seems more logical to me that the Jews originated in egypt at the time of Akhenaten, then later added stories to suggest another 'divine' origin for their peoples.

Using quotes from the bible to prove events in the bible doesn't work.

I guess some people just don't learn.

They that don't know the past are bound to repeat it!