The evolution of sunrises?

[Sunstone]

Is there an evolutionary reason why sunrises and sunsets are beautiful to us? That is, it might seem on the face of it that the beauty of sunrises and sunsets serves no evolutionary purpose whatsoever. But is that the case? What do you think?

To enlarge on this question: What is the evolutionary purpose of our sense of beauty?

 

[fromthe heart]

Is there an evolutionary reason why sunrises and sunsets are beautiful to us? That is, it might seem on the face of it that the beauty of sunrises and sunsets serves no evolutionary purpose whatsoever. But is that the case? What do you think?

To enlarge on this question: What is the evolutionary purpose of our sense of beauty?

Personally to me it is to marvel at the beauty God has given us to brighten our lives. If you look around at all that is beautiful and go AAhhhh then it was put there for your enjoyment by God to emplify the spirit that is God.

 

[michel]

Hi Sunstone;
Quote:-[Is there an evolutionary reason why sunrises and sunsets are beautiful to us? That is, it might seem on the face of it that the beauty of sunrises and sunsets serves no evolutionary purpose whatsoever. But is that the case? What do you think?

To enlarge on this question: What is the evolutionary purpose of our sense of beauty?]
'Beauty is in the eye of the beholder'; quite why our visual senses are satiated by the sight of sunrises and sunsets is an interesting question - I'm not sure I know the answer to that. Why should the sight of the sun, appearing over the horizon bit by bit, be so pleasurable? - Perhaps it is tied in to our 'body clocks'; the sun representing growth. Prhaps that is why we enjoy sunsets; again, our bodies need rest, and I suppose that nature is somehow geared to that.

The evolutionary purpose is obvious; growth and recuperation. The whole of life depends on the cycle of growth followed by recuperation.I remember once reading that that is why we have two nostrils, eyes, and ears - so that one is working at full power, whilst the other is 'rebuilding' its strengnth. Without the sun no plant could produce chlorophyl, and the whole life circle our world would cease; there would be no oxygen fo us to breathe, for one.

The interesting fact that emerges from your question is what happens at the poles (Where there is sunshine for six months, and then light for six months) - I have never considered that, Quite a thought................

 

[painted wolf]

Scientifically I would have to say that our appeciation of non-human beauty is just a natural part of our being able to empathise with others. It is part of our ability to think absractly.
*added* I also should add that as diurnal animals we rely on the sun for to see. When the sun rises in the morning it drives away darkness and thus a threat. We couldn't see the preditors that hunt in the dark. **

Otherwise, I always like the Eastern Nations explanation. The sun is reminding us to be thankfull that it is there. The sun likes to be appeciated for its work too.

wa:do

 

[Pah]

Is there an evolutionary reason why sunrises and sunsets are beautiful to us? That is, it might seem on the face of it that the beauty of sunrises and sunsets serves no evolutionary purpose whatsoever. But is that the case? What do you think?

To enlarge on this question: What is the evolutionary purpose of our sense of beauty?

I don't think beauty has anything to do with evolution. We learn the "beauty meme" in childhood from parents and refine it as we grow.

 

[TheTrendyCynic]

The colors of a sunrise are vibrant, and there could be an evolutionary explanation as to why we find vibrant colors appealing -- they represent life in the form of ripened food, health and warmth in the form of fire. Vibrancy is a strength of color, and that strength is sympathetic to whatever reason we evolved color vision in the first place: Animals respond to vibrant colors as well; male birds are brightly colored to attract mates, bees flock to bright flowers for pollination, bulls respond to bright red by charging. The sunrise, such a sweeping exhibit of colors at their most vibrant, is representative of all of those things that, instictually, we have evolved to prize.

We learn the "beauty meme" in childhood from parents and refine it as we grow.

I agree with you, but I think there is more to it. The beauty meme is indeed learned, but I think it is a refinement of an evolutionary appreciation of bright colors into an emotional response, as opposed to the sole source of that emotion.

 

[Pah]

...
I agree with you, but I think there is more to it. The beauty meme is indeed learned, but I think it is a refinement of an evolutionary appreciation of bright colors into an emotional response, as opposed to the sole source of that emotion.

Many species can not even see color - one is blind. Many species get "horny" because of smell not sight. To say we, as a species, select for beauty, you would have to find that in species close to to us. Is that present in the apes?

 

[Yerda]

To say we, as a species, select for beauty, you would have to find that in species close to to us. Is that present in the apes?

There is the idea that humans lost their body hair as a means of sexual selection and not chasing down animals. This sounds like selecting for beauty.

 

[goodjewishboy]

About four years ago I was backpacking in the mountains of Whyoming, our group woke up at 4:30 in the morning to ascend a nearby peak. We reached the top to witness the most beautiful sunrise I've ever seen. They don't call that part of the world 'big sky country' for nothing.

 

[Pah]

There is the idea that humans lost their body hair as a means of sexual selection and not chasing down animals. This sounds like selecting for beauty.

I wonder why mink and sable and fox are so popular as coats and bedspreads (if you can afford them and in spite of PETA).

 

[painted wolf]

Pah- many other primates use color as part of sexual display. Just look at the Mandrill for instance. Also when chimp girls are 'in heat' they develop bright red swolen genitals. The closer she is to being fertile the redder she gets. Many of the primates are very color aware.

Few animals are truely 'color blind' most do have less color range than humans most in favor of better night vision. Some however (birds in particualr) can see colors we can't into the ultravolet and infrared spectrum.

Our relyance on color vision is natually going to be part of our sexuality. That is why red lipstick has been a favorite since the days of Anchient Egypt. And why blushing is part of non-verbal communication.
To a degree I agree with the loss of hair being tied in with sexual selection, especally considering the sexual dimorphism in body hair between males and females. And the great lengths women go to, to atifically rid themselves of more. I don't think its the only reason but certenly part of it.

wa:do

 

[kbc_1963]

A terribly big question should be asked in this thread. how do any of the instinctual properties found in living things transfer from parent to child.
Do we assume that as life evolved that the things that the parent learned during its life, like knowing the sound of a specific enemy and the reaction to hide are transfered to subsequent generations.
or
Do we assume that an Intelligent Designer provided unchanging preprogramming specific for each living thing.
what proof do we have for either arguement? If we can prove that one arguement is more probable according to evidence then it may answer the original question a little easier.
Personally I feel that appreciation of beauty is only possible for intelligence and if you see things in nature that seem to be more beautiful than necsssity dictates according to the randomness of nature then it may be argued that the beauty we see was the result of intelligent forethought and the ability to understand the concept of beauty the result of being created in the image of an intelligent being.

 

[Pah]

A terribly big question should be asked in this thread. how do any of the instinctual properties found in living things transfer from parent to child.
Do we assume that as life evolved that the things that the parent learned during its life, like knowing the sound of a specific enemy and the reaction to hide are transfered to subsequent generations.
or
Do we assume that an Intelligent Designer provided unchanging preprogramming specific for each living thing.
what proof do we have for either arguement? If we can prove that one arguement is more probable according to evidence then it may answer the original question a little easier.
Personally I feel that appreciation of beauty is only possible for intelligence and if you see things in nature that seem to be more beautiful than necsssity dictates according to the randomness of nature then it may be argued that the beauty we see was the result of intelligent forethought and the ability to understand the concept of beauty the result of being created in the image of an intelligent being.

And Satan taught us "ugly"????

 

[Yerda]

I wonder why mink and sable and fox are so popular as coats and bedspreads (if you can afford them and in spite of PETA).

Although I see you point, what people do with their coats and bedspreads and what people do with their lovers are completely different (or at least I hope so).

I admit that animals etc are aesthetically pleasing, but human beauty can be sexually attractive.

How many foxes have you slept with for instance?

 

[Pah]

...
How many foxes have you slept with for instance?

There were probably more than a dozen, each dead, and sown together into a long jacket. We (the pre-Gail-wife and I) used the jacket as a bedspread for the sensuality of the soft fur against our skin.

If you must know.

But the point being that some humans get turned on by body hair

 

[painted wolf]

I think that the use of fur from other animals is a part of pair bonding as well as survival. If a male wanted to prove that he was a good provider than what better way than the gift of a 'fur coat'. Fur coats made from large numbers of small soft animals imply (in the old days) that the male was a good hunter (its tough to catch enough little critters quickly ) or if the coat is of one large animal with good fur like a bear it proves that they are brave and strong.
The gift of a fur coat is also practical, it will keep you warm in colder environments thus increasing your survival ability.
In todays world a fur coat implys you will be a good provider as they are not cheap and only someone who has a very successful source of money can afford one.
It is a part of pair bonding and frankly thus a part of human sexuality.

The loss of hair on humans in a sexual context also allows the prospective mates to see what sort of conditon thier choises are in, too skiny, too injured, muscle mass and so on. Eaven in the hairiest of people it isn't enough to completly obscure the human form.

and considering how varied the human idea of beauty is it suggests to me that it is an adaptive concept. Beauty varies wildly from one culture to another with little regard for a standard.

wa:do

 

[michel]

Is there an evolutionary reason why sunrises and sunsets are beautiful to us? That is, it might seem on the face of it that the beauty of sunrises and sunsets serves no evolutionary purpose whatsoever. But is that the case? What do you think?

To enlarge on this question: What is the evolutionary purpose of our sense of beauty?

Hi Sunstone,
I found the following very interesting , lending a new 'slant' on some of the debating that has arisen on 'the sense of beauty' aspect of your last question

http://home.t-online.de/home/HelmutWalther/schoenes_e.htm:)