The Asininity of "Gun-Free" Zones

[Revoltingest]

I got your point: counterfactuals are hard to figure out. You think that this means the preventative effect of armed citizens might be understated.

I was getting at a related point: if we can infer that someone who's armed in a public place has bad intent, we have more opportunity to prevent whatever he's planning to do than if we give him a free pass until he starts shooting.

Personally, I think more murders would be prevented if *anyone* carrying an AR-15 on a college campus is detained and has his gun taken away than by finding out whether he's planning to do a Charles Whitman impression by waiting to see if he actually does it.

If a location requires that everyone be unarmed, do you think they've an obligation to
ensure that everyone actually is, & that some protection is offered in case an offender attacks?

The number is hotly disputed (a full order of magnitude), but Gary Kleck has found enuf instances
of guns used in self to point towards their efficacy. Even discounting his findings by a factor of 100,
the self defense instances outnumber the number of deaths due to murder (by gun).
Guns and Self-Defense by Gary Kleck, Ph.D.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

If a location requires that everyone be unarmed, do you think they've an obligation to
ensure that everyone actually is, & that some protection is offered in case an offender attacks?

If nobody's forced to be there, then they have no obligation. If you feel that a location's security measures don't meet your standards, don't go there.

The number is hotly disputed (a full order of magnitude), but Gary Kleck has found enuf instances
of guns used in self to point towards their efficacy. Even discounting his findings by a factor of 100,
the self defense instances outnumber the number of deaths due to murder (by gun).
Guns and Self-Defense by Gary Kleck, Ph.D.

This self-reported fluff again?

 

[Revoltingest]

As do I.
Thus the reason I carry a Public Defender.

He looks inconveniently large.

Again I agree.
There are some people who simply do not have the discipline/mental state for carrying a fire arm.

Including one cop I know.

Once more I am in agreement.
I do not like the idea of just anyone carrying a firearm.
I disagree with states like Indiana who will give a handgun license to anyone of age who can pay for it and pass a background check.

It's too big a responsibility to eschew the minor inconvenience of a few weeks of training.

 

[Revoltingest]

I know you do and I agree.

What!
We can't have that here.
At least insult me!

 

[Revoltingest]

That beggars the question, how many violent perps have been shot except by police.
The background of these cases are always thoroughly investigated for motive, and for criminal or terrorist links. If such potential mass killing cases existed, they would be public knowledge by now.

There does not seem to be a single case to even establish any sort of statistic.

I do know a few people who have used guns in self defense.
It happens a lot....more often than people die from mass killings (in Americastan).

 

[McBell]

He looks inconveniently large.

Mine is quite a bit smaller...

Including one cop I know.

It matters not ones profession.
Though in this case it could be trouble.

It's too big a responsibility to eschew the minor inconvenience of a few weeks of training.

Few weeks?
Hells bells, some states only require you watch a video online....
Some states do not require any "training" what so ever.

 

[Revoltingest]

If nobody's forced to be there, then they have no obligation. If you feel that a location's security measures don't meet your standards, don't go there.

That poses problems for places where avoidance is difficult, eg, schools, hospitals

This self-reported fluff again?

You have better fluff from which to judge?

 

[Revoltingest]

Mine is quite a bit smaller...

That's what Skwim said.

Few weeks?
Hells bells, some states only require you watch a video online....
Some states do not require any "training" what so ever.

I'm not just pedantic....I'm pretty demanding about some things.
If some can't devote that much time to learning to use a deadly weapon,
then they should look to tasers or pepper spray. Not bad options.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

That poses problems for places where avoidance is difficult, eg, schools, hospitals

Institutions that do take security matters seriously.

You have better fluff from which to judge?

I could probably come up with better stats than that garbage from Kleck, though I don't have time right now.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

I do know a few people who have used guns in self defense.
It happens a lot....more often than people die from mass killings (in Americastan).

Gun death in the US is mostly a matter of suicide, not mass killings.

 

[Revoltingest]

Institutions that do take security matters seriously.

What.....you're a stand up comedian now?
I could bring a concealed handgun into any school or hospital here.

I could probably come up with better stats than that garbage from Kleck, though I don't have time right now.

You offer an epithet instead of evidence?
Oh, that won't do.
If you lack time for the latter, you should avoid the former.

 

[Revoltingest]

Gun death in the US is mostly a matter of suicide, not mass killings.

This doesn't really address what I said.
Btw, I say we have a right to suicide.

 

[Neo Deist]

I say we all just sue China for all of the gun violence. They invented gun powder after all.

 

[Revoltingest]

I say we all just sue China for all of the gun violence. They invented gun powder after all.

That would only apply to black power weapons.
Modern guns use smokeless powder, so we should sue those cheese eating surrender monkeys!.
Paul Marie Eugène Vieille - Wikipedia

 

[Akivah]

Why is it that right-leaning politicians pass laws to allow guns in public places-- except where they work?

Our state government is in process to fix this. The Florida Republicans just filed legislation to allow guns at college campuses and legislative meetings. However, the proposed legislation is leaving in place bans on guns at bars, football stadiums, basketball arenas, courtrooms, Highway Patrol stations, polling places, and elementary schools.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

What.....you're a stand up comedian now?
I could bring a concealed handgun into any school or hospital here.

I thought you claimed to be one of those law-abiding gun owners, no?

 

[McBell]

I thought you claimed to be one of those law-abiding gun owners, no?

He said "could"....

 

[Neo Deist]

That would only apply to black power weapons.
Modern guns use smokeless powder, so we should sue those cheese eating surrender monkeys!.
Paul Marie Eugène Vieille - Wikipedia

I know but...they were the catalyst. Gotta point the finger somewhere other than the criminals that pull the trigger.

 

[omega2xx]

There were more than two choices. I voted third party.

That surprises me for anyone who agrees with elimination gun free zones.

 

[Skwim]

I missed that.
Pretty good!
But your obsession means....

What's Jesus doing looking a people's penises? Does he hav . . . . . . . . .OMG! . . . . . . . . . . . I'd always wondered why he hung around with so many men.


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